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Loftus: Secret Files Prove Saddam Had WMD (but not what Bush believed)

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posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 07:44 AM
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President Bush, who clearly knew nothing of the specifics of the underground nuclear sites, or even that a nuclear weapons program still existed in Iraq, may have been accidentally correct about the main point of the war.

Secret Files Prove Saddam Had WMD (but not what Bush believed)

most complete report I''ve found is here: www.john-loftus.com...

John Loftus is President of IntelligenceSummit.org, which is entirely free of government funding, and depends solely upon private contributions for its support. The full research paper on Iraqi WMD, along with the supporting documents and photographs can be found at LoftusReport.com


(NOTE: The www.LoftusReport.com link isn't working. please try this one, www.john-loftus.com...)

for whole story - see url(s)

Finally, there are some definitive answers to the mystery of the missing WMD. Civilian volunteers, mostly retired intelligence officers belonging to the non-partisan IntelligenceSummit.org, have been poring over the secret archives captured from Saddam Hussein. The inescapable conclusion is this: Saddam really did have WMD after all, but not in the way the Bush administration believed. A 9,000 word research paper with citations to each captured document has been posted online at LoftusReport.com, along with translations of the captured Iraqi documents, courtesy of Mr. Ryan Mauro and his friends.

This Iraqi document research has been supplemented with satellite photographs and dozens of interviews, among them David Gaubatz who risked radiation exposure to locate Saddam’s underwater WMD warehouses , and John Shaw, whose brilliant detective work solved the puzzle of where the WMD went. Both have contributed substantially to solving one of the most difficult mysteries of our decade.

The absolutists on either side of the WMD debate will be more than a bit chagrinned at these disclosures. The documents show a much more complex history than previously suspected. The "Bush lied, people died" chorus has insisted that Saddam had no WMD whatsoever after 1991 - and thus that WMD was no good reason for the war. The Neocon diehards insist that, as in Raiders of the Lost Ark, the treasure-trove is still out there somewhere, buried under the sand dunes of Iraq. Each side is more than a little bit wrong about Saddam's WMD, and each side is only a little bit right about what happened to it.

The gist of the new evidence is this: roughly one quarter of Saddam's WMD was destroyed under UN pressure during the early to mid 1990's. Saddam sold approximately another quarter of his weapons stockpile to his Arab neighbors during the mid to late 1990's. The Russians insisted on removing another quarter in the last few months before the war. The last remaining WMD, the contents of Saddam's nuclear weapons labs, were still inside Iraq on the day when the coalition forces arrived in 2003. His nuclear weapons equipment was hidden in enormous underwater warehouses beneath the Euphrates River. Saddam’s entire nuclear inventory was later stolen from these warehouses right out from under the Americans’ noses. The theft of the unguarded Iraqi nuclear stockpile is perhaps, the worst scandal of the war, suggesting a level of extreme incompetence and gross dereliction of duty that makes the Hurricane Katrina debacle look like a model of efficiency.

Without pointing fingers at the Americans, the Israeli government now believes that Saddam Hussein’s nuclear stockpiles have ended up in weapons dumps in Syria.
Debkafile, a somewhat reliable private Israeli intelligence service, has recently published a report claiming that the Syrians were importing North Korean plutonium to be mixed with Saddam’s enriched uranium. Allegedly, the Syrians were close to completing a warhead factory next to Saddam’s WMD dump in Deir al Zour, Syria to produce hundreds, if not thousands, of super toxic “dirty bombs” that would pollute wherever they landed in Israel for the next several thousands of years. Debka alleged that it was this combination factory/WMD dump site which was the target of the recent Israeli air strike in Deir al Zour province..

Senior sources in the Israeli government have privately confirmed to me that the recent New York Times articles and satellite photographs about the Israeli raid on an alleged Syrian nuclear target in Al Tabitha, Syria were of the completely wrong location.

... Moreover, many of Saddam's own tapes and documents concerning chemical and biological weapons are ambiguous. When read together as a mosaic whole, Saddam's secret files certainly make a persuasive case of massive WMD acquisition right up to a few months before the war. Not only was he buying banned precursors for nerve gas, he was ordering the chemicals to make Zyklon B, the Nazis favorite gas at Auschwitz. However odious and well documented his purchases in 2002, there is no direct evidence of any CW or BW actually remaining inside Iraq on the day the war started in 2003. As stated in more detail in my full report, the British, Ukrainian and American secret services all believed that the Russians had organized a last minute evacuation of CW and BW stockpiles from Baghdad to Syria.

We know from Saddam’s documents that huge quantities of CW and BW were in fact produced, and there is no record of their destruction. But absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Therefore, at least as to chemical and biological weapons, the evidence is compelling, but not conclusive. There is no one individual document or audiotape that contains a smoking gun.

There is no ambiguity, however, about captured tape ISGQ-2003-M0007379, in which Saddam is briefed on his secret nuclear weapons project. This meeting clearly took place in 2002 or afterwards: almost a decade after the State Department claimed that Saddam had abandoned his nuclear weapons research.

Moreover the tape describes a laser enrichment process for uranium that had never been known by the UN inspectors to even exist in Iraq, and Saddam's nuclear briefers on the tape were Iraqi scientists who had never been on any weapons inspector’s list. The tape explicitly discusses how civilian plasma research could be used as a cover for military plasma research necessary to build a hydrogen bomb.

... If Saddam had nuclear weapons facilities, where was he hiding them? Iraqi informants showed US investigators where Saddam had constructed huge underwater storage facilities beneath the Euphrates River. The tunnel entrances were still sealed with tons of concrete. The US investigators who approached the sealed entrances were later determined to have been exposed to radiation. Incredibly, their reports were lost in the postwar confusion, and Saddam’s underground nuclear storage sites were left unguarded for the next three years. Still, the eyewitness testimony about the sealed underwater warehouses matched with radiation exposure is strong circumstantial evidence that some amount of radioactive material was still present in Iraq on the day the war began.

Our volunteer researchers discovered the actual movement order from the Iraqi high command ordering all the remaining special equipment to be moved into the underground sites only a few weeks before the onset of the war. The date of the movement order suggests that President Bush, who clearly knew nothing of the specifics of the underground nuclear sites, or even that a nuclear weapons program still existed in Iraq, may have been accidentally correct about the main point of the war: the discovery of Saddam’s secret nuclear program, even in hindsight, arguably provides sufficient legal justification for the previous use of force.



As a former Justice Department prosecutor, John Loftus once held some of the highest security clearances in the world, with special access to NATO Cosmic, CIA codeword, and Top Secret Nuclear files. As a private attorney, he works without charge to help hundreds of intelligence agents obtain lawful permission to declassify and publish the hidden secrets of our times. He is the author of four history books, three of which have been made into films, two were international best sellers, and one was nominated for the Pulitzer Prize.



[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]

[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]

[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]




posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 07:53 AM
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I have reservations about your source. But the information. if true. is noteworthy. If untrue, it is noteworthy in the context of the political atmosphere of the day.

Which will it be, I wonder?



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 08:28 AM
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John Loftus is President of IntelligenceSummit.org, which is entirely free of government funding, and depends solely upon private contributions for its support.



Who are those "private contributors", again?

Why do private contributors have interest in knowing if there WAS/IS WMD in Iraq?


I call this BS until I see a missile or something similar.


Peace



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 08:40 AM
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Gotta see it to believe it, huh Sator? Me too!

But, ya see, due to the deceased having been a huge pain in the rumpus to the UN inspectors and him having previously had the weapons I think that Allied intelligence had to err on the side of caution with this.

I saw a report somewhere about how some small caches of gases and deliver systems were found but I totally don't remember where I saw that? Any one knows what I am referencing? I think is was some lady reporter?

Ya, who is this guy and why the veil of secrecy with his funding? I don't/didn't support this sacking of Iraq or the subsequent occupation, but I would like to know if the intel people were right.

Interesting read none the less and great find OP
!



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 09:12 AM
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Surprise! The www.LoftusReport.com link isn't working.

What DOES add up about this issue?


As a former Justice Department prosecutor, John Loftus once held some of the highest security clearances in the world, with special access to NATO Cosmic, CIA codeword, and Top Secret Nuclear files. As a private attorney, he works without charge to help hundreds of intelligence agents obtain lawful permission to declassify and publish the hidden secrets of our times. He is the author of four history books, three of which have been made into films, two were international best sellers, and one was nominated for the Pulitzer Prize.


This is somewhat sweetening his resume isn't it?




John J. Loftus is the author and co-author of several controversial books on Nazis, espionage, and similar topics including The Belarus Secret (1982), Unholy Trinity: How the Vatican's Nazi Networks Betrayed Western Intelligence to the Soviets (1992), The Secret War Against the Jews: How Western Espionage Betrayed the Jewish People (1994), Unholy Trinity: The Vatican, the Nazis, and the Swiss Banks (1998).





Loftus serves as a media commentator, appearing regularly on ABC National Radio and Fox News. On August 7, 2005, he provided the United States address of a suspected terrorist named Iyad K. Hilal on Fox News. Only afterwards was it revealed that Hilal had left the address three years previously and the home was now owned by a family that was subjected to threats and vandalism and required police protection as a result of Loftus' words.[3][4] Fox fired Loftus after the event.[5] Loftus said "I thought it might help police in that area now that we have positively identified a terrorist," but he did not say why he did not contact police in a more direct manner. Loftus apologized for the mistake and expressed frustration about FBI inaction on an earlier tip.[6]




He's looking a bit like an out of work apologist for a certain little nuclear country.






[edit on 29-10-2008 by undermind]



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 09:48 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.



So this guy wants us to believe that an entire stash of weapons was moved out of the most surveilled country on the planet during the US led invasion?

I have a bridge in London I can sell him....



As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 10:03 AM
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Chemical weapons have a shelf life. After a certain amount of time the chemical compounds break down, and the weapons themselves are no longer worth using.

That shelf life is roughly 12 years. He got those weapons in the 80's, which means by 2002 the only possible way for him to have any WMD is if he was able to produce them himself. The previous batch he had was given to him by us.

The stockpiles of things such as nuclear/radioactive material were documented and known long before the war. Those were far from being weapons, and had been sealed by the UN inspectors.



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 10:12 AM
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Wouldn't all of that radiation leak out into the River and kill everything?

Is the Euphrates polluted now?



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 10:24 AM
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Originally posted by Maxmars
I have reservations about your source.


What are your reservations about John Loftus?

(I've got to admit, I have a few as well.)

My reservations are that he never mentions the Fed/City of London and that they are the ones to hold responsible, and to move the money-issuing power from the privately-owned Fed back to the publicly-owned U.S. Treasury to stop fractional banking and to stop the concept of "interest" charged on loans.

My other reservations are that while he exposed the bush dynasty to be financial supporters of Nazis, thereby implying they are traitors and spies during wartime, he says most of the American big business people as well, including JFK's father (and I might add, Al Gore's father), Rockefeller and Brown-Bro's Harriman also supported the nazis and fascists thereby implying they believed in Hitler's and Mussolini's final solution for labor unions and minimum wages. -- but he fails to argue to strip from America our Nazi legacy of the U.S. pro-Nazi private bankers who privately own the Fed, and their City of London counterparts.

I feel he has to support the Bushes or he'll be killed. I figure he can't attack the Fed/City of London and argue for their elimination, because he'll be killed.

After all, he exposed al Qaeda financing in Florida and al Qaeda leaders teaching at University of Florida and San Francisco State University, and is one of the stars, today, of the left and the right.

He's sort a version of Noam Chomsky -- full of facts and opinions about everything except what would help right now.

[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 10:29 AM
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reply to post by Sator
 


John Loftus is a clearinghouse for intelligence operatives who've become whistle-blowers. I've stated his qualifications and read his books. I consider John one of the best intelligence sources for the people, and perhaps only one of 6-7 in the whole U.S., who unravel the history of the 20th Century in layman's terms, for wage-slaves as well as other intelligence operatives. I've stated his qualifications in the opening post, and you can goggle his name.

Of course, you'll need to read his books, and understand his intelligence summits bring together current and past intelligence operatives and their directors and handlers from all over the world.

Also, see my reservations about him, at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 10:35 AM
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Originally posted by SolarSeaman
Ya, who is this guy and why the veil of secrecy with his funding? I don't/didn't support this sacking of Iraq or the subsequent occupation, but I would like to know if the intel people were right.

Interesting read none the less and great find OP
!


He explains in his post (and I qualify who he is in the opening post and w/urls to his website) that he received this info from his friends in the intelligence community from the left and the right, gathered at his annual intelligence summit.

He is self-funded from his published books, and, as every other nonprofit, by donations (referred to as contributors or donors, by all non-profits).

I also am against war as a solution to the problems the Fed/City of London create, especially as they fund both sides of war and own all the defense and munitions companies.

It's all a ploy to suppress the people by the money-issuing class.



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 10:38 AM
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thanks.


Originally posted by undermind
Surprise! The www.LoftusReport.com link isn't working.


please try this one, www.john-loftus.com... perhaps I listed the wrong one.

[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 10:55 AM
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Originally posted by Sator
Why do private contributors have interest in knowing if there WAS/IS WMD in Iraq?
I call this BS until I see a missile or something similar.


(MOD, note: the following is on topic, because the folks we're fighting in Iraq many were trained in the Tri-Border Area and traffic in weapons and WMD.)

You live in Brazil? Are you familiar with the Bormann Organization, or the Tri-Border Area where Muslim Brotherhood, Al Queda, Hamas, etc and CIA/M-16/Mossad train, traffick heroin and launder money. I understand there are many Saudi-financed mosques and Madrassas (terrorist training schools) throughout South America.



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 11:55 AM
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John Loftus is another counter terrorism "expert" making a quick buck off of fabricating terrorist stories too keep us in fear and panic.

Here are just a few reasons I doubt his credibility:

Your neighbor is a terrorist!



John Loftus, Fox News Contributor, carelessly gave the address of an unsuspecting family because he thought a terrorist lived at their address. He was wrong and the family has been tortured and terrorized since his irresponsible statement. Chrish reported this story and at that time the family was waiting for an apology from Fox News. This morning 8/27/05, CNN reported that Fox had fired Loftus and issued a written apology to the family who have gone through hell.

The Voricks are now recieving police protection because the harrassment has been so severe. Mrs. Vorick claimed that she is afraid to leave her teenage child with the younger kids while she works. Someone actually spray painted " terrorist" on the wall next to their front door while they were home. A steady stream of people drive by screaming at them. Their lives have been turned upside down because John Loftus and Fox behaved so recklessly.

www.newshounds.us...


Who are these "private donors?"



The Intelligence Summit claims to be operated by a tax-deductible 501(c)(3) organization and pled poverty. Yet, I got a million excuses why I could not locate the organization's tax returns on any number of free websites that would contain PDF files of those returns. I wanted to see these, based on my previous knowledge of Mr. Loftus. When I was finally sent a hint of a tax return, it was a link to a Florida Holocaust Museum of which Mr. Loftus was once President and for which he is apparently the registered agent. There is no record on the tax returns of any connection to the Intelligence Summit, or any recording of the Summit's employees, officers, salaries, expenses, etc. from previous years of the event. I was told Mr. Loftus delayed in responding to others who asked some questions for me because of serious illnesses of close family members. But those illnesses didn't stop him from doing an interview with ABC News' Brian Ross. Given all this, I decided it was just not in my interest to appear at this event. Again, I'm sorry if you have chosen to attend to see and hear me. There will be other opportunities for that.

www.debbieschlussel.com...



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 01:18 PM
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Originally posted by counterterrorist

You live in Brazil? Are you familiar with the Bormann Organization, or the Tri-Border Area where Muslim Brotherhood, Al Queda, Hamas, etc and CIA/M-16/Mossad train, traffick heroin and launder money. I understand there are many Saudi-financed mosques and Madrassas (terrorist training schools) throughout South America.



My "reply to" button isn't working, so I decided to quote your post.


Yes, I live in Brazil.

I'm not FAMILIAR with the Bormann Organization but I have heard of it before.

I do know the Tri-Border Area yes, BEAUTIFUL place by the way.

I do know there are many Saudi-financed mosques IN THAT AREA (not sure if it is throughout South America... hard to believe). I think it is also debatable if the mosques are indeed "terrorist schools" as you put it.


And just to make ONE little thing clear:


Originally posted by counterterrorist
(MOD, note: the following is on topic, because the folks we're fighting in Iraq many were trained in the Tri-Border Area and traffic in weapons and WMD.)


Tthe "folks you are fighting in Iraq" are Iraq citizens pissed of their country was invaded.... Why does it matter where/if they were trained?



The following is not directed to anyone specifically:

I have heard this story (ie.: muslin terrorists trained in Tri-Border Area in South America) before, back in 2001/2002. I find it VERY hard to believe BECAUSE I live here!! I am not going to argue about this because one would have to know what I'm talking about in order to have a descent discussion/conversation and that is only possible if you know, see, live and "feel" the place by yourself.
It was a VERY SAID DAY in Foz do Iguaçu (brazilian city in the Tri-Border Area) on 9/11/2001 because everybody already knew back then that the blame was going to be put on muslins.

I think it's terrible that people take other's words at face value without even furthering investigation once the "evidences" meets their agendas.

Peace



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 01:24 PM
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And just one thing I forgot to comment.


Does anyone find it -at least- INTERESTING this idea that terrorist are training in a Tri-Border Region?

I mean, how easy is that for a target?

Uncle Sam: "Ahh, I got it! There are terrorists a the borders of the 3 countries, so we must invade all of the 3 JUST to make sure they can't get away".




Peace



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 06:16 PM
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Sator -- I wrote a very long and detailed response but accidentally deleted it, so let me just post this for now and will respond more in detail, later, okay? thanks.


--

Originally posted by Sator


Sator: I have heard this story (ie.: muslin terrorists trained in Tri-Border Area in South America) before, back in 2001/2002. I find it VERY hard to believe BECAUSE I live here!! I am not going to argue about this because one would have to know what I'm talking about in order to have a descent discussion/conversation and that is only possible if you know, see, live and "feel" the place by yourself.
It was a VERY SAID DAY in Foz do Iguaçu (brazilian city in the Tri-Border Area) on 9/11/2001 because everybody already knew back then that the blame was going to be put on muslins.




counterterrorist www.abovetopsecret.com...
(cont)
subj: Tri-Border Area (TBA) popular w/other organized crime groups, use region to launder billions of dollars yearly & earn multi-million-dollar profits by engaging in narcotics & arms trafficking & other illicit activities;
informal tripartite alliance exists among Islamic terrorist groups, organized crime mafias, & many corrupt government or police officials in Tri-Border Area countries.
oriented toward reaping multi-million-dollar profits from illicit activities;
Chinese Mafia groups operate attempting to expand into Argentina & elsewhere;



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 06:58 PM
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Mod -- this is on-topic because we are discussing the training of terrorists in South America that run heroin to finance the "enemy" in Iraq.

The enemy in Iraq are the private owners of the Federal Reserve Board/City of London, they are killing Americans and they are killing Iraqi.


this post responds to another post in this string: www.abovetopsecret.com...


--

Originally posted by Sator

The "folks you are fighting in Iraq" are Iraq citizens pissed of their country was invaded.... Why does it matter where/if they were trained?


The people of Iraq are not fighting us, we are killing them. Who is fighting us are the Moslem Brotherhood, the: al Queda, Hamas, Taliban. The CIA trained these groups and so did the MI-6. The so-called terrorists have been trained and paid for the The City of London since WWII to present. City of London uses these para-military groups that they keep on the payroll to run heroin and guard oil pipelines, because the City of London are the private bankers that own all the central banks and who own the banks that own the oil companies. The people own the central banks are primarily private bankers, I call them the 'money-issuing' class, because they print and own all the money.

I am too tired now to provide urls. Also same re: Bormann.

Tomorrow, okay? If you post a question I'll provide full documentation.

Remember the money-issuing class in one country unto itself.
Everyone else, the working class, middle managerial class, upper class and ruling elite, are another country.

These two countries are always at war, the money-issuing class, against us.

The people of the U.S. are NOT at war with the people of Iraq.
The money-issuing class is at war with the people of the U.S. AND with the people of Iraq.

The people of Iraq and the people of the United States are "the people" -- in both countries, we are victimized and ruled and the wage-slaves of the 'money-issuing' class.

I'm sure in your country, Brazil, it is the same. What is the name of your central bank in Brazil? The private owners of your central bank are the money-issuing class in your country.


[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]

[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 07:10 PM
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this post responds to another post in this string, regarding the 1st paragraph comment by satar www.abovetopsecret.com...

counterterrorist:

"Latin America’s fastest-growing faith resents allegations" hispanicmuslims.com... excerpt: Islam fastest-growing religion in Latin America & Caribbean region. Venezuela, rumors of terrorist camp in Margarita w/16 months of political unrest in Caracas. Syrians, Lebanese & Palestinians began migrating to South America w/decline of Ottoman Empire in 1800s.
Saudi Arabia, founded to spread Islam, financed construction of mosques & Islamic centers in Caracas, Buenos Aires & Brazil, & Foz do Iguaçu on Brazilian side of triple border area. Sheik Ibrahim mosque in Caracas, continent's 2nd largest, built w/funding from Ibrahim bin Abdul Aziz Al Ibrahim Foundation. Saudi royal family established foundation to spread Islam. FBI uncovered ties of foundation to Osama bin Laden while investigating U.S.A. Embassy bombings in Nairobi, Kenya, & Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, 1998.
Saudis built Islamic Center in Buenos Aires,. $25 million complex in upscale neighborhood of Palomar
Law enforcement agencies rarely cooperate w/colleagues across borders. w/Colombian guerrilla & paramilitary groups moving firefights from countryside to cities, & re-emergence of groups like Shining Path in Peru, U.S.A. Southern Command responsible for hemisphere's security, wants hington to act. Without U.S.A. aid to cash-strapped governments, terrorist groups in Latin America & Caribbean could grow, forge alliances & make conflict in Colombia & its threat to our national security
"Hezbollah Finances: Funding Party of God— www.justice.gov.il... In US, law enforcement officials investigate crime, funding Middle Eastern terrorists by stealing & reselling baby formula, food stamp fraud, grocery coupon scams, welfare claims, credit cards, unlicensed t-shirts sales. “substantial portion" of millions of dollars raised by Middle Eastern terrorist groups 20 to 30 million yearly brought in by scam industry in U.S.A.
--Arab-American in Detroit smuggled 12 million in fraudulent cashiers checks into US, & fitness trainer in Boston provides customers' social security & credit card numbers to Abd al-Ghani Meskini, associate of Ahmad Ressam, Algerian convicted of plotting to blow up LAX in 2000. "

---

satar:

I have heard this story (ie.: muslin terrorists trained in Tri-Border Area in South America) before, back in 2001/2002. I find it VERY hard to believe BECAUSE I live here!! I am not going to argue about this because one would have to know what I'm talking about in order to have a descent discussion/conversation and that is only possible if you know, see, live and "feel" the place by yourself.
It was a VERY SAID DAY in Foz do Iguaçu (brazilian city in the Tri-Border Area) on 9/11/2001 because everybody already knew back then that the blame was going to be put on muslins.

---



[edit on 29-10-2008 by counterterrorist]



posted on Oct, 30 2008 @ 07:47 AM
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This is a reply to counterterrorist:
(my 'reply to' button isn't working)


CT, I really appreciate your response and effort in trying to show me your view of things. That's a lot of things to read and -as I'm at work now- I'll bookmark this to get back to it at night (it's morning here now).

I gave just a quick look through your last two posts now and I have to comment on one thing:


Remember the money-issuing class in one country unto itself.
Everyone else, the working class, middle managerial class, upper class and ruling elite, are another country.

These two countries are always at war, the money-issuing class, against us.

The people of the U.S. are NOT at war with the people of Iraq.
The money-issuing class is at war with the people of the U.S. AND with the people of Iraq.

The people of Iraq and the people of the United States are "the people" -- in both countries, we are victimized and ruled and the wage-slaves of the 'money-issuing' class.


I think you are completely right, and I agree 100%.



I'm sure in your country, Brazil, it is the same. What is the name of your central bank in Brazil? The private owners of your central bank are the money-issuing class in your country.


Sure it is the same, although each country has its 'levels', right?

The name of central bank in Brazil is just that: Banco Central which literally means Central Bank. Now, as far as I know (and I'm not saying I know all of it) our Central Bank differs from US' because of the fact that it's not privately owned, being a direct branch of the Ministry of Finance. All decisions must go though Congress, voted, and all that illusionary methods.


Peace



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