Why can't non muslims go to mecca?

Originally posted by ashamedamerican
I hate to be the ONE guy to point this out.
We are "infidels" according to the Qur'an.
I don't remember a passage in the bible saying that we should be killing muslims. (correct me if I am wrong please)
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"But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me." (Luke 19.27)

reply to post by dave420


Thanks for the reply,I think the title´s thread and the reprehensible practises of fingerprinting,incarceration and deportation due to small minded prejudice and unadulterated religious bigotry
is specific enough but,if not,then a well balanced,informed discussion on how the origins of this religious mindset (and how it acts as a catalyst for other issues including the brutal degradation and supression of women in Saudi Arabia) can be seen to be ´directly attributal´ to the extemeist wahhabi islamic interpretation of abraham lore would do.
www.dhushara.com...



[edit on 02/10/08 by karl 12]

Originally posted by AmbroseRokewood
First of all, non-muslims are welcome to come and go to Mecca as they wish, as far as muslims are concerned. Secondly It is the Saudi Goverment that stops non-muslims from entering Mecca. The True Islamic faith is one of the most accepting faiths on the planet. They do not exclude non-muslims. This has been marred by the western media.

[edit on 18-10-2008 by AmbroseRokewood]

I'm not sure about Christians and Jews, but I'm sure all Polytheists/Idol-worshippers/Disbelievers are not allowed to enter Mecca. I don't remember reading anywhere that Christians and Jews are not allowed into Mecca, but at the same time, most of them don't practice their religion anyway, so you can safely place them under the heading of "disbelievers". If I was asked who to allow into Mecca, it would probably be only practicing, believing Christians and Jews, but whatever.

The Islamic Faith is accepting of pretty much anyone, but doesn't mean that impure people, people who don't believe in the one God, non-practicing "People of the Book" should be allowed in. That's a bit silly, since Mecca is the Holy Land, and is meant to be clean and pure - Gods kingdom on Earth, if you will.

But thinking about it, what would happen if a Muslims wanted to go inside the Vatican and shake hands with the Pope?

Originally posted by JasonT
I don't remember reading anywhere that Christians and Jews are not allowed into Mecca

atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com...

[edit on 02/10/08 by karl 12]

As one poster already pointed out, every religious site regardless of religion has some restrictions. In islam, restrictions only apply to the holy sites i.e. Mecca, Madinah, and even maybe the Al Aqsa mosque in palestine. If you haven't notices there are no such restriction on mosques (remember bush delivering a speech at a mosque in Washington and on a Friday). Also muslims are not barred from visiting other holy sites and even performing prayer at churches, synagogues, temples etc.

The question therefore isn't "why are non-muslims restricted from going to medinah and mecca" but why are both the cities of madinah and mecca in their intirety set aside as holy sites?

To compare these restrictions to muslims going to western countries is simply ridiculous. By definition, any non muslim that enters islamic holy sites has done so by breaking a Saudi law and is therefore punished according to that law. I would like to know what laws were broken by muslims entering london or new york.

There is no Islamic Law (read sharia) that sets a punishment for non-muslims entering these holy sites. I believe it is the Saudi Arabia that set the punishment for trespassing on to the holy sites. And as is the case for every other law in Saudi Arabia, the punishment does not fit the crime.

The claim that only non-muslims are misteated in Saudi Arabia is laughable. The majority of people executed in Saudi Arabia are muslims. In fact, only the royal family and westerners are above Saudi law. There are countless stories of westerners to be executed getting "royal pardons" due to their embassies intervening.

Just another way to separate God (mankind) and just another way to excuse the man of rights to worship an idol (the black sphere). Religion separates man, therefor, religion separates God. The purpose is unity, not separation. Religions can do alot of good, but ultimately, they are doing the worst thing possible, keeping mankind separated.

Peace,
LV

I do not wish to go to Mecca any more then I wish to enter a church of any religion. I find God in the forests, in the animals, in the order of the stars, moon and sun. I find God in me and in you.

i'm nfairly new to this site but absolutely love it... however, on this particular thread i have noticed quite a few comments that are somewhat funny to be honest;

Muslims are ba because women aren't allowed to vote/drive a car etc.? Please bear in mind when comparing the ways of a muslim country against the US; the US is a christian country and christianity is 600 years older than islam... therefore i ask; when were african-americans treated equally (if ever)?, when were wemen allowed to vote in the US?, when were women actually equal to men in the US?

my point? by the time the East catch up to equality as it should be, i can assure it won't be a whole 600 years... we should all check our own historical closets before we declare ourselves the 'superoir' being.

after all - in the US, isn't Barack Obama considered to be revolutionary for US politics?... and why? because of the colour of his skin (same applies to Hilary Clinton (i'm sure i don't need to point out the difference))

just my two cents

But thinking about it, what would happen if a Muslims wanted to go inside the Vatican and shake hands with the Pope?

The pope would smile and say "Hello"


As for Lke 19:27 being quoted here, that's a prime example of taking a quotation out of context. As I'm sure the poster is aware that's part of a parable and the word's are those of a fictional king in one of Jesus's stories.

Originally posted by Supercertari

But thinking about it, what would happen if a Muslims wanted to go inside the Vatican and shake hands with the Pope?

The pope would smile and say "Hello"


As for Lke 19:27 being quoted here, that's a prime example of taking a quotation out of context. As I'm sure the poster is aware that's part of a parable and the word's are those of a fictional king in one of Jesus's stories.

Heres another pic of popey:
www.moillusions.com...
On a serious note I do empathise with your comments at the hypocritical double standards that seem to exist between various organised religious institutions and the apparent lack of virtues like acceptance,acknowledgement and tolerance.
As for the Luke quote ,it may well be the case that the quote was misrepresented and taken out of context but isn´t it also fair to say there are many other sociopathic (and truly distastefull) quotes,comments and instructions to be found in leviticus and deuteronomy?
Cheers Karl

[edit on 02/10/08 by karl 12]

reply to post by Sniper_Instructor


Um yes and no the girl would get it worse but .......ok see im Christin my wife is Muslim and her mom and dad don't know about me yet (btw im white shes is Pakistan) and when her mom and dad find out they will make her family disown her. But your kinda right.

Originally posted by Supercertari

But thinking about it, what would happen if a Muslims wanted to go inside the Vatican and shake hands with the Pope?

The pope would smile and say "Hello"


As for Lke 19:27 being quoted here, that's a prime example of taking a quotation out of context. As I'm sure the poster is aware that's part of a parable and the word's are those of a fictional king in one of Jesus's stories.

Fantastic post!

Why is it surprising that non-muslims can't go to any of Islam's 3 holy sites, Mecca, Madina, and Al-Aqsa in Palestine?

There are many places in the world where restrictions apply, and people are literally filtered out.. take for example, the united states.. don't we require a visa for foreigners to get in? Isn't the process of getting a visa a way of filtering out those who are not welcome into the united states (for any reason that we see fit)?

We filter out people for many different reasons, way more sillier than "religion".. When someone's application for a visa is refused, they don't even get to know the reason..

If these places are so important to the Muslims, just like America is important to us Americans then they have total control of who gets in and who doesn't.. JUST LIKE WE DO!

Considering their "visa" to get into those holy sites is "being a Muslim".. I don't see how they are violating any humanistic laws, at least not as much as we do!!

Point two,
The vast majority of doctors, nurses, oil/natural gas/minerals employees, etc.. are NON-MUSLIMS.. Saudi Arabia allows millions of non muslims to enter the country, work, live, and enjoy better living standards than even its own Muslim and Saudi citizens..

Low wage workers however -like taxi drivers, chefs, etc..- are preferred to be Muslims but it's not mandatory! When any Saudi man or woman requests a worker from India/Pakistan/Phillipines they mostly request Muslims to satisfy their (help another muslim) way of thinking..

On the other hand, there are many people who prefer non-Muslim low wage workers inside their houses, to drive their family around, or to help in their farms.. especially when the Saudi person/family are liberal and do not mind having a house made who does not cover her hair.. or a taxi driver that speaks better English, etc..

So yeah, millions of non-Muslims work in Saudi Arabia without having to pretend to be a muslim at all... some non-Muslim workers choose to hide their true religion when they are unfortunate enough to work in areas where people are most likely less educated and adopt the extremist Islamic way of thinking..

I think the whole non-Muslims not being allowed to go the Mecca has been created by the Saudi government. For example, I am Sikh from India, and one of our gurus, Guru Nanak, went to Mecca. It's quite a popular story. As for people saying why would a non-Muslim want to go to Mecca? Why not to go see the place, the beauty of the place, or maybe to learn? Anyone and everyone is allowed into Sikh holy sites so long as they respect the rules. Muslims are always complaining about being discriminated against, but not allowing non-Muslims into Mecca is also discrimination.

Go to huge religious gatherings, and you increase your chances of getting trampled to death. These happen all the time.

Hundreds of deaths, thousands of injured, in recent times.

Someone calls in a bomb threat, or sets off a couple of firecrackers- suddenly you have people that are packed in like sardines running away.

Can't keep up with the mad masses? You crash onto the floor, where the strongest and fastest scramble over you to exits that are only wide by a couple of meters.

There, people will smash into walls or into each other as they hemorrhage into the open spaces that lay ahead- if only they could get to it. They push and fight each other to get ahead. No God there at that time, folks.



[edit on 22-11-2008 by star in a jar]

reply to post by moocowman


That was in a parable, guy. That wasn't Jesus or God going out and telling their followers to kill people who disagreed with them, that was a character in one of Jesus' stories talking with another character.

Thanks anyway.

Every muslim is able to go to Rome and Vatican, they're able to visit it. Muslims are able to visit Bethlehem, Jeruzalem. Every muslim is allowed to visit buddhistic sanctuaries.

It's indeed a wise choice not to go there as for we haven't got anything there but like you said; being a follower of the Islamitic religion is a choice and an opinion.

Why the hell should we adapt to their culture and rules if they won't adapt to ours?!

I live in Belgium, and I have alot of Moroccan friends; but they're special. They believe the strict islamitic rules are just as crap as I think they are. But there are still so much female believers with their hoods on. In an Roman-cathlolic country?!

With all due respect at the muslim community, but the supersticiouses are only done to themselves. When they talk Arabic on the bus, they disciminate US while they live in Europe/US with papers they've got from US.

My answer is very simple. To get into the box, you have to think outside the box. Why can't non-muslims enter mecca? Well that's simply because of purity. Islam is a pure religion, even muslims have to take off their shoes and wash themselves before entering the mosque. Therefore I think that anyone who is a non-muslim is considered to be pure in their own religion, but impure in Islam. The Saudi government have excuted many muslims, why would non-muslims be spared from the desolation? And are the non-muslims there for the religous reasons or the actual experience. Well what you think?

reply to post by karl 12


Brother, the answer is quite simple....for exmaple someone wants to come to UK ..wat he needs to do is apply a visa and if granted only he can come to Uk otherwise not.....in some refusal cases the applicant is even not given an appeal right....similarly if someone wants to go to mecca he needs to have a visa ....and the visa is ...that he must be a muslim...As it is such a sacred place for 1 BILLION people of the world......A non muslim is not permitted there coz of security reasons and moreover a non-muslim has nothing to do there ...coz its only sacred islamic places there...hope to answer the Q.

I would love to see Mecca just as much i would love to see the pyramids, its a place with historic significance.

Unfortunately the Muslim extremism goes so far as to believe anyone who doesnt believe in their religion is doing so just to offend Islam and Allah.

I understand how you feel, i live in England and i hate that we pussyfoot around the extremists. Like having the St Georges flag removed from our ambulances because it offends them