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Why does ATS limit the free speech for anonymous users?

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posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 07:55 PM
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Are their views suppressed because they aren't members, or, is it for some other reason, and their views aren't really suppressed?




posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 07:57 PM
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reply to post by Frankidealist35
 


There views aren't suppressed. What do you mean, because they have to be cleared before they get posted? That is just a procedure to weed out the meaningless posts that do not contribute to the topic in the thread. Also it weeds out anon trolls, spammers, ect.

[edit on 3-11-2008 by schism85]



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 07:59 PM
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Annon posters are held to the same Terms and Conditions as everybody else here at ATS. Posts that are off topic, violate the terms and conditions of the site etc. are killed by staff and do not appear. Many are simply one liners or trolling and have no place in the threads.

That being said I have seen some fantastic annon posts since the program was restarted and we have gained many solid members who for whatever reason wanted to become comfortable with ATS before joining.

Sometimes the staff is busy with other board issues and we don't get to the annon posts as quickly as we would like. Others as I mentined above are simply not suited This is one such example I just killed

all i got to say is true but tha (Insert racial epithet) the devil

Edit and bold is mine. This would get a member a warn but an anon post will just get killed


[edit on 11/3/08 by FredT]



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 08:01 PM
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It is not just anonymous users. For the last few years, ATS has become more and more politically correct. You used to be able to find fringe things like be.ing videos, Hangings etc... real rough stuff. They used to allow a lot more freedom in posting etc... but that all changed around the time Saddam was hung. I am not sure why. Maybe they were bought out or had some heavy investors start changing the rules. Sadly, I have never found a sight to replace the old ATS so this is the next best thing
.

The site is censored much tighter than it used to be.



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 08:12 PM
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reply to post by Xeven
 


I have a feeling that's because there are a lot more people, and ATS tends to spread out more and more, so they trended towards being a family friendly sort of website, mainly because controlling the age of the population is way too rough.

While a child may hear it in the halls of their school, it's still not good to come on and see that on a website where it CAN be controlled. I think that's the goal here, and I can understand that to a very peaked degree.

On the topic of anon users being censored, I've never seen that situation arise, the anonymous poster program (IMO is ballox, and annoying), is not held to additional rules that a normal ATS user isn't.



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 08:26 PM
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reply to post by Xeven
 





You used to be able to find fringe things like be.ing videos, Hangings etc... real rough stuff.


Wow...

That is quite a change if this is the case...I've seen enough death on the web to "not" be interested in the videos, but I definitely am interested in the change in policy....

But, it maybe obvious than that....I'm sure this place has turned into a cash cow (chad w just did a thread on the worth), and anyone with common sense would protect the cow...

Have they been deleted from the archives as well...?





content edit!

[edit on 11/3/2008 by chapter29]



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 08:58 PM
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Anon ATS Posts are vetted first - as others have said.

Censoring happens.

Trust me - if you got to read some of the Anon ATS Posts we review you'd see that allowing every Anon ATS Post through the cattle-gates may well not be a spectacular idea.

As you can imagine there are those in cyber-space who quite like the perceived *freedom* to abuse people with Anonimity and without repercussion.

The benefit though of reviewing Anon ATS Posts is that its certainly taught me some new swear words and inventive ways of insulting people...


So I'm all for being a gatekeeper of 'Freedom of Speech' for Anon ATS when it means 'Freedom from ATS Members Being Abused and General Bollocks'



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 09:08 PM
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I've done some testing of this. I only normally post as anonymous because I don't believe in the 'name' system. This is because people build 'reputations', some good, some bad, but I think that every post should be judged on it's merits, and who the author is should have no bearing.

Anyway, I've posted a number of things as Anonymous that never made it through to the board. After a few times of this happening, I signed up for a test account and posted the comment that way instead. The comment was not removed, it gained 'stars' from other users, and no warning on that account was issued. I strongly believe those comments that were denied were not trolling, or breaches of the T&C.

Therefore I don't really believe that all denied posts are due to trolling or other such behaviour. I think there is some gate-keeping going on. This could be unintentional perhaps, If I were to post a comment critical of, for example, Christianity, and the moderator/admin who has to choose if that comment should be passed is a Christian, he has a built in bias that may stop a neutral judgement being made.

Of course I understand ATS's difficulty here. If they just allow all Anonymous posts immediately, it is very likely they will be flooded with spam, or even more offensive content. The method they have chosen, to check all messages is of course prone to human faults. It's a hard choice to make.



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 09:30 PM
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reply to post by Anonymous ATS
 


Cheers for your input. Seriously. I hit the 'Make Live' button on your reply.


I agree with much of what you have said. Ultimately its humans - and all our inherent fallibility that comes with that - that clicks the buttons at the end of the day.

Another issue - as has been highlighted in a number of other similar threads - is the sheer volume of Anon Posts we receive daily. unfortunately unless Staff keep on top of them in a regimented fashion/process then there can be pages/clusters of Anon Posts in the Anon Post Log (currently in excess of 2000 pages long) visible to Staff that may go unactioned. Effectively they get lost in the torrent that happens sometimes.

I know that Staff have had some discussions around different ways of possibly addressing these issues of Anon Posts floating around unactioned for so long and/or simply being lost in the fast moving current of the Anon Post Log river.

I hope we can be more expedient in actioning Anon Posts...however again, we can but try and certainly it won't be fool-proof or without fault.

Apologies that your input hasn't made it through previously.



Peace.



posted on Nov, 4 2008 @ 05:46 PM
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ATS is not a perfect system

The Annon posts are checked before being public, and this makes sense...


There is no doubt that back in the old days of ATS, we were more free to post what we want, and not worry about being Politicaly Correct...


But this is just ATS moving with the times... at least thats what i hope...


The sad fact of it is that Mods have power here, and for the most part, their power is unchecked...

Most of the mods are do a better job then any of us can ask of them. but, undoubtably, some of them allow thier emotions to interfear with thier duties...

It happens... it shouldn't, but it does...


After this Election Season, i can only hope that ATS returns to its OLDER roots, its roots that promate FREE thought... A place that embraces freedom of speech...

But i wouldn't hold my breath...

The United States is moving away from the founding principles of this nation, and ATS is not immune from this transformation.

Over the years of my time on ATS, my passion for posting the unfiltered truth has not changed, but, now, more of my posts disapear...

I'll say it again, i just hope, that starting Nov. 5th, this site moves back towards how it was.

A place where EVERY topic is fair game, where no idea is too crazy or strange, where NO topic is taboo...

And, i must mention this again, the VAST majority of the mods on ATS do thier job FLAWLESSLY, but, they are human, and the human is an emotional animal...

So, i am apreciative that you have put this issue forward, but your title should be diffrent... It would be more accurate if you left off the last three words.

Why does ATS limit Free Speech

That would be more appropite.



posted on Nov, 4 2008 @ 06:16 PM
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Let me just reemphasize that it can get overwhelming to try to maintain some semblance of order during this election period, as well as review the virtual torrent of Anonymous posts that come in.

We have to prioritize - is it more important to take care of the concerns of the registered members than it is to wade through the flood of Anonymous posts? I hope you know the answer there. Sometimes we find gaps in the Anonymous thread where a page or two just got skipped. Nothing but an oversight and in fact I made some Anon posts from as far back as 10/20 live today.

The Anonymous posting is addressed as quickly as it can be. Hopefully, if someone really wants to ensure their posts make it to the board, they'll register an account.

Sometimes Anonymous posts will include personal info which makes them not appropriate. Sometimes they have dead links. A YouTube link that goes nowhere isn't going to be made live. Someone might make a post that's 99% OK, but will throw in a censored word or a string of censor circumvention.

Sometimes I'll make a post live, and then edit it to make it T&C colmpliant, but not often. And sometimes a post that could be sanitized for approval will be in a forum where I have no edit power, so I skip it. Which makes it just that much more likely it'll get missed.

My observation has been that many of the Anonymous posters haven't had a passing glance at the T&C, which isn't surprising. But the blatant T&C violations, posts filled with nothing but emoticons, posts ranting in all caps, posts with personal info, posts full of text shorthand, aren't going to be made live, at least by me.

Too much info, probably, but that's the deal.

Free speech? No it isn't. It has to be T&C compliant and on topic. You either have free speech, which quickly devolves into white noise chaos, or some rules. There's no such thing as limited free speech. It's either free, or it isn't. If you think you can find a place with "free speech" that has anything of value with an opportunity for your ideas to be seen and heard, let me know. Because it'll be quickly overrun by the knuckle.s.

This is not Nam, Smoky. There are rules. (Big Lebowski reference).



posted on Nov, 4 2008 @ 06:26 PM
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Mate, I was mucking around with that photo of George W Bush and what quote can you do? So I went for a blow** one, got that barred, but then interestingly went for an Iraq torture (no profanaties) and yup, I lost 500 points for that. I expect 500 points lost for this coz the mods don't accept that we can all do better with torture. There's a limit on all of us.



posted on Nov, 4 2008 @ 08:13 PM
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reply to post by redled
 


If you expect a point-loss, why post it?

Seems a bit passive-aggressive to me...


I expect poking a fork into my wall socket will get me shocked...so I'm not about to go poking a fork into it...and if I do, I'm not about to then exclaim "Naughty wall socket - you zapped me!"



posted on Nov, 4 2008 @ 11:34 PM
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reply to post by Frankidealist35
 


No views are suppressed here. Don't confuse criticism for suppression. Suppression means that your posts would be immediately deleted if it wasn't supported by the prevalent power structure and its organization. What you probably have encountered, numerous times it seems, is something called skepticism. It is an entirely warranted approach to meeting a claim that seems to be unsubstantiated by any proof. If providing proof is not physically possible (as is the nature and basis of many serious and thoughtful posts on ATS) then the topic poster must at least attempt to to mine some shred of global significance. ATS isn't a place to post your Saturday morning whims, or day dreamed fantasies. It's certainly a place to explore alternative subjects, but at what expense? Members of this forum are aware of the maxim, Deny Ignorance, and will pursue that goal to the greatest extent. I only hope you have the guts to stand by your convictions, else the very foundation of ATS should fall apart. If you don't have people that can at least attempt at backing up their conspiracies, then as ATS posters become inexorably more powerful as writers and scrutinizers, the number of conspiracies on this site will approach none. Trust me, people aren't out to get you. They are just trying to maintain the validity of this site as best they can.

To address the major issue of this thread, however; it should be noted: one's freedom to speech is not equatable to a freedom from foresight. There is always a social consequence to whatever it is you say. You can't expect people to simply hear you out all the way through. You will inevitably be interrupted, and if that interruption is warranted, then you must back up your claims, lest you be held to constant ridicule. Freedom of speech doesn't mean that everyone should respect what it is you say, simply that you shouldn't be persecuted for anything you say, no matter how ignorant or even treasonous it may seem.


[edit on 4-11-2008 by cognoscente]



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 08:36 AM
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Question about the annonymous posters, do the posts move to the end of the thread once they get approved or do they stay where originally posted. I have noticed some posts that arent approved yet and not sure I or others will go back and read them, seems unfair. If it is moved to the end they will be read although perhaps not near the other posts they may be refering too.. Hope this makes sense.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 08:47 AM
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anonymous posting is for child porn peddlers.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 12:58 PM
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Originally posted by Lysergic
anonymous posting is for child porn peddlers.


What the hell? I hope that was a bad attempt at humor - although I see NOTHING funny about your post, if it wasn't an attempt at humor then....WHAT THE HELL?

You do know some members, mods and probably some of the 3 amigos will post 'anon' to simply not have their post tagged with their reputation.

Others use it to get comfortable with the posting process.

Dorian Soran



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 02:11 PM
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reply to post by Blogstalker
 


I assume they stay in the same place, since from what I know, the post dateline (the column in the database that says how old the post is) doesn't change, and since viewthread.php requests the posts to be ordered by that column, it'd show up in the same place as if it was posted in that timeframe. Think of it like an excel spreadsheet.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 02:22 PM
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Originally posted by Dorian Soran

Originally posted by Lysergic
anonymous posting is for child porn peddlers.


What the hell? I hope that was a bad attempt at humor - although I see NOTHING funny about your post, if it wasn't an attempt at humor then....WHAT THE HELL?

You do know some members, mods and probably some of the 3 amigos will post 'anon' to simply not have their post tagged with their reputation.

Others use it to get comfortable with the posting process.

Dorian Soran


Oh wait.

I meant to reply as anonymous.



posted on Nov, 5 2008 @ 02:24 PM
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Thanks for the answer, makes sense. Too bad I forget to go back and see what they have to say. And in fast moving threads I am sure I am not the only one.



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