What's the obsession with poor-bashing here?

Just lately I've started to see this trend on ATS about people who will put down the poor. Calling the poor "life long bums", "unambitious", and many other names that I will NOT repeat here.

It's bothering me now, and I cannot understand why. If you look at people, as a whole, you will see that most of us are more similar than different.

This goes for people all over the world. Usually people have very similar interests in life. Many include coming together with other people.. But above all, taking care of their own families. And valuing the time they are able to have with others.

Is it worth name-calling because someone else decided they have different ambitions in life? Like spending more time with family, and enjoying life as they know how, instead of obsessing over this currency that is printed in massive amounts to keep us in line?

Even for the people who CHOOSE to remain poor, by not surrendering their life to some corporate entity... are some only jealous because they felt like they had no choice to do just that themselves?

I'm not conscious of the trend you're talking about, but agree that it's a worthless trend, if it exists. Very few people I know were born rich. Hell, very few I know ARE rich. I remember living in a car, and thinking that I was in rough shape, until the car was stolen.

I would guess that people fear the poor more that are derisive of them. I crawled up from nothing, so naturally I have an expectation that nearly everyone can do the same. I recall when I was homeless, how some folks would look at me with fear, probably wondering if I was asessing them to rob them. I didn't rob anyone. Somebody gave me a hand up. I have to always pay that forward, and it can never be paid in full.

Cheers

It's not so much "poor" bashing but the bashing of those who happen to be "poor" and go on asking for free this and that or who are "poor" because of a string of terrible choices like petty crime, scratch tickets as investments, drug/alcohol use, blowing what little thay have on a 'cool' car or electronic toys etc...

There is a slew of 'poor' people who are 'poor' by their own hand. That's fine. But when you start scapegoating and begging and expecting someone else to pick you up is when I take objection and no amount of 'bashing' IMO is enough.

Hell, I'm poor. I dont complain.* I dont desire to be rich. I dont expect any help, handouts, or any other measure of 'assistance' nor would I accept it if offered.

*In the past few months I've been complaining because Obamas looming gun ban has pushed me to overspend or buy sooner than I can genuinely afford to an awful lot of expensive things. The SOB is blowing my savings with his BS. And for this I will complain.

I am also not aware of this...and I make fun of every demographic.

In case your thread is a cry for help, I can only offer this comfort to you:

So what about the resentment for people who really do think they deserve hand-outs?

Can you really resent the people who do this, when our government freely invites foreigners to come over here and receive free paychecks and food just for breeding?

Some people really are happy to just have enough to get by. And, well... I am NOT liberal at all. I think people would be able to meet their needs themselves, if they wanted to. I would blame the govt for taxing hard working people, to give it to the poor.

Really, what bothers me is how the Govt rewards foreigners for coming over here and breeding. You cannot blame the people though. They wouldnt be doing it, if they weren't rewarded for it.

reply to post by LostNemesis


I would like to see the energy that's put into "I deserve" and "I want what they're getting" arguments put into "stop taking my money" anti-taxation arguments.

If you say "look at all the free crap these illegals get where's my free crap" you just embolden the welfare state and open the door to having even more of what you earn taken from you. If you say "WTF, look at all this free crap these illegals are getting" and cut the monies for the free crap off we'll all be able to keep our own crap.

The fed is just a system of redistributing what little you and I have to any slob putting out a hand (or any special interest owed a favor) and it needs to stop.

At the present rate that our nation is heading with the recession most of us tax payer will be jobless, homeless and penniless.

So perhaps then we will have not means to be in web sites criticizing the poor's life hardships.

There's a difference between being poor due to a lack of ambition, such as those bums kicked out the park in Canada, and being poor due to actions outside of your control, such as losing your job and not being able to land another despite your best efforts.

Those poor who expect to be handled with kidgloves and free government handouts while they do nothing to better themselves, other than "spiritually" through the use of multiple drugs, deserve NO sympathy what so ever. NADA! All they deserve is a spraydown with a firehose and a boot in the butt out of town!

I think this is all in all a very compassionate site, very much in favore of the little guy, though there are a lot of us who dislike the "professional poor." That is, those who live off of govt. handouts, or act like they deserve a rich lifestyle but put no effort into getting the education or experience it would take to live that kind of lifestyle.

For someoen who's working hard at one or more jobs, can barely make ends meet, and doesn't even qualify for help, it's an insult to watch that paycheck be garnished to care for others who simply won't work, and especially abrasive to see that going to people who aren't even citizens.

Divide and conquor. If people can be socially engineered not to care for each other then greater tyranny can be achieved, because there will be no organised resistance. That is where poor bashing memes come from.

It's the same thing as WMD's, Terrorists, Yo Momma and Get a job. All memes intended to keep the system going and people less empowered. The most powerfull weapon in the elitists arsenal is peer pressure. Memetic warfare.

The good news is that the hold on society isn't as hard as the media makes it seem, most people still recognise the value of family and education. The younger generations are most vulnerable to this, which is why family is so important, to correct the bad influence of broader elitist driven society.

It's just another pee shooter in the Ordo ab Chaos arsenal, but when everything is added up these folks do real damage to the fabric of society.

Ok one thing that bothered me was all the name calling last night, when someone posted a video in ... Alberta? Canada. This thread wasn't even about hand-outs at all. And the people in the video were homeless, obviously not getting hand-outs even though we in America seem to think Canada is all about hand-outs.

Homeless people who ask for nothing from anyone. Should resentment really be felt toward them?

Toward me, a lot of people I know feel jealousy... Not because of hand-outs, but because of self-sufficiency around the tax system.

So many pay taxes that should not HAVE to.

I do not believe in Taxation without Representation... and I believe taxes are, and should be, voluntary.

Is this what people are resentful about? Willing to turn over all of their financial information to a government, as well as huge payments... And then complaining about where those payments go?

The guys got a point..

reply to post by LostNemesis


It's hardly that people are willing to hand it over. Have you followed the kindof punishment metered out to tax evaders, and especially those who try to prove there is no law? Remember Ed and Elain brown?

We need tax reform, and I certaily think it will come, but were haven't got to the 100th Monkey tipping point where people are willing to stand up to it.

That being said, I think that most people with double-digit IQs realize that in order for a country to function at all, there has to be some kind of tax, to cover the infrastructure.

WHat I think most people are objecting to isn't the tax itself, but that so much is being taken out and it is used for such egrarious things. For example I'm being taxed for social security benefits that I will never see. I don't mind the govt. taking some for highways, public parks, because I use those things, too. I do NOT want it to be a free paycheck for someone who's milking the system or has snuck into the country illegally.

That is not poor bashing. It's laziness bashing. People get into bad situations all the time, but they don't have to stay there.

[edit on 22-10-2008 by asmeone2]

a little poor bashing test:

Redistribution of wealth is the only answer to America's problems.

All you have to do is make all the businesses in America non-profit corporations (that can't issue stock) and you will wipe out the stock market of speculator/capitalists that has crippled and destabilized the U.S.

Make all companies non-profit to stop war, starvation, poverty, genocide -- take the profit out of doing evil -- and it will stop.

To stop poverty, starvation, war, and genocide take the profit out of it.

reply to post by counterterrorist


While I think a little redistribution of wealth is healthy to keep the overall living standards of the country.... I think that people who want to work for the extras in life, should be able to get that without being dragged down by unfair and insane amounts of taxes.

Local taxes are quite a lot different, and are absolutely necessary to keeping ones' own community to a high standard and keep everything working.

Just seems life means different things to different people. For some, it's all about making a lot of money, just so they can be better than others.

I think the Constitution never wanted Federal Govt to grow to the massive size it has. Taxes and everything should have remained a state thing.

I feel for those losing everything right now... And I think with the amount of jobs being lost, those who keep bragging about everything being JUST FINE, will be forced to pick up the tab on taxes lost due to job losses...

I don't think it's the poor necessarily it's the ones that refuse to better themselves,they live in squalor out of pure lazyness,spend what money they have on drugs and liquor,cause trouble and are usually the loud and obnoxious ones,just watch an episode of COPS,how can you tolerate this,I know I can't,granted I've hit hard times before,but I didn't sit around feeling sorry for myself,I went out got 3 jobs to get flush again,so I feel sorry for the ones that are genuinely broke,but at least there is hope for them

I left home at 16, wandered, floundered, hit bottom and lifted myself up to a level where I was comfortable. It wasn't about competition or status or wealth, it was a realization of my own goals. I've never cared much about "stuff". I had a hand up from a mentor -- she was an artist and I learned from her.

Point is..... I've always known that I could work my butt off or not to achieve what I wanted..... or not. I hitchhiked across North America and hitchhiked across Europe. I worked and saved and came home. When I decided what I wanted, it didn't have much to do with wealth and stuff, it had to do with companionship and my view of happiness. I got lucky. I still live simply and not a day goes by that I don't worry about you all out there in the big ol' world.... struggling... watching the skies, watching the news.

Here's my truth: Two hours ago, I picked 38 breadfruit from our tree. I gave 35 of them away, and I know they were appreciated. I don't expect anything for it, but I know that we'll be eating fish we didn't catch ourselves within a couple of days.

I think we've gone too far beyond the point where people work and dream for tangible resources. Yes, I like my computer and the internet, and cable TV, but dang, folks..... most of us don't have a clue where our food comes from. What makes a person gravitate to a city where all food, water and resources have to be shipped in to support them? I used to love the city. San FRANcisco. Where did we go wrong?

Sorry for the maudelin rant. It's been a long day

I am not anti-poor folks although I have been accused of such because of a couple of views that I hold to.

First off, the poor here generally are actually not so much poor but more inclined to purchase comforts and consider them necessities rather than taking care of the essentials and saving.

Second, when one is too busy complaining about their situation they are not thinking up ideas to get out of their situation.

Third, most "poor" people in this country are helping to push forth policies that WILL assure none of us have the chance to succeed in our personal way. ... thanks..

Having said that, I am a single mother and struggle at times. I know many people that struggle or are less well off than the average person in America. Status has nothing to do with gaining my respect... Attitude DOES have a great deal to do with it.

I really think what constitutes a person as poor in this country needs to be redefined. Have a roof over your head? Have enough food to sustain your life? Doing better than a lot of people then and you should be thanking the gods for your small fortune called "a chance at life."

reply to post by justamomma


Respect Momma. I don't always agree with you, but have always had a kind regard for your point of view.

I own shoes. Four pair, and two boots. The boots are more than 30 years old, and they've been resoled many times. I have a solid roof over my head. Millions of people, perhaps more, would consider themselves blessed to merely own shoes.

I am humbled when I think of this. We ship clothes to places hit by hurricanes. We send our paltry dollars to the Red Cross and other organizations occasionally. We share food, but surely we could do more.

Thank you.

That's another question worth asking: What constitues a decent living?

For too many it's not simply food, shelter, a job and a means to get there.

It's a Mcmansion, a new car, the latest cell phone/Ipod/game consol, 2000 cable channels, designer clothes.

And what's more, too many people act like they are owed these things... that if they can't afford it, there is something wrong with the system, not with them.