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We need a place for Abductees moderated by Abductees

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posted on Nov, 16 2008 @ 11:44 PM
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reply to post by chickenshoes
 


My feeling is why should abductees be marginalized ANYWHERE? I think it is insulting to be shoved into a forum called skunk works or the gray area. I feel we should have our own place because like it or not, when there is a site that discusses aliens, you will get abductees. I feel ATS has a responsibilty to treat them fairly. I liken it to apartheid. While ATS continues to ignore or push abductees into off beat froums, ignorant posters will also feel they have an implicit right to also treat them badly like the poor relations.

There needs to be an abductee forum and it needs to state that any demanding of proof or bullying and name calling will not be tolerated. I have never seen abductees treated worse as on ATS and that is nothing to be proud of. This situation needs rectifying. The days of probe jokes are over. Alien abduction is real and it is traumatizing people the world over. I never would have thought that I would have to ask for fair treatment for victims of a conspiracy here on ATS. The joke is over, it's real and it's time things were bought up to the play here. This site used to be a front runner...now it lags sadly behind the 8 ball.




posted on Nov, 17 2008 @ 12:10 AM
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Reply to spacecowgirl

I thought your entire ongoing campaign has been to institutionalize a separation between abductees and non-abductees. That's apartheid – making separate areas so that two populations can't mingle. ATS takes the view that abductees are fully competent participants in the discussions that take place, equal to and able to participate with non-abductees.

As for the names of certain forums, you might want to Google "skunk works" and ""gray area". They are perfectly respectful names which are descriptive of the contents of those forums. Abduction experiences exist in a "gray area" with respect to evidence, because the only evidence is personal testimony – they can be neither proved nor disproved.

And yes, a site that talks about UFO's and abductions is going to attract abductees. I don't think that anyone wants abductees to stop coming to ATS. But ATS does not have a responsibility to meet all the requirements of any user. If you need a support group, find one. They are available at other sites.

Everybody hates the ATS trolls. And they show up in every forum, not just the Gray Area or Skunk Works. But they can be ignored, and the supportive members are actually much more numerous than the trolls.



posted on Nov, 17 2008 @ 03:34 AM
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Originally posted by americandingbat


I thought your entire ongoing campaign has been to institutionalize a separation between abductees and non-abductees. That's apartheid – making separate areas so that two populations can't mingle.


How do you come to that conclusion??? I do not believe in separation just a forum like all the others here titled alien abduction. Of course you can mingle!



posted on Nov, 17 2008 @ 03:37 AM
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Originally posted by americandingbat


And yes, a site that talks about UFO's and abductions is going to attract abductees. I don't think that anyone wants abductees to stop coming to ATS. But ATS does not have a responsibility to meet all the requirements of any user.


I feel there MUST be a responsibility that ATS needs to meet. Absolutely. Abductees are treated like scum here incase you weren't aware. I do not mean treated badly...I mean they are treated appallingly and this needs to change for the good of ALL.



posted on Nov, 17 2008 @ 12:02 PM
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Originally posted by spacecowgirl

How do you come to that conclusion??? I do not believe in separation just a forum like all the others here titled alien abduction. Of course you can mingle!


My understanding was that you wanted that to be an abductees-only forum, in which non-abductees could not contribute. That sounds to me like a form of apartheid – certainly more like apartheid than the current situation.

As for abductees being treated poorly here – I respectfully disagree.

They are treated poorly by some members here. But so are all sorts of other people, including people who believe in prophecies, people who have seen ghosts, people who have been victimized in government mind control experiments, and people who suffer from mental illnesses like depression. Abductees are not unique in regard to attracting trolls.

And ATS has a very clear and straightforward mission – to be a clearinghouse for information about "alternative" topics, but not to take a position on any of them. Support here comes from our fellow members, not from the site. If ATS were to start an "abductees only" forum as a supportive community, it would pollute the focus of the site, which is to examine and disseminate information.

As it is, you can report to the staff anyone who crosses the line from respectful questioning to abuse, and they will patrol a thread no matter what forum it's in.

Heck, I've even seen them over at BelowTopSecret.com


I'm going to make a suggestion – just a suggestion.

I understand that you see this as a crucial issue facing ATS. But you are new here, and the way you've approached the situation has been extremely confrontational. Perhaps you could set aside the campaign for a new forum – not forever, just for three months maybe – and explore what else ATS has to offer. That way the community gets to hear from you on other issues, and you can step out of the post ban cycle. They've gone this long with an Alien Abduction forum, let it sit for 90 days while everyone cools off.



posted on Nov, 19 2008 @ 03:23 AM
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reply to post by americandingbat
 


How many times do i have to say it? There would be NO separation, EVERYONE would be welcome to participate and it would be like ALL other threads EXCEPT demanding of proof would not be tolerated. You need to treat abductions differently to other issues here because quite frankly, there IS NO OTHER ISSUE in the whole world that is as traumatic and as hidden and secretive. There needs to be some form of acceptance of this fact and some form of responsibility by ATS.

I participate on other forums here and am only posting on this thread as a response to others. I thought the point was made days ago and there was no need to continue with it so i agree with you.



posted on Nov, 19 2008 @ 04:45 AM
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I absolutly LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, the ignore button, and use it liberally when I see anyone flaming ANYONE or ANYTHING.

Certain skeptisism in certain topics to dig for facts is fine, but skeptics who are just beating a dead horse seem more like predators to me, trying to prevent people from any kind of real searching for truth, or healing in cases like these. (like those who complain about spelling and grammar, rea;;y need to get a life, not everyone is english first language etc)

it is like they are SOOOOO afraid of the truth, they do everything to distract and stump subjects....hmmmmm, kind of like emotional abusers when you stand up for yourself.

I think the predators need to get a life.

The intellegent truth seekers are most likely to read instead of pestering with any kind of intrusive questions or crossing personal boundaries, but even at THAT.....if it is a thread for abductees, why not leave it for the abductees???

Is that SO hard to do? just read and move on if you weren't an abductee yourself?

If I am not an expert chef, I will read and learn from the expert chefs, but not try to steer them from their already in the right direction skills will I? No, I will read, learn, ask for HELP mabey, or just jot down recipes for myself. I don't need to tell them that me, reader of the back of the Kraft dinner box has a better method for a flem brule.


It is all about respect I think?



posted on Nov, 19 2008 @ 04:58 AM
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reply to post by spacecowgirl
 

I know that there are people who try to destroy threads but you have to also understand skeptics. Skeptics are only looking for evidence that a particular phenomena are indeed real. If there are members that are constantly disrupting threads the staff needs to be notified and one thing that I see people overlook quite a bit is the ignore function on ATS. If one or two people are creating havoc in the thread, one can simply add them to their ignore list.



posted on Nov, 19 2008 @ 05:24 AM
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It seems that I am not welcome here. I tried but it is not what anyone here wants so I will leave you all in peace. Go well, be good.



posted on Nov, 19 2008 @ 05:38 AM
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No one is saying that you are not welcome here. We are just simply pointing out some of the functions of ATS that may make your browsing a bit more pleasant. You are not required to respond to all posts. If you feel that a post is a personal attack then you need to report it. The staff here does a good job handling those items but as it has been said they cannot be everywhere at once. The members and staff have to work together to maintain the quality that ATS has become known for. As I said, I strongly recommend using the ignore function for some of the malicious posters. I can see that someone has possibly hurt your feelings here on ATS. That is a shame because we do our best to maintain civility and decorum here on this site although sometimes people don't. I am open minded as far as abductions go but there are others that are not. Their opinions and questions have just as much merit as anyone else's. They have the right to ask questions about peoples experiences as this promotes good discussion. If the questions are perceived as having malicious overtones or are a blatant attack the staff needs to be notified because no member has the right to attack another. I would recommend staying around for a bit and see all that ATS has to offer. Don't let a few people ruin your experience.



posted on Nov, 19 2008 @ 05:54 AM
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My personal opinion on why some skeptics demand proof in the “Gray Area”, is that they do the same stupid thing that I have done on occasion. They click on what sounds like an interesting topic on the recent posts page, and don’t stop to look at what forum it falls under. Half the time I have no idea what forum I am posting under unless I make an effort to go back and look at it. Though I am not the type of poster who normally demands proof of stuff, I am sure that I have down mouthed things that were in the “Grey Area” not even realizing that I was posting to a thread there. Maybe the “Gray Area” needs a logo of some type at the page top, so its hard to forget what the rules of that forum are.



posted on Nov, 27 2008 @ 11:45 PM
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reply to post by ShAuNmAn-X
 


WHY DO I HAVE TO UNDERSTAND SKEPTICS??? Especially when they have no wish or concern to understand ANYONE ELSE??? You have to be flipping kidding me??? Understand Skeptics? Are you having me on?
NO I WILL NOT BOTHER to understand skeptics but THEY SHOULD TRY AND UNDERSTAND ABDUCTEES.



posted on Nov, 27 2008 @ 11:50 PM
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Have you ever thought of finding a board out there solely for abductees. I mean, clearly ATS isnt offering what YOU want.

For example:
www.alienabductee.org...



posted on Nov, 27 2008 @ 11:54 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


[edit on 28-11-2008 by 12m8keall2c]



posted on Nov, 28 2008 @ 12:02 AM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Nov, 28 2008 @ 12:07 AM
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Originally posted by spacecowgirl
WHY DO I HAVE TO UNDERSTAND SKEPTICS??? Especially when they have no wish or concern to understand ANYONE ELSE???

NO I WILL NOT BOTHER to understand skeptics but THEY SHOULD TRY AND UNDERSTAND ABDUCTEES.


[Centre quote removed, it wasn't needed]

Does this NOT seem like a double standard to you? You want Skeptics to understand YOU but you don't want to try and understand their Point of View?

Why can't everyone just co-exist peacefully and try to understand each other...? THAT might be a more rational approach.


- Carrot



posted on Nov, 28 2008 @ 12:10 AM
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reply to post by CA_Orot
 


Why on earth would I give the opinion of a skeptic a second thought? I couldn't care less what they DON'T believe in. I know what I believe in and that is that. Their whining and nay saying is of no concern to me - UNLESS- they start to abuse abductees which seems to be the norm for these NON believing peeps. THAT is when it does concern me and they will have an argument on their hands as I will NOT TOLERATE abductees being abused.



posted on Nov, 28 2008 @ 12:14 AM
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Originally posted by spacecowgirl
Why on earth would I give the opinion of a skeptic a second thought?


Because you are asking them to give YOU a second thought - common courtesy my dear.



I couldn't care less what they DON'T believe in.


And they don't care what YOU believe in, therefore making this a circular argument which can never be won. Both sides have to give a little if you want any results.



Their whining and nay saying is of no concern to me - UNLESS- they start to abuse abductees which seems to be the norm for these NON believing peeps. THAT is when it does concern me and they will have an argument on their hands as I will NOT TOLERATE abductees being abused.


Abuse is NOT tolerated on ATS anyway towards: abudctees, blacks, whites, jewish, muslim, purple, yellow, (insert other human differences here).

If YOU are being abused - you should take it to a Mod.

- Carrot



posted on Nov, 28 2008 @ 12:20 AM
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reply to post by spacecowgirl
 


That's not in your realm of power to manage who YOU THINK is the one abusing, and the one being abused, is it? That's a trick question, I advise you not answer it.

So lets see here, you've made a contradictory statement which Carrot pointed out in the post above, now the next issue is that apparently if someone has a differenciating view on a matter, you do not accept that, you're asking for skeptics to be open minded with a close minded individual, you're DEMANDING assistance from people who you flame and attack when they point out an issue...CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM.

Now tell me, why should WE be "nice" and "open minded" with you again? An attitude adjustment on your part would help you greatly.



posted on Nov, 28 2008 @ 12:29 AM
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Abuse is NOT tolerated on ATS anyway towards: abudctees, blacks, whites, jewish, muslim, purple, yellow, (insert other human differences here).

If YOU are being abused - you should take it to a Mod.

- Carrot


Oh but it IS TOLERATED here! Oh yes! I have seen an abductee abused mercilessly here. I sent 30 complaints about it and the abusers/skeptics hardly got a slap with a wet bus ticket.
Yes abusing abductees is fair game here. I have seen it with my own eyes. It is pitiful.



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