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Native Americans, Celts and Ancient Transatlantic Travel
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reply to post by cormac mac airt
Hey, everyone. Not considering myself any good in genetics, but I did some research and found some info about genetic link between europeans and native indians that AFAIK wasn't adressed in this thread yet. Sorry, if I missed it.
It is based on the mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA). Native indians have 5 basic haplogroups - A, B, C, D and X. The last one is prety rare (4 % in total indian populiation, but up to 25% in North-east ones) This haplogroup was found also in western Europeans and nowhere in Asia, except for one reagion - Altai (OFF TOPIC, sorry - by the way, these people are worth exploring - there is everything you want - from yeti to highly advanced civilisations living below the mountains, ancient civilisations and the fact that hunes (and many before them) originated from there )
Anyways, the most interesting thing is that haplogroup X was/is not shared in recent times - significant differences show, that common ancestors lived loong time ago.
also, the ancient remains of basque people show that up to 25% of them have haplogroup X.
en.wikipedia.org...(mtDNA)
www.huttoncommentaries.com...
Scroll down to about the middle of the page. We are not really adressing the question of Atlantis here. Yet
Hey, everyone. Not considering myself any good in genetics, but I did some research and found some info about genetic link between europeans and native indians that AFAIK wasn't adressed in this thread yet. Sorry, if I missed it.
It is based on the mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA). Native indians have 5 basic haplogroups - A, B, C, D and X. The last one is prety rare (4 % in total indian populiation, but up to 25% in North-east ones) This haplogroup was found also in western Europeans and nowhere in Asia, except for one reagion - Altai (OFF TOPIC, sorry - by the way, these people are worth exploring - there is everything you want - from yeti to highly advanced civilisations living below the mountains, ancient civilisations and the fact that hunes (and many before them) originated from there )
Anyways, the most interesting thing is that haplogroup X was/is not shared in recent times - significant differences show, that common ancestors lived loong time ago.
also, the ancient remains of basque people show that up to 25% of them have haplogroup X.
en.wikipedia.org...(mtDNA)
www.huttoncommentaries.com...
Scroll down to about the middle of the page. We are not really adressing the question of Atlantis here. Yet
Originally posted by ilaruum
...I did some research and found some info about genetic link between europeans and native indians that AFAIK wasn't adressed in this thread yet. Sorry, if I missed it.
This was mentioned, but it's good to see a scientific angle to this thread being explored.
I will comment, though, that while there is an apparent academic 'gatekeeper' that demands the highest...perhaps too high...standard of proof for any of this, it does not follow that all 'alternative' theories carry equal weight. This, folks, is a concession on my part based upon another look at some of the crumbling paradigms that are legit. Just because you are a scientist doesn't mean you can't also suffer from a rectal/cranial inversion.
reply to post by Skyfloating
Howdy Sky
But wouldn't it be better to actually have compelling evidence in support of that instead of making an empty comment? I took a look at the evidence provided by Warrenb. If this depth of this evidence is to be proof of something one could make the theory that the cagots were Atlanteans.
We look forward to the real evidence that is to come...hopefully
Howdy Sky
But wouldn't it be better to actually have compelling evidence in support of that instead of making an empty comment? I took a look at the evidence provided by Warrenb. If this depth of this evidence is to be proof of something one could make the theory that the cagots were Atlanteans.
We look forward to the real evidence that is to come...hopefully
Originally posted by Hanslune
Howdy Sky
But wouldn't it be better to actually have compelling evidence in support of that instead of making an empty comment? I took a look at the evidence provided by Warrenb. If this depth of this evidence is to be proof of something one could make the theory that the cagots were Atlanteans.
We look forward to the real evidence that is to come...hopefully
The style of that pyramid compared to the style of South American pyramids may not count as evidence, but it counts as an interesting idea in the least.
Im actually looking for a few words to use instead of the word "evidence"...the next lesser one on the latter so to speak. "Indicator"?
Like "evidence" is a pre-step to proof, would you know of any pre-step to evidence?
Originally posted by Skyfloating
Im actually looking for a few words to use instead of the word "evidence"...the next lesser one on the latter so to speak. "Indicator"?
Like "evidence" is a pre-step to proof, would you know of any pre-step to evidence?
How about 'suggestion'?
Just avoid the phrase "this could only mean that", because it generally portends an 'intuative leap'...and that's when it all goes to crap.
reply to post by JohnnyCanuck
Suggestive as noted above , possible or evocative, redolent, reminiscent, indicative. There are Greek and Latin terms that also have these meanings . Innuo, adjicio.....might check for Ancient Greek terms also.
Like "evidence" is a pre-step to proof, would you know of any pre-step to evidence
Suggestive as noted above , possible or evocative, redolent, reminiscent, indicative. There are Greek and Latin terms that also have these meanings . Innuo, adjicio.....might check for Ancient Greek terms also.
Thats good stuff Hans and Johnny. Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks
reply to post by Skyfloating
I could also suggest; Clue, inkling, suspicion, trace, Sign, hint, allusion, tip-off, intimation. There is also a good word in Japanese, unagasu, うながす, which has the meaning you want.
I could also suggest; Clue, inkling, suspicion, trace, Sign, hint, allusion, tip-off, intimation. There is also a good word in Japanese, unagasu, うながす, which has the meaning you want.
We see it happen...look at the acceptance that Columbus didn't discover America...
LOL The funny thing is... He DIDN'T discover America, He discovered CUBA! He never set a foot on American soil!
reply to post by menjo2000
Cuba is America....for the REST OF THE WORLD America is comprised of North, Central and South America, and the Caribbean.
So, yeah, Columbus came to America.
Cuba is America....for the REST OF THE WORLD America is comprised of North, Central and South America, and the Caribbean.
So, yeah, Columbus came to America.
Interesting thread S&F
I haven't had time yet to read all the responses but I think I'm right in saying that the Ancient Celtic language also bears similarities to Sanskrit.
I haven't had time yet to read all the responses but I think I'm right in saying that the Ancient Celtic language also bears similarities to Sanskrit.
Originally posted by Versa
Interesting thread S&F
I haven't had time yet to read all the responses but I think I'm right in saying that the Ancient Celtic language also bears similarities to Sanskrit.
Could you connect those dots with a citation, please?
A very interesting thread indeed, now lets look at some facts that would support such a theory.
1. There is an ancient manuscript telling The story of an Irish monk called St.Brendan, who sailed a curragh, a type of keel less hide covered boat to America, via Iceland and Greenland.
Curraghs, all be it smaller ones, are still used by traditional inshore fishermen all along the west coast of Ireland.
2.In the 1970's the explorer Tim Severn, sailed a scaled up version of one of these boats made to the same spec as the one in the manuscript along the same route to prove this legend possible.
3. We know from archaeological evedence and the vinland sagas that the norsemen sailed to America,
The norse were at this time trading with & raiding in Ireland, Scotland, The Western Isles and The Isle of Man, All Gaelic speaking regions. they frequently bought slaves from these reigons and sometimes married slave women, So in theory bilingualism would have been common among the norse.
Now if we go back even further back, into the mists of pre history we know through genetics and archaeology, that people from the Basque country and the Iberian peninsula were trading with and settling on ireland's west and south coast. and the south and west coast of britain. So why couldn't they have gone further north and west?
If we look back to ice age times, we could surmise that hunters traveled along the coast of northwest Europe and out onto atlantic sea ice to hunt for seals, as the Inuit do today.
What would have been to stop them, over the course of a few summers, from making their way along the ice floes as far as the north east coast of North America. Where they setteled in virgin territory and were eventually absorbed buy native North American peoples who migrated eastwards in a simillar fashion. There are those who would say, "there is no archaeological evidence for this." Just because it hasn't been found doesen't mean it isn't there.
From a linguistic point of view this thoery also works because origional native place names tend to remain even after colonisation as well as there being the transfer of some words from the colonised peoples language to that of the coloniser. We only have to look at the English language to see this in action even today.
I would say this to those who would seek to rubbish the latter part of my thoery.
Bear in mind that these people were tough strong individuals, in tune with nature and at one with their environment, and although some would call them primative. They were as intelligent, curious, resourceful and tenacious as we are today.
1. There is an ancient manuscript telling The story of an Irish monk called St.Brendan, who sailed a curragh, a type of keel less hide covered boat to America, via Iceland and Greenland.
Curraghs, all be it smaller ones, are still used by traditional inshore fishermen all along the west coast of Ireland.
2.In the 1970's the explorer Tim Severn, sailed a scaled up version of one of these boats made to the same spec as the one in the manuscript along the same route to prove this legend possible.
3. We know from archaeological evedence and the vinland sagas that the norsemen sailed to America,
The norse were at this time trading with & raiding in Ireland, Scotland, The Western Isles and The Isle of Man, All Gaelic speaking regions. they frequently bought slaves from these reigons and sometimes married slave women, So in theory bilingualism would have been common among the norse.
Now if we go back even further back, into the mists of pre history we know through genetics and archaeology, that people from the Basque country and the Iberian peninsula were trading with and settling on ireland's west and south coast. and the south and west coast of britain. So why couldn't they have gone further north and west?
If we look back to ice age times, we could surmise that hunters traveled along the coast of northwest Europe and out onto atlantic sea ice to hunt for seals, as the Inuit do today.
What would have been to stop them, over the course of a few summers, from making their way along the ice floes as far as the north east coast of North America. Where they setteled in virgin territory and were eventually absorbed buy native North American peoples who migrated eastwards in a simillar fashion. There are those who would say, "there is no archaeological evidence for this." Just because it hasn't been found doesen't mean it isn't there.
From a linguistic point of view this thoery also works because origional native place names tend to remain even after colonisation as well as there being the transfer of some words from the colonised peoples language to that of the coloniser. We only have to look at the English language to see this in action even today.
I would say this to those who would seek to rubbish the latter part of my thoery.
Bear in mind that these people were tough strong individuals, in tune with nature and at one with their environment, and although some would call them primative. They were as intelligent, curious, resourceful and tenacious as we are today.
Originally posted by woadpaintedfinto
A very interesting thread indeed, now lets look at some facts that would support such a theory.
There is an ancient manuscript telling The story of an Irish monk called St.Brendan, who sailed a curragh, a type of keel less hide covered boat to America, via Iceland and Greenland...
Could does not equal did We can accept the Norse presence because we have the sites to back up the sagas. It takes more than tales to change the paradigm...but they do serve to generate research and inquire.
edit on 26-2-2011 by JohnnyCanuck because: (no reason
given)
Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
Originally posted by Versa
Interesting thread S&F
I haven't had time yet to read all the responses but I think I'm right in saying that the Ancient Celtic language also bears similarities to Sanskrit.
Could you connect those dots with a citation, please?
source
'The very name Druid is composed of two Celtic word roots which have parallels in Sanskrit. Indeed, the root vid for knowledge, which also emerges in the Sanskrit word Veda, demonstrates the similarity. The Celtic root dru which means "immersion" also appears in Sanskrit. So a Druid was one 'immersed in knowledge.'
I will try to connect more dots tomorrow when I am less inebriated
edit on 26-2-2011 by Versa because: (no reason
given)
edit on 26-2-2011 by Versa because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Versa
I will try to connect more dots tomorrow when I am less inebriated
So even in Magrathea, it's Saturday night.