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Obama 2001 Redistribution of Wealth Audio Uncovered

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posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 09:52 PM

Originally posted by midwestmama

Wake up people, before its too late.

I already have.

The People don't have the power.

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 09:57 PM

Originally posted by sos37
How many times does this have to be said to be understood? When you tax the wealthy, they are going to make up for the money taken from them by cutting expenses in other ways.

In other words, take MONEY FROM the wealthy, and the wealthy will cut spending to make up the loss by taking JOBS FROM the middle class.

How many times does this have to be said to be understood? IT has nothing to do with taxing the worthless creeps, it has to do with slave labor overseas. WE STILL (but not much longer) have the most buying power in the world. BEFORE we lose that buying power we need to even the playing field by getting rid of NAFTA while we still have enough buying power to make the greedy bastards bring the factories back. Taxing them slightly more will not deter them they are already outsourcing China to places like Vietnam because we have free trade and will take any cheap goods.

Get rid of NAFTA raise the tariffs on imports and the jobs come back. Wait until we lose enough of our buying power (that is coming soon) and we lose that window of opportunity. Listen to your heart and soul not your corporate mass media brainwashed mind.

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 10:01 PM
I have been on unemployment.....once. Why? The company i worked for moved to mexico. What for? Lower taxes....lower salaries.

I was guaranteed 2 years of unemployment because of this. Yes, 2 years. There was even a program that would help pay for you to go to's a provision that the government can allow if you are left unemployed by an employer leaving the country.

How long was i on unemployment? 4 months. The first week...i thought hey...this is kind of check. The second week...started to get bored. The third week i felt like a damn loser because i was bum sitting on my ass doing nothing and gaining nothing. What did i have to do? Had to move in with family. Wasn't the greatest time of my life to say the least. But eventually i did get a job. IF people try hard enough they will get one. It's a sucky process, and for those who care about not being can be self degrading. Others will suck it dry for all it's worth. THAT is the problem.

I moved to Michigan after leaving Indiana while receiving unemployment benefits from indiana. What was my requirement to keep receiving my check? Fill out an online form with at least one job that was applied for. Anyone can lie their butts off and odds are it wouldn't be checked and they keep receiving their money without doing a single thing. I didn't do it and i could of. People knowingly take advantage of this and don't care...but yet they still have the money to buy dvds, cds, video games, etc.

Often, when i'm at break at work (i park on the street across from the building), people will ask me for a cigarette as they walk by. (Yes i'm a smoker) I always give them up...even though i don't want to as they aren't cheap and i can barely afford them myself. The last time this happened....a woman came up to me and asked for one...i gave her two. She said thanks and walked away. 5 minutes later she came back up to me with a big stack of stapled papers...they looked like hospital/doctor documents...i really didn't look at them i just noticed the papers were wadded up and dirty.

Anyway, the woman started to talk..and as she talked...she began crying. She pointed to the papers and said that she had cancer (I can't remember what kind of cancer sorry). She asked if i could spare some money as she was hungry and had no money to eat. I reached in my pocket to see what i had...and i rarely have any money as i don't like to carry it on me, but i had 6 dollars. I gave it to the woman and she thanked me and left. I remember feeling horrible because it was all i had.

But later i started to think more of the situation. I thought...well she bummed a smoke off me....then came back and told me she had cancer, which you'd think if you had cancer of any kind you should probably quit smoking, and asked for money. I couldn't help but think that she was going to go buy some smokes with that money. I hope that wasn't the case but i'll never know for sure.

There are many layers to people that don't have much. There are those that were put in that situation that was not in their control. There are some who have let there life deteriorate by drug or alchohol use. There are some who just don't give a damn and are looking for nothing but a handout.

I do understand that those people need help, but the government implemented programs are always extremely flawed and wasteful. It gives people a reason to not work and earn a living.

Another problem is that people are a product of their environment. If you are born in raised in a violent neighborhood, the odds aren't with you to get out. If you are born in a good neighborhood your chances are much better. That is something that needs to be fixed...and it ties in with education.

I believe in a limited government. I think people should be helped...but not to the degree that the government has to have such a large part in their lives. Government should be smaller. Taxes should be smaller. Everyone would benefit from this.

Yes there should be some government ran programs....but it's to the point now where they have their hands in everything. I feel it needs to end.

Very sorry for the long post....didn't realize i went on for so long

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 10:06 PM
reply to post by David9176

Maybe she needed a cigarette to relieve some of the stress she was experiencing because she found out she had cancer? Rationally it doesn't add up, but it could have been entirely emotional. I don't think it's fair to assume when people ask for things from other people they are trying to 'suck the bones dry'. I realize that was not what you were getting at with that specific example, I am just extending it to that. I think what we are talking about in this thread could just be like that example but on a larger scale. Some see 'social welfare eek' and others see 'people in need'.

[edit on 27-10-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 10:09 PM
reply to post by LoneGunMan

Last time I checked NAFTA had nothing to do with China and India or Ireland.

Do you really want the jobs back? Really really?

Quit buying everything that is made outside of the USA.

Of course you better be willing to pay a hell of a lot more.

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 10:11 PM
reply to post by Lucid Lunacy

I'm not like that. Even when i think that there is a possibility that i'm being scammed...i always give. It happens whenever i go to Chicago. I"m always asked for money and i always give what i have...and i don't have much trust me. Often i regret giving it away but i would have a tough time ever telling anyone no...and i actually never have...unless i had nothing to give.

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 10:26 PM
reply to post by Hastobemoretolife

Obama is not a Marxist he is Democratic Socialists. Socialism comes in many different flavors. IF you want to know more please visit the following link.

A little Tax Humor:

Subj: Our Tax System Explained in Terms of Beer (S613c)
From: tom on 10/8/2008
Using actual percentages, the impact of a tax cut, and the
public reaction that everyone should be able to understand.

Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill
for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way
we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:

The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
The fifth would pay $1.
The sixth would pay $3.
The seventh would pay $7.
The eighth would pay $12.
The ninth would pay $18.
The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that's what they decided to do. The ten men drank in
the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement,
until one day, the owner threw them a curve. "Since you are
all such good customers," he said, "I'm going to reduce the
cost of your daily beer by $20. "Drinks for the ten now cost
just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our
taxes, so the first four men were unaffected. They would
still drink for free. But what about the other six men -
the paying customers? How could they divide the $20 wind-
fall so that everyone would get his 'fair share?'

They realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if
they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the
fifth man and the sixth man would each end up being paid
to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it
would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the
same amount, and he proceeded to work out the amounts
each should pay.

And so -

The fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing
(100% savings).
The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).
The seventh now pay $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).
The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).
The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 ( 22% savings).
The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

Each of the six was better off than before. And the
first four continued to drink for free. But once
outside the restaurant, the men began to compare
their savings.

"I only got a dollar out of the $20," declared the
sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man," but he got

"Yeah, that's right," exclaimed the fifth man. "I
only saved a dollar, too. It's unfair that he got
ten times more than I!"

"That's true!!" shouted the seventh man. "Why should
he get $10 back when I got only two? The wealthy get
all the breaks!"

"Wait a minute," yelled the first four men in unison.
"We didn't get anything at all. The system exploits
the poor!"

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.
The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks,
so the nine sat down and had beers without him. But
when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered

In my opinion, Taxes will always be un-fair. My Challenge to you is to come up with a sytems that works for everyone.

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 10:42 PM
Doesn't the actual tax law and codes say that the only people that should even be paying federal income tax , even a penny of it, is people who work outside of the united states, and live in the United States?

Somewhere I ran into this, is it propaganda? They say there are millions of americans who don't pay taxes and don't get prosecuted because the IRS doesn't want to bring the actual tax code to a public light.

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 10:51 PM
The problem is our capitalist system isn't really capitalist, it is in a sorry state. In a correct capitalist society, there would be plenty of wealth for everyone. So the people that turn to socialism are probably tired of this broken capitalist system. I can't be certain of this, I haven't researched it much, but I'd take a socialist system over a broken capitalist system. Of course, the number one choice on my list would be true capitalism but it just isn't going to happen.

Qualities of capitalism needed for it to function:

Competition - Companies hate it, and it doesn't exist in many areas. Look at buying drugs in Canada as an example. The medical system and education systems in America have no competition hardly.

Market-based - Not exactly, prices should be lower on some products probably but lack of competition is a problem.

Laissez Faire - yeah, also not really existent. Government is way too involved in things.

So when things are weakened, the consumer/middle class gets screwed which is what is happening now, helps the rich though. Weak capitalism = wealth distribution to rich.

[edit on 27-10-2008 by ghaleon12]

[edit on 27-10-2008 by ghaleon12]

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 11:04 PM
It seems that before every Presidential election the candidates promise
extremely expensive programs that end up being whittled/watered down,
or never enacted at all. I remember all the extreme emotions surrounding
the Clinton's desire to revamp the health insurance system in the early
1990's. Lots of passionate pleas from uninsured folks on the airwaves, but
not a single aspect of their program was ever enacted.

A common sense approach, based on the history of these campaigns,
would indicate that isn't much to fear, or to hope for, from either Obama
or McCain. People love to label politicans as masterful liars. So why get
so emotional over what they say if they are not truthful or reliable??

[edit on 27-10-2008 by carewemust]

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 11:11 PM
reply to post by flashL3

Taxes on the rich under the Clinton Administration was 39%. They are now currently 36%. Obamas Tax plan would let the tax cuts expire for the those making more then $250,000 a year. Allowing the Tax to revert back to 39%

Most of the rich that I know do not pay even close to 36% percent of their income to the IRS. THese people have great accountants that use every Legal loop hole to help them keep most of their wealth

If I were rich I would be more worried about Congress closing all of the Tax Loopholes then a 3% tax increase.

[edit on 27-10-2008 by Justice123]

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 11:19 PM
reply to post by Justice123

No, he is a Marxist read his plans on his website, "voluntary"community service for kids aged between 14-24, Zero - Five education, An even more progressive tax policy than what we have now, etc.

Those are socialist policies. The thing that puts him over the edge is the way the campaign acts when confronted with stuff they don't like. Such as trying to get the DOJ to get independent organizations to not run ads that don't show him in a positive light, blacklisting news stations that don't ask the "right" questions.

This audio is even a bigger example of it. He disagrees with our constitution in the fact it doesn't say what the government can do. He wants the constitution interpreted from the judges bench.

He wants the government involved in even more of our lives. Also it doesn't help his case that David Alinsky, Saul Alinsky's son, described his acceptance speech at the DNC in August as executed how Saul Alinsky would have wanted.( )

Saul Alinsky being the guy who wrote Rules for Radicals, and compared himself to Satan.

A socialist would be Bernie Sanders (I-VT) he is an open socialist and both him and Biden are even more left than him. ( )

I might not be the smartest guy in the world, but Socialist polices, trying to silence the opposition, then a praise from a Communist guru's son, adds up in my book to being a Marxist, and that is being nice about it.

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 11:23 PM
reply to post by Justice123

Figure 1 suggests that recent movements in the tax data are inconsistent with Obama's perspective. The top line indicates the share of income taxes paid by the top 10 percent of taxpayers. The bottom line indicates the share of income taxes paid by the bottom 90 percent. In 2006, the top 10 percent of earners paid fully 70.8 percent of taxes. That is significantly above the 2000 peak of 67.3 percent--before the Bush tax cut.


Seems like the rich paid more even with Bush tax cut.....

Go figure......

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 11:35 PM
reply to post by flashL3

Looks like it's too much to ask for anyone in the U.S. to make any kind of sacrifice when it comes to taxes. This country is ten trillion in debt, it's not getting any better and no one is willing to make any type of sacrifice to get us out of debt. It's not socialism it's nationalism, once upon a time this country had a great amount of national pride and now it no longer exists.

We will pay what we need to pay and we will hold our govt accountable and punish them when they mess up - again. I'm not voting and really don't care who wins next month. I'd still rather see Obama win it over McCain. Nothing personal against McCain, I just think he's a butthole and we've already had eight years of butthole.

One thing about Bush and his go shopping when times are tough mentality, I actually agree. We do need to keep this economy going so everyone go out and buy something - there's some good cheap stocks available or go take a vacation.

posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 11:54 PM
reply to post by jitombe

The problem is that we are not willing to pay higher taxes, I'm not going to sit here and lie to you and say we will gladly pay higher taxes, when the government isn't spending the tax money now how it should be spent.

Instead of cutting the budget these people that get elected decide to raise taxes. Which would be the appropriate, logical, right thing to do.

Then we also have the problem that as long as the fed keeps printing money we will be in debt. We have never not had a debt ever since the forefathers established the US.

Besides 10 trillion in the hole is a lot of ground to make up and I don't think it is possible.

posted on Oct, 28 2008 @ 12:00 AM
One thing I learned early in my finance career is that the people
(Congress/Senate/Attorneys/Judges) who make tax laws in this
country have business or business-owner backgrounds.

They put in place tax-breaks that even the average person can
take advantage of if they start some type of business. If you
pay a few hundred dollars and start one of the MLM type of
businesses, like Amway, Isagenix, etc., you are instantly
empowered to lower your taxable income and therefore, the
amount of taxes paid to Uncle Sam. Just Google "tax deductions
for home based businesses" and you'll see what I mean. For example,
if you take a cruise (or any vacation) with your family and hand
out some business cards upon arriving at your destination, the
cost of that "working vacation" is deductible as a business expense.

Regardless of what Obama, or McCain would do to shift around
the tax burden, there will always be legal loopholes for businesses
and business owners. To change this would be tantamount to the
country leadership shooting themselves in the foot. That aint gonna
happen. My advice is to get in the game and learn how to keep
the maximum amount of your hard earned dollars for your family.

posted on Oct, 28 2008 @ 12:04 AM

Originally posted by Karlhungis
I am curious why so many republicans are so worried about this? Wealth is currently being redistributed from the working class to the upper class. Obama seems to want to give more to the middle class and below, by taxing the wealthy.

I don't understand why it is hunkey dorey to funnel the wealth to the rich, but it is blasphemy to even suggest the distribution of more of the money to the working people? It seems like an interesting double standard to me. What is really strange to me is that most of the people who are crying about it are people who would actually benefit from it. Most are using talking points that have been generated by people who would be hurt by it though.

Are you living in the same reality? The "Wealthy" already pay 70%-80% of our TAXES. Should they now pay 100% of ALL Federal Income tax, and at the same time increase handouts to lazy bums? The reason everyone is against it, is that it goes against the very fabric that is AMERICA. If you enjoy a Socialist system, MOVE to Europe. America is the one place where you are rewarded for your hard work ethic, and ingenuity. Placing a greater tax-rate upon the "Rich" creates a cap above which it becomes more, and more difficult to breech. This in turn creates a Government reliant populace, wherein you are indentured, and in effect a slave to the Federal System. If you attempt independence, your chances of failing become greater then ever.

I personally know plenty of citizens who already abuse the "Welfare" system, wherein they are able to work, but they sit around all day watching TV, yet they receive an apartment, money for food, clothing, etc., and they have to do nothing for it. Then, they begin to breed like rabbits, because they receive Monthly Paychecks for each child. Then they neglect their children, even though they do nothing but sit around all day, and their kids end up growing up with the same philosophy and lack of work ethic. It is a vicious cycle, and with Senator Obama's proposals for Socialized Education, Socialized Health Care, etc., this influence will only INCREASE.

On top of all of that, Senator Obama is proposing to give all of these citizens Government style benefits. Government benefits? Is he MAD?! These Benefits are one of the few aspects which drive individuals towards Government Employment, which is a field that does NOT have a very high salary rate. So now Government Employees can have these benefits without working? So American Citizens can now have great Government benefits, which exceed their Provider benefits? What is to keep these Employees from dropping their Provider coverage and going with the Government "Welfare" system? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. Why do you think it FAILED in Hawaii in only 7 Months?

You are completely wrong as well, for Senator Obama is going to raise nearly ALL Americans' Taxes. Check out the Marginal Tax Rate:

Senator Obama: The Tax Truth

ALSO, this entire issue of the Radio Interview in 2001 has MORE to it than Senator Obama "simply" discussing "Wealth Redistribution". You can read what I wrote here, and understand the real issue:

Senator Obama: "Constitution Is A Constraint That Must Be Overcome"

posted on Oct, 28 2008 @ 12:10 AM
What surprises me the most about all this issue of tax policy is that even with the time that McCain and his supporters has spent trying to portray Obama as a socialist he still favored in the polls as the best option to resolve our crisis.

When it comes to this issue the problem is not that Obama's plan is that great, is appealing to the masses but not great, but is certainly better than whatever John McCain is offering this week, I can't keep track of how many times he has change his economic plan.

The reality is IMO, that whoever wins is going to raise taxes regardless and accross the board, that just the economic reality that we are facing, also they would have no choice but to cut government spending.

McCain is done talking about the issues, he can't win on those so I would expect more of this, which by the way is fair game IMO, but just reeks of desperation, I think most people have just turned a deaf ear to this type of stuff.

I have decided long ago to vote for Obama, still is not a vote of confidence is a vote to first, prevent McCain to reach the White House (I dont like his policies AT ALL, I would have voted for Romney though), and second a vote for change, but I will still have my fingers crossed.

posted on Oct, 28 2008 @ 12:14 AM
Have you guys ever been to a drivers license, social security, or any
other government office? Ever notice how they don't seem to be in
a hurry, or even care about much of anything? The more government
intrudes into our society, the more lethargic zombies we'll have to
deal with. I worked for the government for 2 nightmarish years on
a special project. People who want little out of life were in heaven.
For me, it was hell.

The people who are driven and/or feel that they are unique, flock to
America in droves. "The land of opportunity" isn't just a hollow
phrase, or slogan. It embodies what America is all about and why
people to this very moment are risking their lives to get here by foot
and in makeshift boats.

There should be more government regulation of certain industries,
but for the most part, Uncle Sam should leave free enterprise alone.

posted on Oct, 28 2008 @ 12:38 AM
I think some of the biggest critics of "Capitalism" are hypocrites. You have these high $$$ earning "entertainers" backing Obama and his "spread the wealth" mentality. If they are so fond of spreading the wealth, then donate to a damn charity!

On the other end, the other critics of "Capitalism" are those who haven't gained anything from it, or, "the poor". Yet, "the poor" sit back and watch Oprah or Jerry Springer during the day on their LCD TV's fattening themselves up on Government Assistance Food, when most of us work to make a living. The middle class who are voting for this idiot "Obama" are just plain ignorant or self-righteous in their liberal beliefs, or, they have the "white guilt" the Democrats are so capitalizing on.

If Socialism works so damned well, maybe you should consider renouncing your citizenship and moving to Europe. Hell, go to North Korea, China, Cuba, or Vietnam. North Korea would be excellent for you! Kim Jong Il had his citizens go "green" long before anyone else did, requiring his citizens to turn off all lights after nightfall to save on greenhouse gas emissions from their powerplants. I like all the pictures coming out of North Korea of families huddled around their LCD TV's at night, lights off of course. The young ones are on their laptops posting on ATS about how GREAT "spreading the wealth" has worked for them! And lets not forget the fond memories of Pol Pot in Cambodia, how every citizen (that is left after the "killing fields") has the wealth spread so even between them!

You people amaze me. You will support a government system that has a history of the most atrocities against its own citizens because you don't know any better. Maybe in a few years, when Obama has one of his thugs knock on your door because you DARED to speak out against him, you will learn.

On a side note, here is an adage I live by:

Be careful what you ask for. You might get it.

[edit on 28-10-2008 by CreeWolf]

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