A question for our European and Aussie friends...Do you regret giving up your right to own firearms?

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posted on Oct, 31 2008 @ 05:31 PM
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i draw your attention to this

in Australia

Who are now able to own or use firearms?
Anyone who has a genuine reason may own a firearm. For example, members of a recognised sporting shooters club, recreational shooters/hunters with permission from a landholder, primary producers and security employees, bona fide collectors that is, those with a demonstrated need will still be able to own firearms, but not those that are now prohibited.

Are farmers able to keep their firearms?
Farmers with a genuine need for a category B or C firearm are able to own one. To use category C firearms, farmers need to satisfy the licensing authority that the use of the firearm pertains to their occupation, cannot be achieved by some other means and that the need cannot be satisfied by a firearm classified as category A. Category C licence holders are only allowed to own a maximum of one rifle and one shotgun of Category C type.




from this link

www.ag.gov.au...




posted on Oct, 31 2008 @ 07:57 PM
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reply to post by captiva
 


I suppose 300 million of us are waiting to see either the Patriot Act to be repealed by the next administration due to 'changing' circumstances OR just how the PTB plan to abuse that authority. It better not hit my home or any of my relatives. Most Americans simply won't allow ANY 'organization' or any 'human being' to impose their authority on our innate and Creator given right to defend our Liberty.

That is what America is all about. Sure, we're concerned about recent 'written laws' put into effect for the 'supposed' terrorist threat. Natural Law as always, will prevail in the 'end'. Once it has reached a 'certain' threshold....our numbers will speak louder than any 'weapon' you could imagine being used against us. Remember, there are many highly trained soldiers in this country at the 'ready' to defend their families, freinds the world over for that matter. If I'm in a foreign country and see a friend threatened....I'll defend them.

I hope you guys read some prior posts I've made about what is 'really' going on here worldwide. I really do know and am here for a reason. My concern is not just for the USA but for humanity as a whole.

Freedom is priceless and Americans will continue to resist and defend against ANY breach of our innate and Creator given right to Freedom.

Sure there are 'rogue' agents withing our govt. and the govts. of the world that work for 'other' PTB though could you imagine entrusting another govt. having the military power we have? I can't.

Both sides of my family have been in this country before and just after the Declaration of Independence. What most are unaware of is the fact that it was the International bankster cartel families that have run this world since 1743. Yes, these are the same Trillionare families you will 'never' see listed in Forbes annual richest 100 people for they are on an entirely different 'level' of authority. That is to change as per natural law entitles.

If one allows oneself to be a slave, it is to be. If one is enlightened as to their being, they are to take another course.

The most IMPORTANT history lesson you'll ever learn is below. Read on and let freedom ring.

Stop allowing the PTB to 'divide and conquer' the people via press, media, paid off politicians, blackmailed authorities, assassinations etc.

Seek and ye shall 'find'.

illuminati

quotes.liberty-tree.ca...

quotes.liberty-tree.ca...

READ THE FOLLOWING VERY CAREFULLY AND IN ENTIRETY.

Timeline of the Rothschilds

Just because a family is born into a 'regime' doesn't mean they have to continue a lost/hijacked plan of a NWO. Read the link above and perhaps you'll understand what I say and where it applies 'today'.

I've had some family members involved in some very important and powerful positions in govt. past and present. I'm doing what I can to stop this trend to worldwide serfdom. It is my duty to my country and of my fellow man.

PS. The truth will truely set you free.
A cataclysm awaits us all.
Truth, by design, is 'always' self evident.



[edit on 31-10-2008 by Perseus Apex]



posted on Oct, 31 2008 @ 08:19 PM
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Originally posted by Perseus Apexon our innate and Creator given right to defend our Liberty.


Errmmm...what creator specifically? Are you referring to a specific God? If that is a reference to an Abrahamiic God, well lets just remember that God has no problem with keeping slaves. A household slave or a nation of slaves, is there a difference?



posted on Oct, 31 2008 @ 08:53 PM
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reply to post by Sonya610
 


I'm referring to the Creator those referred to for truth before the Bible was transcribed; for what is right and wrong, our Creator given intellect, ability to use reason and to 'attempt' to be rational that is found inherent only in mankind.

The same truths man discovered/deciphered before the books of the Bible were put together by the 'Wise men', human Kings, Scribes of the past and other 'silly' human authorities of 'authority'.

My point is, truth is self-evident. If something doesn't make sense, it was not designed to.

The Bible has many truths though it was put together for the reason of defending against the Roman threat of mankind 'so perceived' by the original settlers of the Mesopotamia. The rest is 'history'. Could you imagine our 'Creator' establishing a 'religion' of which has been deciphered and 'evolved' in so many ways?

Would 'foreigners' find this strange? Of course. I use this analogy as a means of perception from our self designed and therefor self imposed box we live in today. The Matrix movie was in essence a wake up call though in a way of which most are unaware of. Some movies are designed to make people think and some are designed to brainwash, disinform the other. Our intellect and intuition is supposed to determine the 'difference'.

It seems our collective subsciousness is more valuable than our programmed consciousness.

The world's 'conscientious' on the other hand has been hijacked.

The world is in dire need of one with Sapience to determine Jurisprudence that pertains to all mankind.

2009 will be disastrous to mankind though will present 'opportunities' for mankind to live amongst another as a Brother. You must fight for what is right or your children will live as slaves to an artificial 'authority'.



[edit on 31-10-2008 by Perseus Apex]



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 06:36 AM
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Where on earth does the US obsession with a post civilised go it alone survivalist mentality come from? Every man for themself with big f... off gun for protection? Dream on you deluded fools. Wherever society breaks down there's always some nut with a bigger gun or enough "followers" holding many guns to ensure that they rule and you're dead. Just turn on the TV and see what lawless life is like for most citizens in Africa, Asia and the Middle East. Nutters with guns running riot.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 08:48 AM
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Originally posted by Sonya610

Originally posted by BlackOps719
From what I understand it is all but impossible to purchase or possess a handgun. Why is that?


I would assume that is because hand guns are NOT used for hunting. I certainly don't keep my guns for hunting, I prefer handguns because I am only concerned about human predators.


Holy # your scary.

I don't want every retard having the capability of killing me. I am Australian and I could not imagine it any other way. At least knife attacks give you a chance. Even the possibility of someone shooting me by accident is absolutely out of the question for me. I get nervous around the people who change money in shopping centres who have guns.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 10:06 AM
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In all these posts, only very few have hit on the facts of our possession of firearms. THE REASON IS THAT WE HAVE 'THE RIGHT TO CHOOSE TO OWN OR NOT TO OWN FIREARMS"!!!! Unlike so many other places in this world. Our government was set up to let its citizens make decisions without government permission. We have never been subjects of a ruling class regardless of how many here fear that we are owned. If this election turns out to have the result so many see comming, those that have come here to tell us how barbaric we are for wanting to protect ourselves will see exactly how many Americans are not willing to knuckle under. Luckily, our politicians still fear the US citizen and should always remain so. I, for one will without failure be one of those who does my best to make sure they fear the US citizen.

Zindo



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 01:45 PM
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posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 02:03 PM
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I think what you are missing is the fact that the remainder of our rights havent been taken away BECAUSE we still maintain the right to bear arms.

An unarmed populous is a defenseless one, I truly believe that these crooked politicians and other assorted vermin would have long ago turned America into a complete police state had it not been for the lingering fear of trifling with a society filled with people who were able to fire back.



Well, I think America is already much more a police state than most of European Countries. I lived in the US for a year and I couldn't walk the street at night without being surrounded by an army of cops arresting drunk college kids and checking IDs ALL the time, everywhere. Not to mention the college police, and the cops at the liquor store and so on. Almost all my american friends had been arrested at least once already, just for silly reasons. France for instance, is to my opinion less a police state than the US is and yet you can't buy a gun if you aren't a hunter or in a shooting range.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 02:28 PM
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reply to post by PammyK
 


I' m from belgium. We have strict gun control and very few guns among our citizens. I do not need a gun. I do not live in fear that some nut with a gun will kills my kids in a shoot-out in a school, or spray the pavement with bullets to protect their drug territory. In a civilised society, soldiers swear to uphold the law, not to uphold a politician. Can you defend yourself with a gun if soldiers come with a tank? If US soldiers would obey a dictator, you would be powerless.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 02:52 PM
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Outside of America we can still own firearms, We too are in to hunting and target shooting, the difference is that there is a process to go through in order to get a firearms licence that includes sitting a test like a car licence and having your house inspected by the police to ensure you have safe storage facilities for the firearms. people with criminal records cannot get a licence and a licence can be revoked if you have beenfound to be acting irresponsibly, in other words it is a privelege that comes with responsibilities rather than a right. Of course in any society there is a black market for guns and they do fall into criminal hands, we do have shootings but not very many.

For me the problem occurs when people can walk the streets with firearms, when they can have a pistol under their bed for intruders and when the police are fully armed. Of course under these circumstances the criminals are going to want to be better armed. it ends up being a pissing contest between lawful and unlawful groups as to who can outgun the other,

It scares the hell out of me seeing the situation in America, unfortunately good law abiding intelligent citizens are not the people that walk around carrying these weapons, it seems to be the less intelligent, bush voting yokels that have the loudest voice on this issue,

For me personally, i am happy living in a society with effective gun control.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 03:24 PM
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reply to post by BlackOps719
 

The reason it is illegal to bear arms in Australia is that we had a mass shooting in Tasmania that killed a load of people. The government stepped in and decided to ban most firearms. You can only own a firearm if you belong to a shooting club or if it is a part of the way you earn your living ie culling native animals like kangaroos or you are an olympic athlete.
The argument that you are going to need your firearms if the American govt becomes too powerful is really a mute point. The reason I say this is that I have been watching a DVD by a Dr. Deagle (you can find him on youtube) and he talks about some pretty hair raising stuff. Even for the likes of a hard-core Ufologist like me!
The technology that has been planned on using to control the world will not involve force or violence, it will be biological warfare. And that is just the beginning of it!! Forget about your weapons, concentrate on educating yourself by researching all the information you can about what the ET's want to share with us. eg how we can maybe change the planet with our thoughts and by getting closer to each other. And by evolving spiritually.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 03:35 PM
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reply to post by fozotronic
 


The only exception I would take with one of your statements is that good, intelligent, law abiding citizens don't carry around firearms. When I got my concealed carry permit, I was subjected to a rigorous background check.

No problems. I am college educated, older than I prefer, and have never, ever, been in trouble with the law, if you excuse periodic traffic violations.

In fact, those times I was stopped by the law for a traffic violation, each time in addition to handing the officer my driver's license, I also handed him my concealed weapon permit. Each time, the officer would visibly relax. You see, he knew instantly that I was a fairly good citizen, I took the initiative to inform him I was armed, and that there was little to be concerned about.

I much rather all good citizens be armed, legally, than not. We live in different areas. Here, our circumstances are a bit different and we are a bit more subject to random violence. It's not my fault. I just don't want to be a victim, nor will I stand by when someone else is being a victim.

I'm glad for you that you live where you can feel safe. But please don't judge us in America too harshly for the situation we find ourselves in today.



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 04:45 PM
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The united states is vast. We are sovereign in our country, we are sovereign in our state, we are sovereign in our community and we are sovereign in our homes. We are the govt. From what I can tell the constitution and law was to limit govt. not the individual. The individual in early United States was king and could do whatever he pleased. as long as what pleases this man doesnt step on the toes of some other man from doing what he pleases then its lawful.

and owning a gun is a right, we are man, and our country is huge, all these federal laws disgust me, the federal govt is subject to the individual states. not the other way around.
THINK GLOBAL ACT LOCAL always.


and id rather an individual get a gun and kill a few people who also have guns, than for a powerful govt with a well endowed police dept on every corner to decide to kill people who have ignorantly given up the right to defend themselves.

How do you think Hitler killed all those people.

Did you read The Lord Of the Rings? or even watch the movie, its so true that men desire power, and are easily corrupted. do not for a minute think that the bad guys are citizens gone crazy. People are generally good, govts are corrupt. they kill people.\

Btw I think it is swell that you are all so small, small countries are easier to remove bad govt.

I shudder to think of what must be done if and when our country loses its mind and puts us at risk of nuclear attacks from countries that are fed up with our arrogance. russia for example. without guns how do we stop our govt from inevitably invoking wrath from the BEAR!

law



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 04:56 PM
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and another thing it wont just be biological warfare. did you see what those thugs did at the dnc or the rnc

they arrested a whole block of people. MASS ARREST. WTF the cops were all chanting in unison.

please Cops and govt are set up to protect people from other people, they are downright arresting law abiding citizens, oh im so sorry but The american people have been asleep. When the american people find out what our govt did to innocent iraq citizens they are going to bring about swift justice



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 06:33 PM
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TextTextText BlackAs an Australian the answer to the initial question is best answered by saying that the premise of the question is wrong.

In Australia a sane responsible person can own a firearm after checks and a licence is issued. Certain firearms, with little argument for need (Assault weapons etc), are illegal for good reason. We still have rights, regulated like all sane democracies.

Your question begs other questions:

1.) Why do Americans resent ANY regulations on users of guns or type of weapons if the base argument is personal defence ?

2.) Isn't the question you should be debating really why American seems so keen on killing each other in such numbers whilst claiming to be a god fearing country ? I still think Michael Moore got it right in his cartoon on the subject - au.youtube.com...

3.) How will any gun help you defend yourself against a government where you have already lost all your rights ? How does your gun help when you can be detained without anyone knowing, removed to and tortured in another jurisdiction and if you survive that, remain in detention without legal recourse ?

Those of us outside the US who have seen you suspend many of your civil rights under the Patriot Act wonder how this debate has currency. Cheney and your new era of Executive Authority seems at odds with the rights debate when a President interprets the constitution as necessary without review.

I would say "so what" except your Government often leads our Governments into your worst excesses.

Fingers crossed for the 1st Tuesday. Is it any wonder the world speaks with one voice about next President ... Go Obama !



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 08:14 PM
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in USA you apply for a permit to own a gun and then you go buy a gun

in Australia we apply for a permit to own a gun and go and buy a gun

just because it is not in the constitution does not mean we are forbidden to ever have a gun - we can have a gun and some people have many guns - but the majority of people do not see a reason to buy a gun

I can google for all the Australia states but this link refers to Australian capital territory regulations

www.afp.gov.au...

Permit to acquire firearms
To acquire a firearm you will need a firearms licence and a permit for each firearm you intend to acquire.

The cost of obtaining a permit to acquire a firearm is $20 ($10 for the permit and $10 for the cost of registering the firearm in the name of the holder).

The Firearms Registrar cannot issue a permit to acquire a firearm until 29 days after the date of application. Purchasers then have a further 30 days to make their purchase through a firearms dealer or a club armourer.

Firearm permits
The Firearms Registrar may issue permits for:

shortening or conversion of firearms
collecting ammunition
selling or transferring of firearms in certain circumstances
the possession of firearms in ‘other circumstances’ provided for in the regulations, including film or theatrical productions.
The requirements for a firearm permit are similar to the requirements for a firearms licence. A permit is valid for up to five years, depending on the circumstances and the Firearm Registrar's discretion.

Special need permits
In addition to meeting the genuine reason for ownership of a firearm, applicants for category B, C and H firearms are required to satisfy the Firearms Registrar that they have a special need to possess or use the firearm. Special needs are determined by the Firearms Registrar on an individual basis.

Category B firearms
Applicants who satisfy the Firearms Registrar that a category A firearms licence will not carry out the job required, are able to apply for a category B firearms licence.

Category C firearms
The following groups may apply for category C firearms:

Primary producers who show a special need for a category C firearm where category A or B firearms will not do the job required.
Members of a club affiliated with the Australian Clay Target Association Incorporated (ACTA), who at 15 November 1996, possessed a semi automatic or pump action shotgun for use in clay target competition, or in the case of a new applicant, can demonstrate a physical need for a category C firearm in order to compete in clay target events, and has the written support of an officer of an ACTA affiliated club. There are other specific requirements with which prospective members should acquaint themselves. Further information is available from the Firearms Registry.
Collectors who possess a firearm collectors licence and who intend to include a category C firearm in their collection. Any category C firearms in the collection must be rendered permanently inoperable.
Category D firearms
These are available to collectors who possess a firearm collectors licence and who intend to include a category D firearm in their collection (any category D firearms in the collection must be rendered permanently inoperable), or persons authorised by the Attorney-General of Australia.

Firearm permits for juniors (12-18 years of age)
Juniors between 12 and 18 years of age may apply for a minors firearms permit for:

training
target shooting
competition
other shooting purposes.
A minors firearms permit allows persons under the age of 18 to participate in firearms training and competitions under strict supervision.

read more for yourself



posted on Nov, 2 2008 @ 08:36 PM
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We need to clarify something about the questions asked in the OP.

Aussies did not give up our rights, they were forcefully removed from us without our consent.

This was done as what "appeared" to be a knee-jerk reaction by our government, but in fact it was simply a part of the overall outcome sought from the instigated events in Tasmania.

I say instigated events because as President of a research group at the time, I was privvy to some very interesting reports from strong sources, proving beyond doubt that the whole scenario is/was a part of a larger agenda in play around the world.

My answer then is I do regret that our government had taken away our only ability to defend ourselves as a nation against future northern aggressors... which we have trained on our own soil and for which our small military capability will be useless.

While many survivalist have caches of arms stored, they must realise that ammunition will run out and leave you with only a Stick in your hands.

Better then to purchase an old fashioned Bow, learn how to maintain it and make new arrows, new strings, etc, in order to be able to defend yourself from aggressors whether they be domestic or otherwise... and better to be able to feed youself in the extremely tough times we will find ourselves in over the next 4 years.



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 12:07 PM
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being in the uk, my father has a shotgun to which you do need a licence to hold such a weapon and to which i have no acess too.. where as a hand gun of any kind is completely against the law to have and gets you some thing like 5 or 7 years in jail just having one.

I dont think that we need as the general public to have any kind of firearms, guns are made for one purpose too kill!!.. it would only cause huge death rates in the uk any way.. If the US had the same law im sure that their death rate would fall..


its ok yeah we need them to defend our self against possible attacks and invasions blah blah blah etc... but really is it gonna happen? we the public are not the first line of defence of our home countires.

Guns now days are used by drug dealers and proper "real" gangsters which most people are not going to come in contact with..

im all for defending my own country, but then and only then will i need the right to bear arms to defend my home, family and country.
[edit on 3-11-2008 by solme]

[edit on 3-11-2008 by solme]



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 12:20 PM
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reply to post by solme
 


The last time you folks needed weapons to help repell the 'HUN', you didn't have any. We had to send them to you. It's likely that this will be the case again if ever you wake up and realise it!! Proper Gangsters are taking over your government nearly as fast as here!


Zindo





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