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Is ATS proof of the dumbing down of America?

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posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:10 AM
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reply to post by ItsTheQuestion
 



Originally posted by ItsTheQuestion
[Oh, and you missed a comma, mein Kamerad.]


Ah crap!
You are right! hehe


In all seriosity, I wish it were.


Perhaps I can barrow this one! Since you don't need it!




posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:14 AM
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Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy

That's because the first rule of grammar club is: you do not talk about grammar club.


Seriously, you are pretty funny...



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:23 AM
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Originally posted by snowen20
reply to post by swdecord
 


Army 8 years been out 2.............Maybe I should have written out the number E>I>G>H>T>.. and the number T>W>O>


Nah...

You served (damn, 8 years and you got out?) and that's all that matters...Good for you...

But, your English sucks


Joking....



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:29 AM
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Originally posted by SonicInfinity
On some of the forums I visit, a sentence like "Your right OP-san ^_^;" would be seen as normal.


If it were moar
liek
that here, I'd be using the
ad infinitum, let alone nauseum.



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:31 AM
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Originally posted by swdecord

Originally posted by snowen20
reply to post by swdecord
 


Army 8 years been out 2.............Maybe I should have written out the number E>I>G>H>T>.. and the number T>W>O>


Nah...

You served (damn, 8 years and you got out?) and that's all that matters...Good for you...

But, your English sucks


Joking....


True...but snowen, you're American is spot-on!



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:32 AM
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Is this thread proof of the dumbing down of ATS?

Sure seems like it!



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:35 AM
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I love commas. Commas and ellipses (which is the plural form of ellipsis, which is this: ...). I put commas wherever I would pause for breath if I was talking. It makes for some wonderful run-on sentences.

I think that poor grammar and spelling online is actually more symptomatic of our need to be heard rather than to stop to hear others, than of a gradual dumbing-down. Although the two may be related.

My big pet peeve is people who use long words in an attempt to sound more important, but misuse them. Like penultimate, which means next-to-last. Grrrrr.


I also hold OPs to higher standards than answers. I think it's important to really think through the presentation of a thread; much more so than in a response.

The one time it really bothers me for people to use poor grammar is when they also fail to capitalize or break their post up into paragraphs. Parsing a wall of undifferentiated letters is difficult enough if I can rely on the words having their official meaning and the grammar to follow what I learned in school. Without that minimum of consideration to a reader, I don't understand the point of posting.

Finally, I agree with those who have said that the more disturbing indication of the dumbing-down of America as represented by ATS is the inability of many to present or to follow a logical argument and to recognize illogic when they see it.



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:37 AM
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Originally posted by C0bzz
Is this thread proof of the dumbing down of ATS?

Sure seems like it!


What can we say?

It's the Radical ATS Agenda, and you have been converted!



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:44 AM
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americandingbat...

I am humbled and have nothing to say....

That was some damn good thought and writing!

Seriously...



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:45 AM
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reply to post by snowen20
 


There is no way I could be an elitist if i wanted to, my spelling and grammar suck. I'm guilty of the majority of the things being discussed here, and I hate it when people interrupt IM conversations every few minutes to point it out. Their doing so does make it something I take notice of and wonder about though. I had good grade school teachers, and I read voraciously as a kid.

My intentions were exactly as stated, I wondered if people had noticed a decline in quality writing on ATS, and if it is seen as proof that American's ability to clearly and coherently express their thoughts in writing are disappearing.

Thank you to everyone who responded, this has been a really interesting read, and was a lot more than I expected!



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:45 AM
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I don’t know what the problem is.
I mean honestly I think I would shoot myself if everyone on ATS read as though the were Frasier Crane.

This is the internet the bad writing and poor grammar capital of Earth.
Just say what you mean and get your point across and be done with it.

If you have an excuse for being genetically inferior because you write like a troglodyte then so be it.
Just use your little stick and draw pictures in the sand, rest assured I’ll figure it out.



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:47 AM
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reply to post by maus80
 


Actually I did notice and It has broken me of a lot of bad habits. Thanks ATS!
By the way don’t take my joke seriously I agree with you.



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 12:58 AM
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Originally posted by snowen20
I don’t know what the problem is.
I mean honestly I think I would shoot myself if everyone on ATS read as though the were Frasier Crane.

This is the internet the bad writing and poor grammar capital of Earth.
Just say what you mean and get your point across and be done with it.

If you have an excuse for being genetically inferior because you write like a troglodyte then so be it.
Just use your little stick and draw pictures in the sand, rest assured I’ll figure it out.


Yep...I agree snowen20...

I hope I didn't offend with my earlier comment, as I really was joking...

I, personally, don't give a damn about someone's use of the English language...I am more interested in the content and "sources" provided in their posts....

It is no big deal if someone has difficulty with the English language here...How would a member who has limiting challenges (i.e. dyslexia, parkinsons, etc...) communicate here?

A thought?



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 01:03 AM
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Originally posted by americandingbat
My big pet peeve is people who use long words in an attempt to sound more important, but misuse them. Like penultimate, which means next-to-last. Grrrrr. .


Then I am inclined to believe the way I articulate my thoughts often leaves you exasperated!



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 02:13 AM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 


Only when you're wrong


But seriously, you seem very comfortable with the vocabulary you use, and I certainly haven't noticed you misusing big words in an attempt to sound smarter. It's not big words that bother me – words make me smile, and well-used unusual words elate me.

But I don't think that using long words makes an idea better or more important. I judge the idea on its own merits. But when an idea is all dressed up in big words that the poster doesn't quite have under control, it makes me wonder what the words are trying to hide.

I use big words a lot in my posts here. I also use big words in real life, even in casual situations. It's how I think and understand the world, and it pleases me. But I understand that most people don't use as many words as I do, and I don't think that makes their thoughts any less interesting. I think that using words you're uncomfortable with to try to make your point more impressive betrays a lack of confidence in your own ideas, and if you're not confident in your point, why would I be?

English is a huge language – almost any thought can be expressed in multiple ways in it. Some are more aesthetically pleasing than others, some are easier to understand, but none are intrinsically better. (in my opinion – which is to say that I am not the arbiter of the quality of expression in the English language. But I'm right).

I happen to think it's worth using correct grammar and spelling to the best of one's ability because the fact is that many people will pay more attention to your ideas if you do, and because it is considerate to your readers.

But demanding a specific style of writing on an internet forum, and judging the quality of thought based on that, is like judging a photograph of a UFO based on how well it's composed.

Sure, it's nice to have a beautifully artistic photograph that shows a UFO, but I'll settle for one that's awkwardly framed but real



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 02:34 AM
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Originally posted by snowen20
 


I disagree I read all the time, and my grammar still sucks.
Truth is Im less concerned about how I appear to people than the point im trying to make.


Isn't caring about how you appear to other people part and parcel of self respect? The truth is, if you don't appear to respect yourself, then the chances are that other people won't respect you also - or the message your trying to impart.

Using correct grammar and spelling isn't a form of elitism or snobbery. If you realize your doing something wrong, the obvious reaction to that should be to correct it in the future. It's all a part of striving to make yourself 'better', or growing and evolving over time.


Originally posted by snowen20
If someone can’t get passed such trivial obstacles in speech then the problem doesn’t lie in the one with poor grammar.
I look at it as subject matter. Show me this, answer this question, supply me this information.


I do understand what you're trying to say but we can also draw the conclusion that others will wonder how much of the information is accurate and logical given the author of the post shows tardiness.

Though you feel poor spelling and grammar are of little consequence, they are in actual fact an indicator for other aspects of a persons life, or the way they choose to live their life where 'near enough is good enough'.

No matter how you try to wrap it, poor spelling and grammar is lazy when one admits to knowing better. If earlier civilizations felt as many in this thread have, then we probably wouldn't be having this conversation over the internet now and we'd all still be grunting and throwing rocks.

I don't mean to sound heavy handed or rude but I'm looking at it from a grander scale. Sure, a few people don't make a difference but it would certainly be a problem if it was everyone.

A gradual dumbing down is in progress whether it be via the auspices of education or choice and it's not healthy for our future. It certainly makes it easier for the governments to hoodwink their populace amongst many things.

IRM



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 02:37 AM
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reply to post by unityemissions
 


I had posted a video in the feel good video thread "a message from g-d" one of the lines that was worthwhile was "2 people can look at the same thing and see something entirely different"

and I think that sums allot of this debate up... we all process information differently, some people count on the rules to thrive others are severly limited by them.

Look at Albert Einstein failed Math until the age of 28, Math teachers must have thought he was a moron

But then he realizes one day that he can VISUALIZE numbers in a way that let him see almost to infinity

I was a spelling B Champ as a child as an adult, I always make the same stupid mistakes with their and their and... I have no idea how I took my entire school every year but something that dumb slips my mind from time to time... but it does and certainly stupidity isn't involved

LOL if they wanted to stump me they should have dropped Antidisestablishmentarianism and just thrown the word Their at me 50/50 I'd have screwed it up even when my brain was shiny and new.

How does my brain work to do that, I can spell that but still not really sure where a comma goes all the time, I say that is what editors are for anyway!

It was funny when I went for the battery of IQ tests as a kid and in college it was always the same, the shrink would marvel at how I could give him 10 pages of info in a breath on Astronomy but didn't know how many months there were in a year.

For me the highly complex has always been easy, but doorknobs can trap me in the house a half hour longer than I wish to be there.

Organic Chem was a subject I barely studied for while other students came in with Grey hair the next day from the strain, I can be trusted with an electron microscope... but I still cook by turning the flame all the way up burning half the pan and starting a small fire to try and figure out... how to make eggs in 30 seconds or less (which I have still failed to do)

and why

why oh why do I

......

sometimes when I type?

LOL if I stop typing I loose my trend of thought...



Am I dumb, I've been told I am brilliant, I'm just wired the way i'm wired

So, I say, look at what a person is saying and try to sort it out, not everyones mind is ordered the same as your own, and that being case, it probably means that, the people you try hardest to understand are the ones that can offer you the perspectives, you otherwise might not see not being rigged up quite the same as they are.



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 02:48 AM
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And dumbing down, I just noticed mistakes above, things I could have written better...

it's 12:40 AM, I worked all day saw my girlfriend, watched a movie, went to the gym, lectured my assistant for 90 minutes and I am out of bottled water so I'm drinking from the tap... I'm on 17 hrs of input and , lol typing to my friends in a forum

How could you ever analyze this post and assign a label of stupidity? Or make assumptions, there are Moms holding Babies a typing with one figure, someone else has the boss trying to catch them slacking off, another guy might be a bit buzzed and lonely...

This is, conversation for some, practice for others for others they are just bored.

But no one is after a Pulitzer in here

I'm eating cookie dough and watching "the Descent" right now on my other screen, cut us all some slack lol, we might be talking about the problems of the world but still parked in front of the computer stage one before heading on to my wii or going to bed



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 02:53 AM
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I tried to post some relevant thoughts here earlier on in this thread and next to no-one has taken anything I said on board...which is annoying as this is something I have a lot of experience in.

Perhaps that in itself is evidence of dumbing down on ATS insomuch as what this thread has become is a series of opinions without any basis in the area of the inevitable way language changes, without any consideration of historical fact.

Peace,

MGGG



posted on Oct, 27 2008 @ 03:11 AM
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I'd like to thank technology for having contributed to the dumbing down of the spoken and written language. To the internet and the plethora of quasi-languages. From l33t to short-script. From SMS speed-typing that somehow managed to become an integral part of writing. To the media whose prolific use of Newspeak, with phrases like "this just in", that allow us to make much needed merited mental shortcuts.

In closing, a "shout-out" to our beloved book-burning culture. You have my thanks. You have spurred me to new heights.

And yes, the sarcasm is really dripping off this one.







[edit on 27-10-2008 by Oscitate]







 
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