Originally posted by Blaine91555
If you go through the site you will note it is not at all what you would expect. One of the other pages is a pitch for a book and it all links to "stop.org.br". That site is also to get into your wallet.

Yes he is selling a book - "The New Physics". I see nothing wrong with this, especially if he shows you how to build one in it

And yes I was aware that they are asking for help and donations. But if the project is legit, then that's only a logical thing to do isn't it?

This needs some further investigation before we declare "scam". The two guys in the video supposedly built their unit just from Keppe's book, so why not start with them? Maybe they can give us more information...

Originally posted by GoldenAge

Originally posted by rickyrrr
Here is the one argument that may be convincing: This motor has been supposedly demonstrated by recharging a third battery from the first two. If this motor really returned energy it would not require three batteries. In fact, it would require no batteries at all. Come on, think about it! why would batteries be required for a device that produces more energy that it consumes? a simple piece of wire or even a resistor could be replaced for the battery and there should be a positive voltage measured over that resistor as the supposed motor spins freely from its own energy, while turning a surplus to the resistor.

There is simply no reason why a battery would be needed even such contrived reasons as "to provide an initial something something" as is usually quoted in these videos.

My understanding is that for some reason you can't use the Radiant energy (or "Vacuum" energy, or "Scalar" energy) directly. You have to catch it and send it to a battery and the battery is what converts it to the form of energy that can power a load. So that is why these systems usually have at least two batteries - one running the motor and the other tapping the Radiant energy and charging itself up. (Bedini explains this much better in EFTV Part 2, you should watch it if you haven't already.)

We can sit and debate the merit of these systems, and indeed it has been done many times in many threads. But what I am saying is, the schematics for these are readily available now, so why not take it a step further and test it out for real? That is the ATS way, isn't it?

Well, conventional batteries are built to store or return electrical energy, either by pushing a current against its voltage (much like pushing against a spring) or allowing the battery's own voltage to push against some other load. How come these guys found a new kind of energy that batteries not previously designed to handle are now seemingly capable of transforming?

It would then appear that their vacuum energy converting batteries are the secret magic ingredient in their system wouldn't you think?

-rrr

Woot, I haven't read through the enitre thread since I'm in a hurry (work work), but still this is awesome news!

I've reacently been reading through some of the work Nassim Haramein has been throwing out and he states that the energy density in the vacuum is infinite (tho to us it seems like nothing is there due to the vacuum being in perfect equilibrium). Therefore, to tap this power is a step in the right direction.

Hurray for science!

Originally posted by rickyrrr
At some point the system has to *return* energy. whatever it does. If it is capturing energy from the environment and has a COP of over unity, but still an efficiency of under unity, whatever way you dice it or slice it, the extra energy has to be *somewhere*....

Yes, the excess energy ends up in the battery. The vacuum energy is already there in the space all around us, in massive quantities, so all this is doing is capturing some of it and sending it to a battery. The process is not 100% Efficient, you will still have energy losses from friction and conversion and whatnot, but you can still get very high COP, much greater than 1.

Bearden explains this in much more detail in EFTV Part 1, you should really watch those videos as well if you haven't already!

I'd like to see that energy across a pair of wires coming out of the device. Measurement in joules, and output energy has to be greater than the energy initially contained in the batteries that are part of the system combined with any rotational energy imparted into it to "crank it up". That is not too much to ask. Put energy somewhere *else* and then as a show of good faith show us it didn't come from your initial energy sources.

Yes. The idea is that these systems actually charge batteries - lots of them! Supposedly you can even charge more than one at a time, you can set it up to charge five batteries at a time if you like. And then you can take those batteries and put them in a car, or a TV, or a dryer, and power those systems as well. So really it's not just a motor, but a motor-generator and battery-charger.

Fake free energy devices come and go every couple of years. You would think that they should be motivated to show themselves as different as possible from all the fakers out there, especially by showing in good faith that they have produced a net output.

Right, you make a good point. This needs more independent validation. A Youtube video alone isn't good enough proof.

Maybe the next thing to do is contact these people and see how much information they're willing to give, if they're willing to have this independently replicated and tested...

Increasing the voltage on a third battery while using the other two is not what's going on. Bedini can power a motor off one small battery, and in turn that motor puts out 12V @400 - 600 amps, which is put into whatever you want. Assume a target battery bank. He's only using 12V at a few milliamps to run his motor, so this mass of excess power now in the target battery bank can be used to recharge the source battery. So you end up with 4800 to 7200 watts net increase.

Where's the power coming from? The vacuum! Same place every source charge comes from, but by tickling the circuitry, he is able to "free" up gobs of this energy.

He can take a small 12V 18AH battery and charge bank after bank of discharged heavy duty diesel batteries. On and on. And if he wants, he can use two small switched source batteries, one of which is running the motor, and the other is being recharged. And then switch with a controller.

Once you get it going, it can go forever. And for anyone who says this is perpetual motion and thus impossible, unless Newton has been negated, then that premise is entirely wrong. And anyone who says it violates the second law of thermodynamics can't explain where all source charges originate. The second law of thermodynamics as written is just wrong.

Originally posted by rickyrrr
Well, conventional batteries are built to store or return electrical energy, either by pushing a current against its voltage (much like pushing against a spring) or allowing the battery's own voltage to push against some other load. How come these guys found a new kind of energy that batteries not previously designed to handle are now seemingly capable of transforming?

It would then appear that their vacuum energy converting batteries are the secret magic ingredient in their system wouldn't you think?

-rrr

rickyrrr, you have been raising a lot of excellent and important questions and I appreciate that. But it is a bit frustrating because Bearden and Bedini have already explained all of these things, much better than I ever could, since I am not mechanically-inclined myself. I strongly encourage you to watch EFTV 1 and 2, all of your questions and issues are addressed in those videos I assure you!

You said it yourself - these guys have found a "new" type of energy, that works differently than "normal" electricity and requires different designs and circuits. As Phage said, it is non-entropic. But as far as I know, the batteries are nothing special - any standard battery will do.

Dick Cheney will kill anyone involved in this technology. email all schematics to people you don't like and watch them vanish!

This sounds promising, but where have we seen this before that ended in a SPECTACULAR failure? Ding, ding, ding!! You guessed it! Steorn. That sounded promising, too.

I agree with rickyrrr here. Unless they can show proof that they are tapping into TRUE vacuum energy and not just stray electromagnetic fields with an LCD readout, without a battery system, and inside a Faraday cage, I have no plans of getting my hopes up again. Steorn ruined that for me.

[edit on 10/29/2008 by pjslug]

No. Just no.

This video is absolutely ridiculous. Note how no one in this silly serious has ANY scientific credentials.

Particles have been detected, on the level of the quark.

Cyclotrons are meant to study particle collisions, not to produce nuclear fusion. Fusion has actually been detected.

E = mc^2 doesn't only mean energy to matter.

Protons can OBVIOUSLY exist without electrons. What do you think a positive hydrogen ion is?

And a vast misunderstanding of thermodynamics that propagates this entire series.


I appreciate that no one understands basic chemistry and physics, but come on. You should be able to see that this is founded on baloney.

something that is bugging me here. is that they say they are using a rectifier?

a rectifier for converting AC to DC.
an inverter converts DC to AC.

where are they getting AC current from? so that they would need a rectifier? From the magnet?
And aren't you losing voltage from the peak loss? depending on the amount of diodes in the rectifier? which would suck if there wasn't much voltage to begin with.

it sounds like a bunch of bs to me. however i'd like to be proven wrong on this one.

Originally posted by Gamechanger
Wait this is #%@$ing amazing! A free energy device whose inventors haven't mysteriously disappeared or been suicided?? Is this for real? I can hardly believe it.
Bump bump bump bump bump

Edit for spelling...

[edit on 28-10-2008 by Gamechanger]

Ahhh Give the Big Oil & Energy companies time to hear about it, locate these guys & Viola!!!

Drive-bys, Car accidents, mabe aCliff Plunge, or an accidental Electricution, and "there just has to be atleast 1 suicide".

Some will vanish & this invention will suddenly dissappear out of the limelight, never to be seen or heard of again.

Just a matter of days now...

Wonder if these guys are already crapping their pants, waiting for the black Limosines to show uo...hehehe

Nice if this could get out & become the new industry standard, but the big boys simply won't let it happen.

This tech has already been invented. Just another tease pretty soon it will be locked away with the rest of them.

Very nice that people are putting effort in inventing substitutes for gasoline and diesel engines, but the problem is that none of these devices will really reach a state of production any time soon.

As long as there are oil companies and oil rich countries, there will be no substitute for gasoline engines, as they are far too profitable for the oil giants. Once we run out of oil, we will have a substitute, or perhaps multiple substitutes in no time.

BP alone made profits of $8.05 billion in only three months time! I cannot think of companies in a different sector making such profits. They are rich and thus have enough power to pressure governments to help them preventing us from solving our energy dependence and global warming.

Edit: Having worked for an European subsidiary of GM, I should mention that GMs Chevrolet is about to put the Chevy Volt into production in 2010, but it has been postponed various times already; with current economic turbulence I wouldn't be surprised if they lack the money to realize the project.

[edit on 29-10-2008 by Mdv2]

Looks like a scam to me. It's amazing how many of you are so gullible. If its legit why didn't they submit thier findings to a scientfic journal so it can be reviewed?

Here is a test.
If your so convinced its real. Why don't you give them a "donation". like there asking for. I bet no one is willing to do that.

This is nothing new. There are lots of these on the internet. Of course, none have collected the awards for the development of such items from their government and from individuals who fight scams, like the Amazing Randy.

The presentation lacks a professional touch, and smells scammy.

The physics lecture is bogus, too. If you believe that, I have a big tank of dark energy to sell to you.