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The cover up concerning being saved and the Saviour

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posted on Oct, 23 2008 @ 09:00 PM
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reply to post by badmedia
 


It was not specific in the wise you make it. It did not say the others the same. No word "other" appears. Making leaps like that are just for you alone though.

And trust me you wouldnt want to put up with the same saved enduring for life. Or would you?




posted on Oct, 24 2008 @ 12:12 AM
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reply to post by Tayesin
 




You will find that the instigator of the anecdotal "Jesus died for our sins", was Saul who became Paul... and who killed Jesus' brother in order to assume Control of the fledgling movement.


Christ Himself said He came to seek and save the lost.



Matthew 20

27 And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant:

28 Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

Mark 2

16 And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners?

17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.


I'm not sure where you get the notion Paul killed James. Herod Antipas killed James, iirc.



posted on Oct, 24 2008 @ 02:13 AM
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Originally posted by Mabus
reply to post by badmedia
 


It was not specific in the wise you make it. It did not say the others the same. No word "other" appears. Making leaps like that are just for you alone though.

And trust me you wouldnt want to put up with the same saved enduring for life. Or would you?


If you are ever having trouble with a meaning, I try to read other versions to find the commonality of them. It appears we are both wrong, because the same is referring to the he before the comma, not the enduring part or others.

KJV 13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved."

NLT 13 But the one who endures to the end will be saved.

NIV 13 but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.

And I don't have my beliefs for any reward. I just think the path of Jesus is right and I understand it. If it turns out nothing happens after death, no biggie for me. I'm alive now, and I won't do things I know are wrong.

You are btw debating the religion about Jesus. Not the religion of Jesus. Not everyone runs around yelling Jesus at people and telling them they are going to hell if they don't accept Jesus as their savor. That is what is called worshiping a false idol. It was the path, example and teachings he showed that was the truth, and when you can understand that then you will know what the religion of Jesus is.

He told the people they were the authority, not the priests and leaders. He told them not to allow people to put them down etc. And the leaders of the time simply took his image and symbolism, hoisted it up to lead the people in directions against the teachings etc. That is worshiping a false idol.

To actually accept "Jesus" as your savior is to accept the path as truth. And that doesn't mean or require blind faith. If something doesn't seem true in his words(not his image), then question it and look for the truth. The bible isn't the only place you can find answers, you are smart enough to figure it out on your own. But as long as you take what the church does, and what the people who worship the image of Jesus do as being a representation of his words, you will not be seeing truth. You can obviously see the evil that has caused. And now you know why.



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 01:27 PM
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I kinda get what Mabus is saying. I think he talking about who is saved where they are and who is not. He also said that you don't want to be saved. I think when you are saved you are changed into a different being. So you are not the same but are different. But you said you don't want to be saved which I don't get. To be in hell and fire your not saved. Under God and Jesus you are saved so I am lost to what you meant.

I guess the better question Mabus is whether you believe in the bible as the word of God. That there is a God, that Jesus die for your sins and that their is life after death. Mabus you got alot of knowledge of the bible in you. The question is if your really a believer or not???????

[edit on 29-10-2008 by slymattb]



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 02:37 PM
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Originally posted by slymattb
I kinda get what Mabus is saying. I think he talking about who is saved where they are and who is not. He also said that you don't want to be saved. I think when you are saved you are changed into a different being. So you are not the same but are different. But you said you don't want to be saved which I don't get. To be in hell and fire your not saved. Under God and Jesus you are saved so I am lost to what you meant.

I guess the better question Mabus is whether you believe in the bible as the word of God. That there is a God, that Jesus die for your sins and that their is life after death. Mabus you got alot of knowledge of the bible in you. The question is if your really a believer or not???????



You are not changed into a different being. What changes is your perception and understanding of things. When you are truly "saved", it means you have Christ consciousness. Where you understand why he was right. Let me make this clear. It does not mean you think/know he is right, it means you understand.

After that point the things you see in the world become completely different. I am not talking about physically, I am talking about in the way you understand things. It is your perception of things which change. It is like you can see right through people. Again, not physically, but when someone speaks you can see and understand what they are actually talking about.

I was saved like 8 times by all kinds of different churches. The few times I went to church in my life, it was always - you look lost, let us save you. And nothing every actually changed, not once. It wasn't until I was 30 years old and I got an understanding of things that changes occurred, and I could see and understand things. No physical changes.

When the bible mentions the blind, it is not talking about sight. When Jesus cures the blind, it means he is curing the ignorant. So that they could see(understand) things. Why is it called an awakening? Because it's like seeing an entirely new and different world than you thought it was.

The only reason not to be "saved" is that what the church pushes off as being saved is just a lie. The church worships and promotes false idols/symbolism. You will very much have to save yourself, nobody can just give you the understanding. But you do have a guideline available, but it's complete rubbish if you don't understand.



posted on Oct, 29 2008 @ 03:41 PM
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The new testiment talks that when you are baptize that your old self is dead and a knew one is born. This is by they rename paul i believe it was.



posted on Oct, 31 2008 @ 08:25 PM
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Bad Media speaks of something from experience that few ever come to know.

I use the word Awakening because it denotes a very different position to perceive from, very much different to only having awareness in human small-mindedness.

This Christ Consciouness as it has been called, is a non-denominational, non-religious, non-limited, non-belief-system-attachment Perspective. It therefore owes no allegiance to any Belief Edifice created by mankind.

It is what the Eastern faiths call Enlightened.

It comes with vast responsibility to Love all things unconditionally, to not Judge...only to Observe Clearly.

It asks us to step up to the Responsibility to use the Knowings for the betterment of All.

It provides a different Ground to Perceive from, and it shows that all people are Equal Souls.

It comes with the Knowledge (Experience based) of the immense Power within all of us. And, it requires we use it in Service.

It allows a clearer perspective on what we can effect, and what we cannot. Because of this knowing we perceive the necessity of allowing people to have their Stuff... Beliefs, Drama, Power Trips, Head Games, etc. All those small-minded human "playthings" to take Power from each other.

It also requires that we Shine brightly for others to see. Do not mistake this as meaning something negatively egotistical. The reverse is true as we must be Balanced in order to Shine for others to wonder what it is that makes you so Bright. This begins their own search for Awakening.

It also lets us know beyond any doubt that the True Teacher is already within you. And we can be teachers who share ways to assist others to find this Divine Spark of Awareness within themselves also.

Be well



posted on Oct, 31 2008 @ 08:50 PM
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Well I just refuse to get into the organised religion thing, no matter who they are.

I still consider myself a spiritual person and I live a good life. I try to be good to other etc etc, without being judgmental and holier than thou.

A lot of the people calling themselves priests etc and acting in Gods name aren't really good people as far as I'm concerned.

Does it mean I'm banned from heaven, if there is such a place, just because I refuse to be baptised? I don't think so.

If the spirit is meant to go on, it'll go on.
Meanwhile, I am just trying to make sure I do the best I can in this life.



posted on Oct, 31 2008 @ 10:06 PM
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reply to post by Tayesin
 


Yes, I do not have specific alliance to "Jesus". But I can see the truth he spoke, and as it is the central religious focus on my culture, when I talk about things it's easier for me to use him as a reference. Especially when I talk to Christians who don't want to hear anything other than Jesus. It's easier for me to point out what he actually said and meant in a way that is understandable. Unfortunately, many times I get called and end up defending myself as being their view of a christian in the process with those who see the evil false idol worship has brought. If I was more familiar with other religions, I imagine I'd be talking in the same ways but instead of Jesus, it would be another.

When I learned what I've learned, image and specific names were not once mentioned to me. And it didn't come from an external teacher. I had a vision that I know was in my mind, but was so powerful as it was unlike my thoughts and after understandings about things flowed in through synchronicity. Like in odd unrelated ways. I'd be thinking of something, or I'd have an idea and then I would see it repeated back to me in other unrelated events. I say synchronicity, but I also realize these things were their the entire time, and it was gaining understanding that made them flow in such a way.

I think in the end everyone will get it and understand what I do. And I'm pretty sure my understanding will also increase. Just a matter of what triggers it for each person. I'm far from perfect and if the path is a road, I sometimes end up in the ditch. But I know where the road is now atleast.

Always a pleasure to see people who understand what I'm talking about.



posted on Oct, 31 2008 @ 10:10 PM
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Originally posted by earthchild
Well I just refuse to get into the organised religion thing, no matter who they are.

I still consider myself a spiritual person and I live a good life. I try to be good to other etc etc, without being judgmental and holier than thou.

A lot of the people calling themselves priests etc and acting in Gods name aren't really good people as far as I'm concerned.

Does it mean I'm banned from heaven, if there is such a place, just because I refuse to be baptised? I don't think so.

If the spirit is meant to go on, it'll go on.
Meanwhile, I am just trying to make sure I do the best I can in this life.


Sounds good to me. Alot of my friends are in the same place. They don't like the christian stuff etc. But I tell them they are more Christian(Jesus like) than what they view as Christians. When I talk to them, it's about the concepts and philosophy.



posted on Nov, 3 2008 @ 03:38 PM
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Personally I was enlightened years ago when I first read and understood what Krishnamurti was talking about. Google him and read if you haven't before....



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