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Originally posted by citizenc
reply to post by Harman
Kind of like personal confirmation?...
Sorry about not commenting on your post...
Originally posted by citizenc
reply to post by benjiskylar
Speaking strictly from the energy output standpoint, the reason WHY there are more contacts now, the genuine ones, is because there is a correlation between the energy handling capabilities of a civilization and the capacity for communication.
>> Can you expand on this? I must be reading it incorrectly or something.
The problem with trying to prove something like this is that, for the time being, the "under the surface" characteristics of our reality remain understudied and generally unacknowledged by the scientific community, so some ingredients that compose our physical capabilities will also be left aside for the time this continues to be so.
>> Again, I don't follow.
After a certain point in development, one can certainly appreciated the problems and perils of not balancing energy and technology capabilities with the corresponding ethical and spiritual development that will enable correct and productive use of such possibilities.
>> I think the two should fall into line together, which is why I believe any aliens capable of reaching us will be benevolent. High IQ is associated with pacifism for example.
Going back to the probes and the Fermi paradox, the problem is that both those ideas presuppose DESIRE to be found and/or noted.
>> No they presuppose that SOMEONE in their entire world has the desire to search for life. I think we can assume this is very likely.
Once a civilization has "graduated" successfully into energy handling (both individually and collectively, which is kind of a "spiritual rule"...) it is realized that IT IS NOT NECESSARILY A GOOD IDEA to let your presence be "known" to others who might not be ready to handle certain informations.
>> Disagree. As technology increases, so much ethics. Otherwise, it will eventually cause a civilisation-ending event.
The previous (if any) desire to expand or reach out as Von Neumann probes can then be easily reversible.
However, before a civilization is ready to create a VN probe in any danger of succeeding, it will have by then realized the inherent problems of energy management through learning and moral responsibility, as could for example happen through historical lessons such as a nuclear conflict.
>> We are almost there now. See reprap. Commercial spaceflight is almost upon us. Nano is here, and it's looking like following a power law just like every other technology - it's going to happen in the next 20. Will we be ready to accept the consequences? Probably not, but someones going to do it.
So, as a reinforcement to the premise that "they" still do not overtly show themselves, can be explained partially by the explanation above. Humanity is still showing great instability while dealing with its own technological advancements, and the last thing needed would be factors that can further destabilize the present fragile psychical stability.
>> You assume they exist. If they use von neumann probes, the only reliable metric for a civilisation will not be their culture but their energy output: otherwise you would need a probe capable of super-advanced AI, above that of any normal human. Unlikely.
Instead, going back to my rhetorical question, we are trying to come up with good reasons why it COULD be the other way around.