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Is this what Obama supporters think?

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posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 04:52 PM
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Has anyone here remotely considered instead of a stereotypical association of welfare that this individual might just be referring to Obama's proposed tax breaks for the middle class, for those earning less than $250K per year which would result in providing additional after tax income ???
Additional income to PAY for gas for her car and to PAY for her mortgage and not necessarily from welfare ?

The ignorant stereotyping and generalizations often times found here on ATS unfortunately are narrow minded and pathetic.




posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 04:59 PM
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Originally posted by chickenshoes
You could just as easily assume she meant that under Obama, the middle class will get tax breaks,
Please define Obama's middle class.

the price of gas will be more reasonable,

Hardly, quite the opposite actually. He wants to winfall tax the oil companies which in turn will turn around and charge the consumer for it.
He also will not change the status quo on offshore drilling or Anwar.


and he will do something about the mortgage crisis,
thereby taking away from the worry of wondering where we're all [edit-she's] going to get the money to pay our [edit-her] bills.

Do you know exactly what this "something" is? is he going to summon his messiah powers and fix the crisis? What can he do that hasn't been done already?

Obama is the wrong candidate at this time. Maybe in four years when he has more experience and things have stabilized a little.
Look I can see why you are emotionally attached to him, he is really likable but he is not the right leader we need at this time.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:01 PM
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reply to post by nh_ee
 

$250k
$200k
$150k
$120k
?
?
?



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:02 PM
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reply to post by deathhasnosound
 


I wasn't arguing about Obama's policies, only what some of you are assuming the woman in the OP was trying to say.

She said nothing about welfare.


[edit on 11/2/2008 by chickenshoes]



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:04 PM
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Originally posted by chickenshoes
reply to post by ATS4dummies
 


Ok, where does she say anything about getting welfare?


CS, if you get money you didn't earn, as in - produce something of value in exchange, from a government, is that welfare?

Every time someone gets a check they did not contribute the the GDP for, is that welfare?

To conservatives, it is.

BUT there is one important point: if they get it by having the government TAKE it from someone else, it is welfare.

If they are truly in need, and the more productive members of society decide to FREELY give it to the needy, it is called charity.

We need 10 times less welfare in this country, and only 2 times more charity, so we don't have to give the other 8/10ths of charity to unproductive government "re-distributors"


[edit on 2-11-2008 by ATS4dummies]

[edit on 2-11-2008 by ATS4dummies]



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:06 PM
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reply to post by ATS4dummies
 


So are you saying that if the price of gas went down, groceries were more affordable, and something was done about the economy, that this is tantamount to welfare?



Where did she say anything about getting a check?

[edit on 11/2/2008 by chickenshoes]



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:08 PM
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Originally posted by chickenshoes
reply to post by deathhasnosound
 


I wasn't arguing about Obama's policies, only what some of you are assuming the woman in the OP was trying to say.

She said nothing about welfare.


[edit on 11/2/2008 by chickenshoes]

Well, I am curious though as to why you think he is able to fix all these problems. This lady in the video tought the same thing.
Or are you simply voting for him because it will be a history making moment?



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by chickenshoes
So are you saying that if the price of gas went down, groceries were more affordable, and something was done about the economy, that this is tantamount to welfare?
[edit on 11/2/2008 by chickenshoes]

If the price of gas is too high:
1) remove the government taxes on gasoline
2) create a free market competitive environment to encourage competition.

If the price of groceries are too high:
1) remove the government taxes on gasoline
2) create a free market competitive environment to encourage competition.

The answer to price inequity is NOT more government, it is LESS government and more competition.

Obama is talking about MORE government and not speaking about competition. That is why the democratic party gets no respect from conservatives.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:17 PM
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reply to post by chickenshoes
 


How is he going to do this? If he pushes his windfall profits tax through, the oil companies will pass that on to the consumers by raising gas prices. If gas prices are higher, it costs more to get items to the store, so the prices for food goes up. As for the mortgage crisis....I can't see anything being done to fix that. It needs to hit bottom, the bubble needs to burst, and we are just going to have to start over.

This man, if elected, will no more be able to wave a magic wand and fix things than you or I could.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:26 PM
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Originally posted by deathhasnosound

Originally posted by chickenshoes
reply to post by deathhasnosound
 


I wasn't arguing about Obama's policies, only what some of you are assuming the woman in the OP was trying to say.

She said nothing about welfare.


[edit on 11/2/2008 by chickenshoes]

Well, I am curious though as to why you think he is able to fix all these problems. This lady in the video tought the same thing.
Or are you simply voting for him because it will be a history making moment?


When did I say I was voting for him? When did I say he is able to fix all these problems?

Why are you assuming anything about what she said? She didn't say alot, but she sure didn't say anything about welfare, only that if he's elected, she never thought it would happen, she believes she won't have to worry about gas and her mortgage, and that if she helps Obama, he will help her.


"I never thought this day would happen"
"I won't have to worry about putting gas in my car"
"I won't have to worry about paying my mortgage"
"If I help him he's gonna help me"


My point is that you could make several different assumptions about what she meant, it wouldn't necessarily be correct.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:31 PM
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Originally posted by ATS4dummies

Originally posted by chickenshoes
reply to post by ATS4dummies
 


Ok, where does she say anything about getting welfare?


CS, if you get money you didn't earn, as in - produce something of value in exchange, from a government, is that welfare?

Every time someone gets a check they did not contribute the the GDP for, is that welfare?

To conservatives, it is.

BUT there is one important point: if they get it by having the government TAKE it from someone else, it is welfare.

If they are truly in need, and the more productive members of society decide to FREELY give it to the needy, it is called charity.

We need 10 times less welfare in this country, and only 2 times more charity, so we don't have to give the other 8/10ths of charity to unproductive government "re-distributors"


[edit on 2-11-2008 by ATS4dummies]


I'm not arguing about Obama's policies. I am arguing with what most seem to assume the woman in the video meant as compared to what she actually said.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:42 PM
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Originally posted by skeptic1
reply to post by chickenshoes
 


How is he going to do this? If he pushes his windfall profits tax through, the oil companies will pass that on to the consumers by raising gas prices. If gas prices are higher, it costs more to get items to the store, so the prices for food goes up. As for the mortgage crisis....I can't see anything being done to fix that. It needs to hit bottom, the bubble needs to burst, and we are just going to have to start over.

This man, if elected, will no more be able to wave a magic wand and fix things than you or I could.


I never said he was going to fix all of that. What I have been arguing is what everyone has been assuming about what was meant by the woman in the video the OP posted.

[edit on 11/2/2008 by chickenshoes]



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:43 PM
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reply to post by chickenshoes
 


I know that. What exactly do you think she meant? You've been saying all the stuff about Obama getting elected and prices going down and his fixing the mortgage mess.

I simply pointed out that with his stances on these issues, he isn't going to be able to do anything....anymore than you or I could.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 05:55 PM
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Originally posted by skeptic1
reply to post by chickenshoes
 


I know that. What exactly do you think she meant? You've been saying all the stuff about Obama getting elected and prices going down and his fixing the mortgage mess.

I simply pointed out that with his stances on these issues, he isn't going to be able to do anything....anymore than you or I could.


Well, if you'd read from the first page of the thread, you'd have known that all I have ever been arguing about is the assumptions people have made about what the woman meant by what she said in the video.

The only reason I said any of the things I did about Obama was to point out that you could just as easily assume that she thinks that Obama is going to fix these problems as you could assume that she thinks he is going to send her a welfare check. It's ludicrous, and it shows people for what they really are.

I make no claims here about what Obama promises or doesn't. I know what I saw in the video, and I think that assumptions[edit-about what she meant] are neither correct nor fair.

[edit on 11/2/2008 by chickenshoes]



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 06:09 PM
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Taking the average person on either side, i.e. Taking people who

A: Aren't normally politically active

B: Are only active because the last 8 years has been a straight down hill run

C: Are active politically only because of a landmark moment in politics: That has little to do with politics

D: Simply don't know anything on either end other than what they are told


And holding these people up for inspection and trying to make them look bad

Is Pathetic, whichever side is doing it.



With that said:

I'll be hiring 2 less people this year given Obamas tax policies

He's economics are flawed in that he is unrealistic in regards to where the wealth line really is

The upper middle class and small business is where most new jobs and new money is created

Not via the mega wealthy

and not via the poor and lower middle class




America:

Lower Class 12% 18,000 or less house hold income yearly

Working Class 42% 35,000 or less

Lower Middle Class 31% 75,000 or less

Upper Middle Class 10% 75,000-350,000

Rich 5% Over 350,000

Wealthy 1% Over 1,000,000




I would like to again Highlight

Upper MIDDLE CLASS

Part of that MIDDLE CLASS, the part that can afford to go into business for themselves the part that is in a place I'd like to call Break Away


Obamas Plan is to END Once and for all the Middle Class by assigning wealth at a range of 150-250 G


People are Correct

and suffering

and need a break

and really want and deserve a TAX CUT

The RICH will remain unaffected by the Tax cut

This is TRUE

Upper Middle class however.... to Rich becomes almost UNATAINABLE

Obama will Cement the wealthy in place

and to, believe a few hundred or even a grand or so in savings when your under 75 G

is going to be worth

Not being able to bridge the GAP between RICH and poor

Because Upper Middle Class is assigned as RICH

is ridiculous

Wages don't generate wealth

Investment and Business does, i.e. Your money, makes you money

adding 100 G

to the place where a regular human being can, save, invest and open businesses is insane

buying a McDondalds would cost you 500,000 G between rent, power, employee payment and Franchise fees

so HOW

does a middle class/upper middle class guy

save 500 G

To open a business if that's considered wealth?

Even opening a super cuts or a corner store means having aside a 6 figure amount of money

so where do you save that kind of cash from

If the minute your above, 250 G your kicked back down to 150G

and g-d forbid as Biden said

It turns out to be 150G

There wont be a small business started anywhere in America, ever again

Rich people don't create neighborhood jobs


And all we here from Obama is minutia tax breaks for the POOR

What about JOB CREATION

Inflation? What good is 500.00 on tax savings when the cost of food keeps going up?

What about Wage Fairness, what .25 on minimum wage what? Is he offering

How about assuring the poor BUSINESS LOANS


Rothschilds and Rockefeller's like OBAMA and all the rest of the BIG Money for a reason

He's going to CEMENT the Elite in place

and he's doing it by getting the poor to sell themselves out for a few hundred bucks

Good brothers are selling themselves into slavery

The AMERICAN DREAM

is NOT a .25 minimum wage raise or 500.00 tax savings

It's to get rich

and it won't be possible for 85% of Americans on Obamas Tax scheme

The minute you start actually making it

The Tax hammer drops, and people are too financially stupid to see it

Current Inflation alone

means your tax break at your income is WORTHLESS

Some of Us that know and can see what is going on are trying to talk to those who don't and explain...

and LOL, I am NOT a McCain supporter okay

I know trickle down theory means being pissed on

But Obamas Plan is going to have the guy trickling turn around and actually do a no 2 on your heads

The tax cut is get elected bs

There is no accounting for 9 Trillion in debt

No accounting for wages

No accounting for inflation

No accounting for the trade gaps

Nothing actually CHANGING

and

Now there will be no zone where you can SAVE and buy your way out of slavery if you work hard either

No bracket at all between rich and poor

That's all it's going to be

Rich and Poor 6% and 94%

and that's worse for the poor

Thats your jobs...

and there are NO Loans anymore either

He's a fake and I beg people to open their eyes

But no one listens

Your as good as dead on this tax plan, permanent serfdom

The bridge to somewhere is being pulled up and it WAS the capacity to rise to upper Middle class and make the jump

Your shot is being eroded








[edit on 2-11-2008 by mopusvindictus]



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 06:24 PM
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Good night everyone, I'm sick (literally) and very tired. I think my nose is going to rot off. I will catch you all tomorrow.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 06:24 PM
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reply to post by mopusvindictus
 
Excellent post. starred, I wish I could starr it twice!
All my thoughts and feelings and you figured out a way to get in on screen in a single post.
It is good to know I am not alone here.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 06:25 PM
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reply to post by Roper
 


Well I am happy for her that she has finally seen the first black president. Now on the other hand she is sorely mistaken. You will always have to work to fill your gas tank and You will always have to work to pay Your mortage. I am so tired of this entitlement crowd that expects me JOE BLOW the average tax payer to take care of their asses.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 06:25 PM
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reply to post by chickenshoes
 


Good night CS, I hope you feel better.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 08:38 PM
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Originally posted by chickenshoes
Tell me then, why did you assume she's on welfare? Did she say she was?


Oh I get it since YOU think everyone on welfare is black and he said she was on welfare, YOU think he is making this about RACE when in actuality, you are superimposing your own racism on this topic OR attempting to use it to stifle the posters resolve on this issue.

Don't know who wrote it but I Totally agree with it.




Senator John McCain could never convince me to vote for him. Only Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama can cause me to vote for McCain.

After long and serious thought, I have decided to endorse Senator John McCain for President.

I have always voted for the person and have not voted for anyone because some political party was telling me who I should vote for.

We all know the choices by now and, that said, I do believe that the process of selecting a chief executive is deeply flawed. The words 'money' and 'special interests' come to mind, among many others.

Here's the way I see it:

Barack Obama, you are a fine public speaker. You are also an extremely liberal Senator from the State of Illinois , which has a long and rich history of political corruption of the first magnitude. You are indeed a child of that system.

You have finally insulted my intelligence far beyond my capacity to tolerate your insults. It has nothing at all to do with your skin color. As a matter of fact, it would be so COOL to finally have an African-American for President. What a great statement that would be to the entire world that we are indeed the greatest country on earth!

But, unfortunately, General Colin Powell is not running, and YOU are NOT the man for this job !

Barack baby, you want me to believe that you have never he ard the sermons of your own pastor, the Right Reverend 'God Damn America' Jeremiah Wright. It is a matter of record that this has been your church for over 20 years. It is a matter of record that you were married there by this very pastor, and that your children were baptized there.

The good Reverend saw fit to visit Khadafy in Libya with you and to give a lifetime achievement award to Louis Farrakhan, of all people.

We have all now seen excerpts of his sermons all over the airwaves by now. And you have publicly stated that this man IS your 'spiritual mentor.'

BUT, your pastor is NOT the reason I am NOT voting for you. His words were disturbing enough, but it is your own HUGE church congregation, seen jumping, hooting and howling to his words in the background that disturb me the most. And please don't tell me you attended church there and never once heard a 'discouraging word' in the 20 years you attended there. Don't tell me, that in addition to the good reverend, that you are now not having anything to do with all those other people seen hooting and howling out in the audience in the background of his fiery tirades. Even Oprah Winfrey got disgusted and walked out on your campaign. I am no Oprah fan, but still she did the right thing.

Now you look me in the eye and ask me to believe that you never heard such language in all the years you attended there! This is like me telling you that I attended dozens of Klan rallies and never once heard the 'N' word. Yep. And Bill Clint on 'did not inhale'.

Yes, Mr. Obama, we all have friends who have said stupid things that embarrassed us, but NOW you have asked me to believe something that is so incredibly stupid that you are telling me that I am just stupid enough to believe you. THAT is the main reason that I will never vote for you.

I am deeply sorry, that in a country teeming with enormously talented African Americans who would make a good President that the political system has chosen YOU. You are a pathetic and plastic excuse for an American, who will not even salute the Flag during the Pledge of Allegiance. God forbid you ever get near the Oval Office.

Which leaves us with Senator John McCain.

John, you are a flawed man. You are a bit old, a bit looney, and you have a notoriously bad temper. This perfectly qualifies you, in my humble opinion, to lead us for the next eight years. I WANT your trembling hand on the nuclear button.

Think about it.
We have Kim Jong IL, Chavez and Ahmadenijad all running around like lunatics, threatening America and threatening to plunge the world into nuclear Armageddon. We have Putin and the Chinese blustering and rattling their sabers at us. I want John McCain in the Oval Office and I want him to be really ticked off at all these other nut jobs around the planet.

John, once you are elected, I want you to go into the Oval Office and throw one of your perfect FITS. Jump up and down and throw something through a plate glass window. Rip the drapes down and foam at the mouth a bit. And I want the whole thing on camera so that Ahmadinejad can see it. I want ALL of these 'world leaders' to lay awake at night and to break out in a cold sweat every time they think of messing with the United States of America .

I want the nuclear button sitting right next to the alarm clock on your night stand. I want pictures of this to be sent to Iran , Russia , China , Venezuela , Cuba , Libya , Syria , Pakistan , and those other dopes in the sheets, the Saudis.

On the domestic front, poor John did try and reach across the aisle to the opposition in a desperate effort to compromise and to get the Congress to do something. You may not agree with his efforts, but at least he TRIED . For all his efforts, all he got handed to him was his head in a basket. The liberals are ticked at him and the conservatives are ticked at him. Just my kinda guy.

Finally. John McCain knows on a most personal level what it is to suffer horrible torture for years and to see others die, right in front of you, for their love of America . When you ask him about it, he will tell you that what he did was 'nothing special.' Even more incredibly, he states that ANY American who truly loves his country would do exactly the same as he did in that situation. You and I will have a hard time believing that , but the real point is that John McCain believes that about the 'average American,' and that, dear friends and neighbors, is why I will cast my one poor ballot for on election day for John McCain -- warts and all.




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