They will never publicly admit that Dr. Paul is right. That would give him enourmous credibility and perhaps seal the deal for his presidential run in 2012. God I hope they do....

I hate the bailout plan, and think Ron Paul is correct in his evaluation of its future impact.

On the other hand, isn't the current administration just trying to keep things afloat for a few months? Then when its worse in 6 months, the Republicans can blame the Democrats for this mess?

For those who think that the Republicans will win the white house, look at the facts. polls suggest that Dems have over 277 electoral votes. McCain would have to win every remaining toss up state, and manage to wrangle a state away from Obama. (BTW, i'm only counting states with obama up by over 10% in the electoral map projections).

If the republicans can manage to win this election, It will look more like another stolen election than the 2, and people will raise a stink.

If McCain can manage to close the gap in the polls a little bit though, he might have a shot at the oval office. And my theory will be for naught.

Anyway this got convoluted enough... I seem to have gone on a tangent... Major point I am trying to make is that the Bailout wasn't meant to work... it was meant to buy some time until there was another administration to blame.

I wonder though... if the bailout money was used properly, and not to pad people's pockets and arrange trips for crooks would Ron Paul still be so against it.

Most people who follow the financial markets are in agreement that something needed to be done. Not to save Wall Street but to save the economy itself.

With a frozen credit market you can't buy a car, a house, a tractor, or anything else. Executed properly a bailout plan can "bail out" the economy.

The way it will be run by this government, Ron Paul is quite correct. We will all pay and suffer.

Ron Paul would just as soon see everyone go down the tubes than to admit that the goverment should interefere. His comments on inflation show he doesn't really have a clue. Inflation comes around with a large amount of dolalrs in circulation. Right now we have anything but. All the dollars being pumped into the system is only replacing multiples of dollars lost. We are heading for deflation, which would be worse if no money was injected. Ron Paul is only right about the Federal Reserve.

Ron Paul is a goverment hater. I do not understand why he even chooses to be a part of the goverment. "The federal goverment should have no powerand I want to be it's President." It's really pretty funny when you think about it.

Originally posted by disgustedbyhumanity
Ron Paul would just as soon see everyone go down the tubes than to admit that the goverment should interefere. His comments on inflation show he doesn't really have a clue. Inflation comes around with a large amount of dolalrs in circulation. Right now we have anything but. All the dollars being pumped into the system is only replacing multiples of dollars lost. We are heading for deflation, which would be worse if no money was injected. Ron Paul is only right about the Federal Reserve.

Ron Paul is a goverment hater. I do not understand why he even chooses to be a part of the goverment. "The federal goverment should have no powerand I want to be it's President." It's really pretty funny when you think about it.

The money lost was not removed from circulation. It was already spent in the form of credit. These "lost" dollars are just going to pay IOUs between huge companies and such.

The only way that money gets removed from the system is when the United States pays off some of its loans from the Fed. Its quite obvious THAT hasn't happened.

Originally posted by disgustedbyhumanity
Ron Paul would just as soon see everyone go down the tubes than to admit that the goverment should interefere. His comments on inflation show he doesn't really have a clue. Inflation comes around with a large amount of dolalrs in circulation. Right now we have anything but. All the dollars being pumped into the system is only replacing multiples of dollars lost. We are heading for deflation, which would be worse if no money was injected. Ron Paul is only right about the Federal Reserve.

Ron Paul is a goverment hater. I do not understand why he even chooses to be a part of the goverment. "The federal goverment should have no powerand I want to be it's President." It's really pretty funny when you think about it.

What you say makes it sound like you dont have a clue. The fact is the dollars lost by the banks need to be liquidated in the form of a bankruptcy. Not being propped up by more bad debt. It may not be inflationary now but it will be trust me. If these banks were allowed to fail the smaller banks that havent gambled like the big ones would come in and buy all the assets for crack money. Then you would see new bigger and better banks. That is how the free market works. There is an article about how the small banks are mad right now because of the big bank bailouts and they ask the question "We have to compete with these big banks that are to big to fail. How are we supposed to compete with that?"

The federal government should have power and does. But only what the constitution allows. We are way beyond that point.

[edit on 17-10-2008 by mybigunit]

To add to the poster above me...Do you know where that credit comes from? NOWHERE, The fed magically adds a number to the banks balance and because of our wonderful fractional reserve banking system, those new reserves get thrown into an even larger addition to the overall quantity of currency in circulation.

Great thread,I just wish Ron Paul was still in the race.

as we all can see, government intervention in the free market causes instability, and people lose confidence

i mean, how stable would something look, if the govt had to "save it" and "prop it up" or "bail it out"

thats directly causing instability and uncertainty

and everyones losing confidence , that is if they have any left

Because the United States of America has the dollar as world reserve currency

WE EXPORT alot of our INflation. We export it to country's who maintain a "dollar peg" as well as those who recycle our petro dollars into treaury debt, and China and Japan have kept there currency's weak so that our imports will be high (there exports) , they want our inflation to be low, so we can buy there crap. Without this Trump Card , our monetary and fiscal policy would = very high inflation and very high intrest rates on U.S Gov't Debt.

As we saw this spring, the biggest threat from inflation came when a relatively small market (commodity's i.e Oil, Food) gets flooded as ASset managers threw tons of money at a trendy asset class with a subsequent rapid increase in prices of said assets. Now with the big hedge funds being forced to give there spooked clients there money back, these funds have to panic sell there long positions in OIL to get there clients money. Combine this with a dollar spike and burned investors may not rush back into this asset class for a while and prices have been cut in Half.

Notice also gold did not decline in step w/ Oil. Lots of investors seek short term treasury bills and /or GOLD in times of stress.

I wonder if there has been a time in history when A currency was devalued at the same time wages were stagnant and neither inflation or deflation "won out" but there was a collapse.

The fed can print money, but it can't really direct it. When they start directing money to JOE 6 PACK in a very HEAVY DOSE i.e 5,000$ 20,000$ then we COULD have hyperinflation until then not happening

[edit on 17-10-2008 by cpdaman]

Originally posted by disgustedbyhumanity
Ron Paul is a goverment hater. I do not understand why he even chooses to be a part of the goverment. "The federal goverment should have no powerand I want to be it's President." It's really pretty funny when you think about it.

Ron Paul hates corruption and extra-constitutional powers being seized by this "government". He's a strict constitutionalist -- same as the founding fathers.

The fact that he is systematically ignored by the MSM is reason enough to listen to him. The fact that he's right is reason enough to put him in charge.

the 'bailout' is not for mortgages, nor is it for the credit creation market,


the actual 'bailout' is for the $500Trillion in derivatives, CDS, and other trash...that the Elite investor class say needs to be paid to them...

do you, your neighbors, your fellow workers, your fellowship at your church....
do Any of these people say that they have lost a bunch of money on those insurance risk 'bets'....
Rest Assured... none of the working, toiling class are vested by $1.00 in the
credit swaps and other risky paper that was leveraged 60-1 on average.


Let the debt Go "Unpaid!
Let the risk takers take their lumps & lose their cash
99% of Americans never bought a CDO, or a CDS or any of those exotic financial instrumentys...
WE were busy putting a meal on the table, paying rent & mortgage, paying credit card debt, buying clothers for the rug rats, filling the car with $4 gas on a $250 wk paycheck ... etc etc


All those Trillions of default debt... are monies Trading between the Rich elites...betting against each other (not against the working masses)
?Why should WE pick up their Tab??
We are not responsible for their gains nor losses

Let the corporations, which took the 'bets' and made money on writing up these insurance policies 'Pay' their own bills & debts....

nationalizing Freddie & Fannie is the only program that addresses the real issue...
which is the outstanding and approaching bad & defaulting mortgages


the bank solvency, the credit crunch by the banks, the CDS policies by the rich & affluent....are a subset of the financial world that drives the American economic system... the debt defaults should not be presented to the whole of society to pay....its all between the buyers and the policy insurers-> if one can't pay, then the other has been 'Stiffed'--->
And It Ain't The Duty of the Public To Pay Off That Debt

Oh.....................what could have been!

Truth and Freedom

instead of 4 - 8 more years of constant lies and bankrupting foreign policy

This bailout isn't only bad for the United States, but it is also bad for any country that trades with the U.S. Canada is not immune from what is going to happen to the American stock market nor any other country for that matter as has been already seen. you americans WILL bear the brunt of it with higher taxes and higher ineterst rates, and when that happens you will be back to square one-again. This is a quick fix for a problem which requires the markets to fix themselves painful as it may be. I'm interested to see what comes out of the meeting of the European leaders and the President at Camp David this weekend................