911 Conspiracy Facts - Incriminating

Originally posted by IvanZana
Your statement could not be more misinformed.

Bin Laden says he wasn't behind attacks
September 17, 2001 Posted: 11:21 AM EDT (1521 GMT)
bin Laden said, "The U.S. government has consistently blamed me for being behind every occasion its enemies attack it.

"I would like to assure the world that I did not plan the recent attacks, which seems to have been planned by people for personal reasons," bin Laden's statement said.

archives.cnn.com...

My statement could not be more accurate as it is backed by the conclusions of both the UK and USA intelligence services in addition to videotape footage of Bin Laden proclaiming his leadership of the hijackers.

If that isn't enough, Bin Laden changed his mind in a 2004 statement, read on....

en.wikipedia.org...

September 11, 2001 attacks

Federal Bureau of Investigation has stated that evidence linking Al-Qaeda and bin Laden to the attacks of September 11 is clear and irrefutable. The Government of the United Kingdom reached the same conclusion regarding Al Qaeda and Osama bin Laden's culpability for the September 11, 2001, attacks. Bin Laden initially denied involvement in the September 11, 2001 attacks. On 16 September 2001, bin Laden read a statement later broadcast by Qatar's Al Jazeera satellite channel denying responsibility for the attack.

In a videotape recovered by US forces in November 2001 in Jalalabad, bin Laden was seen discussing the attack with Khaled al-Harbi in a way indicating foreknowledge. The tape was broadcast on various news networks on 13 December 2001. Some have disputed this translation however. Arabist Dr. Abdel El M. Husseini stated: "This translation is very problematic. At the most important places where it is held to prove the guilt of bin Laden, it is not identical with the Arabic."

In the 2004 Osama bin Laden video, bin Laden abandoned his denials without retracting past statements. In it he stated he had personally directed the 19 hijackers. In the 18-minute tape, played on Al-Jazeera, four days before the American presidential election, bin Laden accused U.S. President George W. Bush of negligence on the hijacking of the planes on September 11.

According to the tapes, bin Laden claimed he was inspired to destroy the World Trade Center after watching the destruction of towers in Lebanon by Israel during the 1982 Lebanon War.

In two other tapes aired by Al Jazeera in 2006, Osama bin Laden announces,

I am the one in charge of the 19 brothers … I was responsible for entrusting the 19 brothers … with the raids

[5 minute audiotape broadcast May 23, 2006], and is seen with Ramzi Binalshibh, as well as two of the 9/11 hijackers, Hamza al-Ghamdi and Wail al-Shehri, as they make preparations for the attacks (videotape broadcast September 7, 2006).

Originally posted by KOGDOG

Conspiracies involve people, where are they?

"They" are right in front of you. "They" hide behind a thin veil... plausible deniability. "They" smile and pledge allegiance to the flag. "They" pray to god. "They" are like the clown who visits children in the hospital while murdering and burying young boys under "their" house. "They" live in the apartment above and below you with refrigerators full of the body parts of victims dissected and prepared for consumption. "They" wear Armani Suits and run your economic system which was carefully crafted by "them" so at to enable "them" to rob you of your money and liberty while you actually believe that "they" are hard working American success stories. "They" watch you night and day waiting for signs indicating that you have awakened to your miserable desperate role in a tragedy scripted precisely to allow "them" to use and abuse you until the day you die.

And I'm supposed to filter out something usable from that "rage against the machine"?

At least give me something credible to work with, here's a few hints, how about some testimony from:

a) The guy who set the explosives in the towers.

b) A survivor from one of the planes.

c) A government "insider" who knows the whole deal.

d) An air traffic controller who was ordered to give the planes a priority routing.

etc etc

reply to post by cashlink


FEMA . what are they all about then ? so they left new orleans as a thirld world country aafter flooding . this happened in the most powerful country in the world lol . your country attacks russian subs and then turns it round to make it look like the ruskies didnt want help or had something to hide im glad i dont live ther e you wouldnt now who or what to believe but never mind everything will be fine when the little green men come along[or come back]

O.k. I'll ask. What about this thread is new? If I ran around say the ufo forum and grouped five or six paragraphs together it would not make five minuets. But all this has been discussed in another thread. I think the mods are asleep at the wheel on this one. Then again everyone seems to think it is a great post so maybe I should just gather a bunch of old junk.

Thanks for the facts, I'm going to print this off for my wife to read. She's been on the fence about the whole, wanting to believe that our own government would never do anything to hurt the American citizens.

Great post op you have surmised very important facts from that horrible day.. the official story stinks.. all we want is a another INDEPENDENT investigation.. that is all.

Some of this is not correct. My wife is a ATC and during 9-11 worked in NJ. There was training going on, but nothing flying under the radar. On any given week during peace time there are drills going on. Not as many during conflicts. Good post though, gives one many questions to ponder

I would not want to be in the Karmic Shoes of these miscreants. No.

reply to post by smurtall


In response to smurtall's post, we've spent 100s of billions of dollars on the war. It's important to understand who has benefited from it. The vast majority of the money didn't go to the soldiers, who get paid in peace time as well as war. It didn't go to the Iraqi people, who still live in abject poverty. The vast majority of the money went to the munitions makers, defense contractors, private security firms, engineering and construction companies and all the other corporations who have benefited from the war. I don't think the main purpose was to go after Iraqi oil or Afghan heroin. The main purpose was simply to create a war that would support a massive transfer of wealth from the American people to the military-industrial complex. On that front it has been mission accomplished.

Thanks to the OP and the 911 truthers for not letting this issue die.

I see swampfox got you on a technicality.

Well put together post, with anomalies presented inherent to the official account.

That the investigation was thwarted for a year should have raised red flags.

I'll keep digging as long as the good Lord allows me to.

Originally posted by IvanZana
Thank you for YOUR opinion but..... People are learning the truth every day and will continue to do so and articles like this help.

Thank you for reading and sharing the truth presented in the original post.

Umm...who's truth?
Even among the Truthers there is 0 consistency. Surely in the 7 years since, there would be consensus by now on an alternative theory.
The government did it?
Ok, fine:
Who? The government is huge. Specifics would be nice...
What? Did they use aliens, magic dynamite, holograms, invisible missiles... And what was up with the dozens of attacks on U.S. interests (and U.S. soil) prior
When? Ok, something like this would take years to plan. Seeing as the Bush administration is the most incompetent administration in the history of U.S. politics, you're telling me they were able to in 8 months plan and carry out the largest attack on U.S. soil? Not only carry it out to near perfection but keep it a secret even though this would be the only thing they have ever been able to keep secret AND fool the tons of intel agencies worldwide who were receiving chatter and info about the attacks? Something's fishy about that...
Where? Where'd everyone go? No (credible) whistleblowers? Again, the Bush admin can do absolutely nothing right and have screwed up everything, yet they are somehow able to keep the hundreds of people needed to be involved with something like this (if its a government conspiracy) quiet? No one else sees a problem with that?
How? How were they able to do it in such a short time? How were they able to secretly plant explosives? How were they able to make missiles appear out of thin air? How could they keep this secret? How could they fool anyone? How could they have possibly done this even remotely right? How is it that they haven't done anything since?
Why? Bush is about to leave and everything he's done is about to be undone so...what was the point?

You ask 100 truthers those, and you will get 100 different completely answers.

cash:

We already know that our Government was “not” caught off its guard on the morning of 911. The Government and FEMA knew the show was going to happened Heck! They been practicing these events for years this was nothing new for them.

So the Government was practicing stopping what the Government was planning to do?

We do not even have any real proof that these airplanes were commercial airlines (only what the official say) again nothing but hear say!

Actually that is one of the few things they DO actually have tangible proof of.
If it wasn't that would mean the hundreds of people on the planes would also be in on it, along with their families I suppose. It is a joke to think the Bush admin would be able to keep all of them quiet.


Ground Zero:

it's abdunantly clear that there was alot more involved than a cave dwelling saudi in one of the poorest countries of the world

So...we didn't finance and train them? Ok, now I'm confused...



Anyway, these are just some of the inconsistencies that constantly show up in these thread.
"But but...what about the inconsistencies in the Official story"
What about them? There are literally hundreds of threads already on them. Fact is, until the time machine is invented the word "truth" shouldn't be used by anyone.

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999


(Ah yes, you can always trust Ivan to quote Taliban propaganda. You did realize that right? Those "quotes" are from a list of questions given by a muslim journalist to the Taliban government. He never once talked to Osama.)

So, that dose not discredit Ivan, I see you tried to take a swipe from the back side with your dull butter knife! Really, I think the Ivan has hit the nail on the head on this thread don’t you.

reply to post by ThatsJustWeird


(Umm...who's truth?
Even among the Truthers there is 0 consistency. Surely in the 7 years since, there would be consensus by now on an alternative theory.
The government did it?
Ok, fine:
Who? The government is huge. Specifics would be nice...
What? Did they use aliens, magic dynamite, holograms, invisible missiles... And what was up with the dozens of attacks on U.S. interests (and U.S. soil) prior
When? Ok, something like this would take years to plan. Seeing as the Bush administration is the most incompetent administration in the history of U.S. politics, you're telling me they were able to in 8 months plan and carry out the largest attack on U.S. soil? Not only carry it out to near perfection but keep it a secret even though this would be the only thing they have ever been able to keep secret AND fool the tons of intel agencies worldwide who were receiving chatter and info about the attacks? Something's fishy about that...
Where? Where'd everyone go? No (credible) whistleblowers? Again, the Bush admin can do absolutely nothing right and have screwed up everything, yet they are somehow able to keep the hundreds of people needed to be involved with something like this (if its a government conspiracy) quiet? No one else sees a problem with that?
How? How were they able to do it in such a short time? How were they able to secretly plant explosives? How were they able to make missiles appear out of thin air? How could they keep this secret? How could they fool anyone? How could they have possibly done this even remotely right? How is it that they haven't done anything since?
Why? Bush is about to leave and everything he's done is about to be undone so...what was the point?)


All I can say is WERE IS YOUR COMMON SENSE? Or is this the first time you have read and posted on a 911 thread, if so then I will accept your ignorance on the subject of 911 and the truth movement. However I see you been a member since 2004, so I have to wonder. You have ask some very good valid questions, but for me to answer all your question it would take me weeks of sending you links ,videos, documentaries, new reports, eye witness testimony, scientific research, and a whole lot more. You need to do your own research then get back with us. If you really do your research right, you will probably need to talk to a good therapist. Why? Because you will be MAD! This will eat at you, it will make you sick; you will lose sleep over thinking about 911, trust me you will want something done but not much is being done. You will feel betrayed, and you will never trust another politician again. You will find out in your research, that our new media has turn on us, sold us out to the corporations who dictate what the news is, especially the pentagons propagandas
It is sickening, this is just the tip of the iceberg, it will drive you MAD! MAD! MAD!
Some one help me!

[edit on 10/21/2008 by cashlink]

[edit on 10/21/2008 by cashlink]

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Even among the Truthers there is 0 consistency. Surely in the 7 years since, there would be consensus by now on an alternative theory.

Your long post is incorrect at this point, so it's where I'll stop quoting you.

Yes, there is not much consistency between truthers. However, truthers do not need to propose an alternate theory.

That's the main problem I see on this forum - people wanting to explain what happened. There's no point trying to explain alternative hypothesis. All that truthers have to do is to pick apart the official story and prove it's false. That's it. Nothing more required.

For example: If it can be proven that the alleged Flight AA77 did fly North of Citgo, then that proves the official story is false. It's as simple as that. There's no need to worry about a 'flyover', as the official story is false.

For example: If it can be shown that there was video trickery at the WTC complex, then it proves the media lied. If it can be shown that some videos had planes approaching with different trajectories in different videos, then that's enough evidence required to show that the government controlled media were complicit in perpetuating a lie.

For example: There's no need to prove that WTC-7 was demolished. All that's required is to pick apart the official report and show that it is false. Show that what they printed can't happen.

For example: If it can be proven that the Flight 93 crash site was not consistent with the alleged FDR, that's all that's required. There's no need to prove that it was shot down, diverted or staged as a war game.

Truthers would be collectively stronger, if they stuck to FACTS that disprove aspects of the official story. Truthers don't need to propose any alternate theory. It is not their burden to do so. Truthers will 'win' when the government story is proven false. Truthers don't need an alternate story to rally under with a collective banner.

Truthers are not required to explain how any of it was done, who did it, or why. All they need to do is to show PROOF that the official story is BS, then watch as the house of cards collapses.

I'm convinced that there are dis-info people amongst the truthers, thwarting attempts to be taken seriously, by trying to explain situations that they do not need to explain. I've been reading 9/11 threads for over a year on ATS and it's obvious that there's dis-info everywhere.

The official investigation was a sham. Truthers, all you should do is pick it apart - that's it. Focus all of your efforts to destroy the official story, keeping your own personal bias about what happened, to yourself.

Truthers, you don't have to speculate what happened to the passengers.
You don't have to speculate what happened to the planes.
You don't have to speculate who organised it and planned it.
All you have to do is destroy the official story.

Truthers, you'll lose, if you don't weed out the dis-info people amongst you.

Me, I type here for fun. I couldn't care less, I didn't know anyone affected by 9/11. Still, with some careful poking, I managed to show that 'the bodies at the Pentagon strapped to seats claim' is BS. None of the believers could prove it and they all got viscious trying to defend it.

See the believer's tactics, truthers? They'll swear that two firemen told the truth about bodies they saw strapped to airline seats, but they'll reject the evidence that many firemen heard explosions at the WTC complex. They'll reject that policemen saw the plane fly North of Citgo, yet, they'll believe that two firemen saw bodies in airplane seats. Nail them on their own inconsistent logic and back them in a corner. Look for the cracks in the official story and destroy it. They claim a plane crashed into the Pentagon, but they can't agree on an official crash time! Look for their weaknesses and tear into them. Prove them wrong on the smaller details and see where it leads. If you think that the official story is BS, then start poking them where it hurts them.

Now, can ANY believer show me where the alleged plane wreckage has been formally identified? Please?

pinch, if you're reading this, you made a claim that the FBI have all of the part numbers, can you prove it yet? I only asked you about three days ago. How long do you need to support your claim?

Sorry to follow-up my own post.

A recent, good example of backing them into a corner is the video on this thread: WeAreChange Debunks BBC

Notice how they keep asking why the BBC incorrectly reported the testimony of the witness in WTC7. They hammered the point home and the BBC losers had no answer - they were caught in a LIE.

Don't propose alternate theories. All you have to do is to attack the official theory that you've been given. Attack it until it collapses.

Until you do that, you've got no chance of winning, truthers. None. Fragmented efforts will not be enough to topple the official story.

Whatever, I'll still post here and there for some fun. I get my kicks when believers argue that converting volume to area is valid. I get my kicks when believers can't use Pythagoras' Theorem. I get my kicks when I ask a believer a question and watch their hands wave, while they offer nothing in response. You all know who you are. Thanks for the laugh. I'm sure there will be more. If I only I cared enough to be serious, hey?

I always prefer the UFO/Alien forum, but it's been so boring lately. Posting in 9/11 is comic relief.

[edit on 21-10-2008 by tezzajw]

Even though Bush & Company have been loudly and roundly accused of at least complicity in 9/11, they have made no effort to defend themselves which is another way of simply giving the American "the bird!" They really don't give a sh-t what the public thinks. The latest poll shows that 67% of the American people do not believe the "official" government report on 9/11. If Bush & Company really wanted to absolve themselves from complicity all they would have to do is show the world the pictures from the 6 to 8 survailence cameras that were vewing the Pentagon when it was being hit. Those cameas and their records were scooped up within minutes by "FBI agents."

As much as 9/11 (the most obvious inside job ever) appears to be an entity in and of itself, it's actually but a symptom of the much larger disease of rule by secrecy in general. The real reason why no progress has been made on the truth and justice front is because there's not enough opposition to the basic system of secrecy; by believers and doubters of the official 9/11 story (fairy tale) alike. It's in considering the very existence of psychopathic insititutions like the National "Security" STATE and the military-industrial complex normal and/or acceptable... or enough so. Rule by secrecy is rule by insanity.

Which scenario is more likely from a strictly logistical perspective:
(1) An outsider sitting in a cave defeating the air defense system of the sole military superpower; or
(2) Someone like Cheney -- who on 9/11 apparently had full control over all defense, war game and counter-terrorism powers -- rigging and gaming the system?
Remember that for the attacks to have succeeded, it was necessary that actions be taken in the middle of the war games and the actual attacks which would thwart the normal military response. For example, Cheney watched flight 77 approach the Pentagon from many miles out, but instructed the military to do nothing (as shown in the testimony of the Secretary of Transportation, linked above). Could Bin Laden have done that?

(3) Bin Laden is made aware of the war games, and orchestrates an attack to mimic the training exercises. The planes are assumed to be part of the training exercises, and are monitored but not shot down.

Why isn't that an option?

This topic has been done to death. We all know the Government was in on the attacks from the start. It lied about what really happened as did the subsequent 9/11 commission report. It simply couldn't have happened the way the media said it did.
However, until new evidence emerges the whole 9/11 conspiracy theory is dead in the water.

reply to post by tezzajw
I wasn't going to post in this thread til I read your post. I gave you a star because your post, to me at least is the post of the year. As for the op? have a star from me as well.