Obama 2001 Redistribution of Wealth Audio Uncovered

reply to post by ashamedamerican


Well facts are that some of those poor are nothing but leeches that I a middle class tax payer am supporting through those same taxes.

I see people come in and work jobs for a few weeks/months quit, buy their new toy then do nothing until that money runs out. Then they sit back later and ask for government assistance because they need food/shelter or whatever to sustain life. Many could do better or had a better chance (before the ultra rich CEOs ran things into the crap hole) through working some place and trying to get an education. Many places offer student reimbursement that many refuse to use because they are happy just easing along because they can spend more time playing. I even work with a few that said I was crazy for going back to school and eventually quit my job because that job was my “bread and butter”. Bull if I get the education that will take some away from my personal life right now I can get a better more secure job in the future. But these people are happy to sit back and slack off because it requires less of them. Then they sit back and complain about how much the rich have and how little they have just like many on ATS. Boo freaking hoo, I am not rich either I am paying for my own schooling because my education is not what I would use at my current job so they said screw you. I am doing things on my own because I have the goals set and priorities to want to move forward and stop living like some childish sitcom character that mindlessly goes through life working, eating, and sleeping until I die. I want more and I am moving in that way but without stealing from those who already have it.

I understand that there are plenty now who are out of a job because of CEOs running things into the crapper. But a lot of those even are the same that were comfortable in living a life just like the guy I explained above. The choice was not made for them; they just listened to the propaganda around them and believed they could never have better. It is all about choice in the end either you chose to believe that you are worthless or you try to prove you are not. Even if you fail at reaching the highest goal you fall someplace in between which is better than where you started.

And this is coming from someone who at one time had no high school diploma, but decided one day to change things and stop believing the crap that was beaten into my head about how I am poor and will never succeed. This is coming from one who one day decided to step out and fight back against societies labels they place on others and show that anyone who tries can succeed even if it is only slightly.

Raist

Originally posted by Raist

I believe all sides should be working the same.

Which is called Socialism

A society run by and for the working class, which everyone is a member of. That's the same side.

It is being put into the minds of the youth that it is okay to steal from the rich and give to the poor.

If you support the classes of "rich" and "poor" then there will always be that kind of stealing, as there always has

As I said I am far from ever making that much but I am not for taking what I did not earn either.

Socialism is not for you earning what you didn't work for either.

Only those who are just as selfish as the ultra rich stealing from the poor would believe in such a thing.

Rich people in a capitalistic system that steal money from the poor under the guise of something that sounds socialistic does not make it socialism.

My belief in a society based largely on socialism (including other) stems from my conviction to help my neighbors, all of them. Please don't assume I am this horribly selfish evil being.

tax the rich... the very rich need to pay their fair share... the market collapses.... where are they? patriots? hardly... in a country that has laboured as if enslaved the rich continue to worry about how they'll get to keep their summer home in the Hamptons... disgusting if you ask me... they should donate their money.. give it back to the people who made it for them... with people walking miles a day to draw water from a muddy puddle in some country that shoots you for voting the wrong way and people are worried about having the sell their boats? man... greed sure is alive and well on earth... no wonder things are such a mess... its easy to rule and rape when you know how stupid and materialistic people are... oh yeah... trickle down economics works just fine... when people make millions they have a few extra crumbs to hire more gardners and car washers... i say seize all their wealth... they didn't work for it... they made you work for it... when do you think the last time Warren Buffet cleaned out a fryer trap or shovelled maggots from behind a restaurant... wake up people... you've been duped into imagining you could really attain the "american dream"... don't you know that's why its called a "dream"... i've never heard of the american reality.. oh yes i have... its living inner city with no support or cash or food... trusting your government that they are doing what's best for you... lol... man i can't catch my breath i'm laughing so hard... and then come the tears...

Originally posted by Marcus Calpurnius
This is what we face folks. Posting stuff like this on this forum is pointless, because its full of Marxists, socialist and Communists.

You need but look under my name to see what I consider myself. Thanks for the courtesy.

I think many people voting for Obama are either just gullible, or they are truly Marxist/Socialists.

I am probably not voting for Obama. The only reason I would is to vote against McCain. I am undecided. So much for your assumption.

The one message I have for you Lucid Lunacy, is that you better be willing to fight for it, because many Americans would rather die than let their country be hijacked like that. People will fight.

Your passive aggressive hostility is not needed. I don't want to fight with you.

I would be fighting for you.

[edit on 27-10-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]

Originally posted by Karlhungis
I am curious why so many republicans are so worried about this? Wealth is currently being redistributed from the working class to the upper class. Obama seems to want to give more to the middle class and below, by taxing the wealthy.

Taxing the rich? do you really think the elite rich will be taxed more they are the ones paying for Obamas election and McCains.

How many rich live in the US? Do they have their accounts here or on an Island? Big Money buys complete anonymity.

And even if they did tax them more I wouldn't want the tax base, because taxing a small minority on large amounts of money made is insignificant. Bring back the steady jobs that actually produce something.

Look at the current track record in history or current history. Government forces bailout, tossed right back in our faces arrogantly.

Remember this and you will know the truth. " The Government produces nothing, it consumes" your sweat equity it's always been that way.

Congress is majority Democrats, even though they are all the same IMO.

Obama will give nothing, because he doesn't have the money and one person does not make the decisions. Wake up!

The elite or cartel pay for both sides in any presidential election, so they actually never lose their power control grip.




[edit on 27-10-2008 by Realtruth]

Originally posted by deathhasnosound
They made their own choice and now they are poor because of it.
Plenty examples out there where people have pulled themselves out of the gutter and decided to not be victims. Obama for one is a good example.

Please tell me you are joking...
Sure there are people who (against all odds) manage to get out of the situation that was CHOSEN FOR THEM, but not all of them CAN.
Why? Because most of them can't even see the prison they are living in.
The federal reserve was illegally created, and now roughly 30% of ALL our incomes ILLEGALLY go to pay off the debt incured when our government borrows this money from the federal reserve.
This money does NOT go towards ANY government program(not one penny), it goes directly into the pockets of the vampires who control the federal reserve.

Now you tell me... how can someone making minimum wage, who also has to give up roughly 30% of their income (illegally) to elitist "decide not to be victims" as you so ignorantly worded it?

Originally posted by vor78
reply to post by Marcus Calpurnius

 

You know, its funny Marcus, his supporters will spend all this time defending Obama against charges that he's a socialist and tell you that he's definitely NOT one, then turn right around and tell you how great socialism is.

You know what is even funnier!??

The fact you both ASSUMED I am voting for Obama. When I have said many many times on ATS that I am undecided, and am probably voting for Ron Paul.

I am not defending Obama. You are making a connection where there is none.

reply to post by Raist


I'm not saying that EVERY person below the poverty line is not a leech, there are many who are just that.
However to lump every person below the poverty line into one large group and label it leech is by far one of the most ignorant things I have ever witnessed.

Your logic is the product of the very problem that has gotten america into this mess in the first place. People thinking that everyone "below them" is inferior, and deserves what they have gotten.

I'm not talking about the people who CHOOSE to be homeless, (and yes there are people who DO choose this) I'm talking about the people struggling to buy food for their families, put clothes on their childrens backs, and buy heating oil to keep their family from freezing to death.
Those people ARE the victims of the elitist trash who keep them in their station in life, with no hope of ever getting out of it, because they are too busy struggling just to get through another day.

Before we talk about "redistribution of wealth", let's look at the current distribution of wealth in the US...

PLEASE watch this 3.5 minute video. It's VERY informative.

reply to post by flashL3


I jut cant believe how brainwashed most of the Republicans have become. They redistribute the wealth to the rich and we get nothing but a disappearance of the middle class, then someone like Obama steps in to redistribute it back to us and the republican middle class freaks out. WTF.

Its just too crazy.

Its like everything is upside down.

You people have been talked into believing that import tariffs are bad while all of our good paying jobs go overseas. We need to have a fair playing field when competing against Chinese slave labor and you guys just dont get it because big corporate think tanks have figured out how to talk you into anything they are selling. No one but Americans buy American goods anymore and we need to be able to have our goods made here at least be able to compete in our own country. We are the number one consumers, but if we keep losing ours jobs overseas it wont matter because we will be a third world nation and then not have any buying power.

If we can level the platying field so WE buy our own goods the jobs will come back. If we wit much longer they wont and China and India will be the new focus for selling goods and we will be a husk. Wake the hell up please.

reply to post by Comind


Ok so Buffet pays 17% on 46 million of taxable income (first off his tax bracket should be 35%) so he paid 7.2 million in taxes. Nowhere in the article does it say how much is receptionist is making so there is also noway to tell how much she gets paid, but if you go back to where my post where the tax brackets are posted on 78,000 dollars of income is a tax bracket of 28% which means that she is out of the 35-45% that gets a tax return.

Sounds to me that somebody is gaming the system for him to pay 17% on taxable income then he is pulling a Steve Jobs and paying himself a low salary and earning his income off of capital gains. Because if he was paying himself 1 million a year (for example) that 35% would be taken out automatically. Conveniently the capital gains tax is 15%. Then with him being the 3rd riches person in the world, my logic tells me that no matter what tax system we are under he ill not be effected.

I think both of the candidates suck and neither one of them has the right plans for this country. This country is in a total economic mess, business taxes are too high and NAFTA made it where corporations could go over seas and make more money importing their goods to the US than they could making them here.

I'm all for the fair tax, but the biggest proponents of it don't understand it. The reason why a lot of people in government are against it is because they lose a lot of control over us.

With the way it is now the government can give tax incentives in areas that they want to grow. For example, give tax incentives for green cars everybody runs and buys new green cars.

What a lot of people don't understand it isn't the riches fault, it is the politicians fault for this mess that we are in. The government makes and passes laws. The companies write bills lobby a congress member, the congress member introduces the bill drums up support and it gets passed and in turn screws us. The congress member could tell them to hike, but they don't because the company comes along with a "contribution."

It is governments fault for this whole thing. The government has to much power.

We don't need change we need reform.

reply to post by Raist


I posted this in another thread, and I will continue to do so whenever I see an uneducated Neo Conservative spout classist talking points they don't really know about. Please take the time to research "social welfare" programs in the United States and how many (let me emphasize this for you) MILLIONS AND MILLIONS OF AMERICAN LIVES they have saved. The food stamp program alone, which you probably were a recipient of, is responsible for saving millions of children's lives, and the earned income tax credit has allowed a huge amount of single mothers who are the largest recipients of welfare to lift them and their children out of poverty.

Social welfare programs also support local and national business, and can greatly add to your local and state economy.

Please, read and research before you attack the poor for being poor and the single mothers who are trying to give their children better lives

Obama is not a pure socialist. The US is not pure capitalism. It needs both to survive, thrive, and remain powerful. Don't let radio and TV hacks tell you what to think. Don't like something? Research it yourself to find out why. Like something? Research it yourself to find out why. You should always ask yourself why.

I've included statistics for your convenience below.

The Food Stamp Program has made severe hunger rare in America. In the late 1960s, medical research exposed the fact that American children suffered and died from diseases related to severe malnutrition that usually are thought of as occurring only in third-world countries. In 1979, after the Food Stamp Program became available nation-wide,
physicians discovered that this severe malnutrition had become rare, a result they
attributed to the Food Stamp Program.

You can also get facts on Food Stamps for each state. Here’s mine, Texas:

FOOD STAMPS HELP VULNERABLE TEXAS RESIDENTS AND THE ECONOMY
• 2,422,198 Texans use food stamps to buy food every month.1 That amounts to 10
percent of the people in Texas.
• Texas food stamp households receive, on average, $1.04 per person per meal in food
stamp benefits. This modest amount is crucial to financially pressed families.
• The Food Stamp Program pumped $2,718,158,343 into the Texas economy last year,
benefiting farmers, grocers, and small businesses throughout the state.2
• About 86 percent of Texas food stamp benefits go to households with children,
many of them in working families.3 Most of the rest go to households containing
elderly people or people with disabilities.

Here’s some more information for you to deny the ignorance that’s dripping from your posts:

Public benefit programs cut the number of poor Americans nearly in half, from 58 million to 31 million.
• Medicaid has been shown to reduce infant mortality and child deaths and to increase the likelihood that low-income women receive preventive screening for breast cancer and cervical cancer.
• While 40 years ago hunger and malnutrition were not uncommon in some poor areas of the country, the federal Food Stamp Program and other nutrition assistance programs such as WIC and the school meals programs have made severe hunger rare in America today.
• By increasing the rewards of low-wage employment, the Earned Income Tax Credit has substantially raised the proportion of single mothers who work, while lifting 2.7 million children out of poverty (in 2002).
• Nearly three million people with severe mental impairments receive help from the Supplemental Security Income program, which enables many of them to live independently.

Center for Budget and Policy Priorities

[edit on 27-10-2008 by Avenginggecko]

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife

It is governments fault for this whole thing. The government has to much power. We don't need change we need reform.

I'll back up that statement 110 percent. I believe you are absolutely right....our government has been too powerful for FAR too long....yet people are willing to let it grow even larger.

When will the madness end.

Originally posted by David9176

I'll back up that statement 110 percent. I believe you are absolutely right....our government has been too powerful for FAR too long....yet people are willing to let it grow even larger.

When will the madness end.

Well I most definitely agree with these sentiments. Too much government. Too much power in higher class.

Originally posted by flashL3
I personally fear it will be like the clinton era where he quoted he would not tax the middle class, but did that happen? hell no. small business owners like my self are going to have to either cut jobs or lose incentive to grow. my 2.5 cents

I'm a small business owner and I can't for the life of me figure out what or why the small business owners are scared stiff of Obama? Since Bush has taken office I have seem my profits fall on the average of about 3-4% per year which is about 1/3 of the fuel cost rise. I mean in the orthodontic laboratory industry and in the D.C. area we are the last to be hit through economic down turn due to all the government jobs.
But I can tell you this... that if you are a true small business owner who knows his business will never hit the 1 million mark in profits per year you'd better be worried about this country and the course it's on now....Cause Last time I check The Republican party and the Democratic party are the only two who have been driving and 20 of the last 28 years have been navigated by Republicans...
It's just funny that everyone wants change but is afraid to vote the change that needs to happen and that means a 3rd party!!!

reply to post by ACEMANN


Once again....Who are the ONLY TWO parties who have been in power and have put this country right where we are NOW! There is where you change should begin!

reply to post by Anonymous ATS


I can't see how you guys think that what they are telling you is the truth behind what they want to do.

Obama, wants to heavily tax the people who make more than 250K a year, I have to tell you that there's a big difference between those that make 250K a year and those that make a million or more a year. 46% of 250K is well over a hundred thousand dollars. So if you make 250K thousand dollars you might as well only make 150K thousand under obama because you LOSE the rest to taxxes. That is HOUSEHOLD incomes by the way not individual. If you make 100K and your wife makes 150K, then you both have to pony up 46%.Now let's look at the tax rebates. He's not talking about giving tax rebates, he's talking about giving checks, similar to the stimulus check to EVERYONE that files a return. That pretty much means anyone that works, whether they pay taxes or not.

Then you'll also have him letting the tax breaks that include no marriage penalty etc... that Bush inacted expire which will put a greater burden on the middle class.

Now McCain.... Mccain wants to reduce the capital gains tax further which would help to unburden the small business owner, but let's be real here, It might help the small business owner but it would help large corporations more. Trickle down economics with proper oversight has been shown to work to a limited extent, but what we really need here is to abloish personal income tax, since we were bamboozled into having it in the first place similar to what's happening right now with all of the socialist measures that are being inacted, and integrate a national sales tax that could be tiered.

You see, I don't have a problem with a national sales tax being tiered based on extravagance. The higher the cost of the item, the higher the tax. I can see that if you want to have luxury items you should be willing to pay for it. That way you can always choose not to buy those luxury items, but not choosing to work harder and make more money is ridiculous and we should not provide incentives for people to avoid improving their situation.

By instituting a carte blanche income tax that is tiered, you are stealing from the rich to give to the poor and increasing incentives to not become rich. It is WRONG. People should get what they work for and if they want more they should do what it takes to get more. The opportunities are there if people wnat them bad enough and are capable.

The whole idea that everyone should be equal is fantasy land. PEople arent equal

If you look at the benefits the super rich, those worth tens of millions and more, get from the federal government, it is clear they don't pay their fair share of taxes. The average working person gets very little direct benefit for the federal government, and yet pays large amounts into the federal government, thereby subsidizing the rich. This needs to change.

Still, we are talking about the top .1% of earners, the Paris Hiltons of the world.

reply to post by poet1b

The average working person gets very little direct benefit for the federal government, and yet pays large amounts into the federal government, thereby subsidizing the rich. This needs to change.

What needs to change is our government's size. It's into everything. If it was smaller....we wouldn't need to be taxed to death..nor would companies. Raising taxes on people who own companies...large or small and who are right now having lots of trouble making profits as it is...what's going to stop them from leaving the country and/or taking their company with them to another country?

reply to post by David9176


Ya, I agree. If the government didn't stick it's nose into everything, they wouldn't need as much money from taxes (I don't think they would let us know that they didn't need as much). Everybody would be happy if the government just "buzzed off". Taxes would be lower, and people who don't like the government breathing down their neck would be satisfied. Everyone would win except for some people in the government how just want power and money.