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The "up-to-the-minute Market Data" thread

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posted on May, 12 2009 @ 02:59 PM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


Its all alone the line Better than expected", see remember that the "good" news is to lure investors into their clutches.


And as for social security, Bush could not get it to be privatized, but you bet that Obama will.


China has been waiting for that one for a long time.


Now they are calling the "dumping of big amounts of banks stocks" in the markets a "test" to see how well it will do, I call it "desperation" and the end result will be ugly.




posted on May, 12 2009 @ 03:05 PM
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The problem with the earnings that are "better than expected" is that revenues seem to miss expectations more often than not while profits are the ones that beat the expectations. revenues tell the true story of the economy, not profits.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:07 PM
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Wow, this is gonna leave a mark...

Advanta Halts Credit-Card Lending Amid Surging Losses


Advanta Corp., the issuer of credit cards for small businesses, will shut down accounts for its 1 million customers next month and seek to pay off securitized debtholders early as the recession pushes defaults higher.

Lending will cease June 10 as part of a plan to preserve capital after uncollectible debt reached 20 percent on some cards as of March 31, the Spring House, Pennsylvania-based firm said yesterday in a statement. Advanta will use as much as $1.4 billion to pay investors as little as 65 cents on the dollar to buy back securitized credit-card loans. That would be the first so-called early amortization of a trust since 2003, according to JPMorgan Chase & Co. analyst Christopher Flanagan.

“Early-amortization has been viewed as a catastrophic event for issuers,” Scott Valentin, an analyst at Friedman Billings Ramsey & Co., said today in a research note. “Given that all credit-card accounts in the trust will be shut down to future use, we expect losses to increase as the cards have substantially less utility to cardholders.”


1 MILLION Businesses will have no Credit soon...

Advanta’s Card-Lending Shutdown May Imperil Customers


Advanta Corp., the credit-card issuer for small businesses, may leave 1 million customers scrounging to find new lenders and debt holders facing losses of 35 percent after the company shut down accounts to preserve capital.

Advanta will cease lending June 10 after uncollectible debt reached 20 percent as of March 31, according to a statement and filings yesterday by the Spring House, Pennsylvania-based firm. The lender earmarked $1.4 billion to buy back securitized card loans with offers of 65 cents to 75 cents on the dollar.

[snip]

“The question is how many business owners depend solely on their Advanta credit card,” said William Dunkelberg, chief economist at the National Federation of Independent Business. While most probably have other sources of credit, self-employed entrepreneurs may have trouble getting a new card, he said. “Credit is harder to find than it’s ever been in this expansion,” said Dunkelberg, whose biography lists him as a former Advanta director.


I wonder how many small businesses will fail because of this move. How many more job losses will result from that?



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 05:48 PM
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reply to post by redhatty
 


Isn't that how the "financial" got the congress wrap around their panties for bailouts? because they were going to hold the nation "hostage".



I guess they are now going for the same tactic again and see what they get this time.


[edit on 12-5-2009 by marg6043]



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 06:57 PM
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Originally posted by redhatty

Originally posted by stander
I'm not manipulating anything by focusing on month-to-month change. That's what the page 2 you recommended to me to peruse as evidence that the 50% figure does exist really says.


Sales taxes were $452
million lower (-50.9%) than last April,


It says "last April" not "April 2008." It's not based on "year-to-year" comparison as you first line claims.


Oh my stander, I forgot, there aren't enough pretty pictures in that pdf to keep you interested. You see, if you had scrolled back up to the beginning of that "bullet" entry on page 1 you would see:


Compared to April 2008, General Fund revenue in April
2009 was down $6.3 billion (-39%). The total for the three
largest taxes was below 2008 levels by $6.3 billion

(Continued on page 2)

(Continued from page 1)

(-40.3%). Sales taxes were $452
million lower (-50.9%) than last April,
and personal income taxes were
down $5.7 billion (-43.6%). Corporate
taxes were $142 million below (-8.6%)
April of 2008.


So you see it does CLEARLY display YoY figures.

Yes, Corporate taxes were compared to April 2008, but the Sales tax figures for May 2009 are compared to April 2009. I never mentioned the Corporate taxes issue you are switching to for some reason. The article you provided link to doesn't mention Corporate taxes as well -- it ringed alarm due to 50% decrease in Sales taxes. So I don't know what are you trying to pull here. Whatever it is doesn't work with me.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 07:16 PM
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Originally posted by stander
Yes, Corporate taxes were compared to April 2008, but the Sales tax figures for May 2009 are compared to April 2009. I never mentioned the Corporate taxes issue you are switching to for some reason. The article you provided link to doesn't mention Corporate taxes as well -- it ringed alarm due to 50% decrease in Sales taxes. So I don't know what are you trying to pull here. Whatever it is doesn't work with me.


Stander, it is 12 days into May 2009, HOW could they POSSIBLY be comparing May 2009 sales tax number to April 2009? The month isn't even done yet.

They are talking about April 2009 sales tax numbers being down just over 50% from April 2008 numbers.

But if you cannot read and comprehend that fact, there is nothing I can do to help you with that.

Source has been cited, you can disregard it if you wish, but it doesn't change the reality of things. Cali is Scroomed



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 08:00 PM
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When you think you know everything about the crocks running the Federal Reserve, news like this one make you wonder what in the heck has gone wrong with this nation.

Video: Federal Reserve Cannot Account for $9 Trillion.

But hey Better than expected right?


www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 09:09 PM
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Sounds like they are trying to push HR 1207 through to audit the Federal Reserve. That is surprising that the Inspector General did not go over the feds books in more detail. She obviously was not very well prepared for the interview either.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 09:29 PM
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Is the end coming sooner than expected? I have to think so when I look at these reports...

Bill Coming This Week To Guarantee Entire Muni Market


One of the most insane ideas we've heard of may soon become reality.

Fox Biz is reporting that the House Financial Services Committee is set to take up legislation this week that would establish a federal backstop for all Municipal bonds and muni insurance.

This would, of course, represent another massive expansion of the government's guarantees and turn all states into Fannie and Freddy.

more at link

then add this...

The New New Money


It's official: The government in Beijing has announced that the Yuan can now be used in international trade. Their mouthpiece for this occasion was the Industrial and Commercial Bank of China, a private entity, which made the announcement on their behalf. By the end of this year, it is expected that fully 50% of all transactions with Hong Kong will be denominated in the Yuan. In turn, Hong Kong re-exports 90% of its Chinese imports. Importer #1 is the European Union; importer #2 is the United States. Some of these countries may soon find themselves hard-pressed to earn enough Yuan to continue importing Chinese-made products.

This is only the next small step in Beijing's "policy of small steps." Already the Chinese government has ramped down its purchases of US Treasury paper, forcing the Federal Reserve to step in as the buyer of last resort. The IOU, with which the US has inundated the world, is now becoming the I-owe-me - which is not quite as impressive to those who are considering selling products to the US on credit. Instead of the funny paper, the Chinese government has started to buy up gold on the international market. The Yuan has long been in de facto use in Hong Kong, Sigapore, Kuala Lumpur, and other countries in the region, in preference to the US Dollar. In several countries it is already possible to have Yuan-denominated savings and checking accounts; in Hong Kong alone such accounts are set to exceed US$100 billion by the end of this year.

more at link

and

Yuan May Account for 50% of Hong Kong-China Trade (Update3)


About 50 percent of Hong Kong’s trade with China may be settled in yuan as exporters reduce their exposure to a weakening dollar, Industrial & Commercial Bank of China (Asia) Ltd. said.

The first settlements of international trade using China’s currency will start with about 400 Chinese companies in five pilot cities, Stanley Wong, deputy general manager at the unit of China’s biggest bank, said in an interview today in Hong Kong. The payments may expand to half of the $30 billion in trade excluding transshipments when authorities extend the program nationwide as soon as 2010, he said.

“There has been a perception that the U.S. dollar will continue to weaken,” said Wong. “Definitely on an annual basis, the yuan will probably appreciate against the U.S. dollar around 3 percent to 5 percent. It makes sense for companies to avoid foreign-exchange risk.”

more at link

and in the FX markets.... the dollar has fallen to 82

then let's add a little icing on the cake

Japan 'would avoid dollar bonds'


Japan's opposition party says it would refuse to buy American government bonds denominated in US dollars, if elected.

The chief finance spokesman of the Democratic Party of Japan, Masaharu Nakagawa, told the BBC he was worried about the future value of the dollar.

Japan has been a major buyer of US government bonds, helping the US finance its Federal budget deficits.

But, he added, it would continue to buy bonds only if they were denominated in yen - the so-called samurai bonds.


Hope you all are stocked up on necessities & ammo folks
Thunderdome is starting to look like a good place to be

AND MORE GOOD NEWS LOL

U.S. credit rating at risk: former agency chief
And
America’s triple A rating is at risk

For your reading (dis)pleasure

[edit on 5/12/09 by redhatty]



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 09:33 PM
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LAYOFF DAILY
Tue 5-12-2009


West Contra Costa, CA Schools -124
Park Nicollet Health Services -240
ArcelorMittal Steel indefinite layoffs -242
Cochella Valley, CA School District -114
ArcelorMittal plant in Warren, OH permanent closure -69
Case New-Holland Forklifts -150
Atlanta, GA school board -200
Geisinger Wyoming Valley Hospital -180
Omnisource Corp. -135
Eircom (Ireland) -1,200
Eastern Washington University -110
Maloof Sports & Entertainment -12
Continental AG -87 2,000
City of Maricopa, CA -10
Icon Metal Forming LLC -140
Barclays (UK) slashes IT staff -700
Chicago Parks District warns of potential layoffs -400
Additional City of Toledo layoffs -71
Microsoft hints at more layoffs if the economy doesn't improve
30% of small businesses plan layoffs, 45% see sales decreaase
American Axle temporary layoffs -399
Goss International -170
GM likely to cut 40% of all dealerships
Modesto, CA School board proposes job cuts -70
TeleTech (Canada) -279
Plasco Energy (Canada) -57
APAC Customer Services -92
DM Industries -206
Cochella Valley, CA School District -114
Burbank, CA School District -34
Delphi -200
Kentwood, MI Schools -153
City of Gilroy, CA -33
Kent, WA area schools -35
Wausau, WI school board -16

TOTAL - 7,955 ish


Are we having a DEPRESSION yet -
Or - should we continue to pretend this isn't happening???


[edit on 12-5-2009 by spinkyboo]



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 09:51 PM
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reply to post by spinkyboo
 


From the market rebounds today on astoundingly horrible news across the board.....

I would say we are still in the "let's pretend it isn't happening".

In fact, I would say that the vast majority, and I mean vast majority, of Americans won't actually try to understand the economic situation until they loose their house, loose their car, loose their savings, loose their jobs, loose their retirement funds, loose their kids college funds, loose the shirt of their back and find themselves standing in a soup line waiting for Obama to hand out the rations.

Then and only then will they say "Hey... WTF is going on, I thought you said everything was ok?"

But they won't hear you then, soup lines are no place for the elite.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 10:05 PM
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Don't worry people everything will be ok. The Economy is getting back on...Oh what's that? The US is Risking a Credit down grade?



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 10:08 PM
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reply to post by projectvxn
 


Yep, I had posted that a few posts above, I just kept the original title



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 10:28 PM
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Just an observation here; but, four of the top five threads in "Political Issues" currently have the word "revolution" in the title.

The tin-foilers and "right wing extremists" seem to be getting a tad bit restless. Maybe it's time for those three-letter-agencies to spread some disinfo?



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 11:04 PM
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Tomorrow WalMart reports and other retailers do as well. They will also give their outlook for the consumer. This is imperative to see if the rally will continue much more or not in my opinion. This doesn't mean that there still won't be a pull back, but depending on tomorrow, I think it depends on just how much of a pull back and just how much of a rally till Q2 comes along.



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 11:06 PM
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Originally posted by redhatty

Originally posted by stander
Yes, Corporate taxes were compared to April 2008, but the Sales tax figures for May 2009 are compared to April 2009. I never mentioned the Corporate taxes issue you are switching to for some reason. The article you provided link to doesn't mention Corporate taxes as well -- it ringed alarm due to 50% decrease in Sales taxes. So I don't know what are you trying to pull here. Whatever it is doesn't work with me.


Stander, it is 12 days into May 2009, HOW could they POSSIBLY be comparing May 2009 sales tax number to April 2009? The month isn't even done yet.

They are talking about April 2009 sales tax numbers being down just over 50% from April 2008 numbers.

But if you cannot read and comprehend that fact, there is nothing I can do to help you with that.

Source has been cited, you can disregard it if you wish, but it doesn't change the reality of things. Cali is Scroomed

And WHY would they POSSIBLY made the distinction between "last April" and "April 2008?"

Of course, it's strange to summarize the whole month in its first quarter, but "last April" is "last April," not "April a year ago," especially if the distinction was made just a few lines bellow.

Are you going to tell me what they actually meant by "last April?" It takes a bit of competency to present data with no doubt to the reader what time frame reference they apply to. Are you telling me that this is just a negligible mistake? Then I can tell you that the 50.9% decline in the sales taxes could be a another mistake.

You present data from rogue economists who equal "last April" to probably "April 2008" but never doubt that those 50.9% could be probably 35.7%.

Explain this to me: Why did the Controller Office use the term "last April" with the sales taxes data and "April 2008" with the corporate taxes if you think that you see clearly through anything?

Edit: I actually figured that out, sort of.

What actually matters is this info:


Compared to April 2008, General Fund revenue in April
2009 was down $6.3 billion (-39%). The total for the three
largest taxes was below 2008 levels by $6.3 billion


Here, the time comparison is made. This index is more representative than anything else. It doesn't compare itself with any budget projections -- it's the real deal. How to translate this figure into overall economic decline for the state . . . Maybe Rockpuck knows how.



[edit on 5/13/2009 by stander]



posted on May, 12 2009 @ 11:18 PM
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Another source familiar with the FDIC's plans said on Tuesday that the agency was considering seeking to create a new fund to help deal with any resolution of systemically important financial institutions.

www.reuters.com...

Does this really mean that all is NOT well in financial paradise?



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 12:27 AM
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Hmmm...



AIG Trustees Should Answer to Taxpayers, Not Fed, Towns Says
www.bloomberg.com...

May 12 (Bloomberg) -- A House panel plans to ask trustees assigned to safeguard the U.S. government’s $182.5 billion investment in American International Group Inc. whether their supervision by the Federal Reserve Bank of New York serves taxpayers’ interests.

The trustees -- Jill Considine, Chester Feldberg and Douglas Foshee -- were appointed in January by the New York Fed, a private institution owned by member banks, which has the power to overturn some of their decisions and to remove them. Edolphus Towns, a New York Democrat who chairs the House Committee on Oversight and Reform that will hold hearings tomorrow, said he’s concerned that the interests of AIG’s customers and trading partners may outweigh those of taxpayers.

“As a $182.5 billion recipient of taxpayer dollars, AIG should no longer be able to operate in the dark,” said Towns in an e-mail. “The American people, who now own a major portion of this company, deserve clarification on core issues of the AIG bailout -- who exactly is in charge at AIG and who is protecting the taxpayer’s multibillion-dollar investment?”



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 12:27 AM
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reply to post by Rockpuck
 

That was really weird. There was a confluence of really negative news that would sent the Dow packing a year ago, but the traders seem to be virtually immunized against anything. I think plenty of folks out there are losing coherency and act on some weird thoughts. It kinda resembles the story about the Titanic band that played on until the ship went down.



posted on May, 13 2009 @ 01:40 AM
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Investors hunt defensive stocks as rally stalls
Shares of recession-resistant sectors of market rise as recovery hopes dim
www.msnbc.msn.com...

RPT-PRECIOUS-Gold rises above $925 on weaker dollar; ETF flat
www.reuters.com...

U.S. runs April deficit for first time since '83
Government normally runs April surplus as tax payments swell coffers
www.msnbc.msn.com...

America threatens trade war with China
The United States government is planning to revive a bill that will punish China for artificially boosting its trade through "currency manipulation".
www.telegraph.co.uk...

US Treasury to notify toxic asset managers on Wed
www.reuters.com...

FOREX-Dollar hits 4-month lows, extends broad slide
www.reuters.com...

BofA, other U.S. banks scramble for capital
www.reuters.com...

Worries growing about commercial real estate
Delinquency rates at hotels, office buildings have more than doubled
www.msnbc.msn.com...

Number of homeowners facing foreclosure rises
Up 32 percent in April over previous year; Nev., Fla., Calif. still lead nation
www.msnbc.msn.com...

U.S. foreclosure filings sets record in April, seen jumping
www.reuters.com...

1000 GM Dealerships Forced Out May 15; Executives Dump Shares; Restructuring May Fail
globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com...

Chrysler bankruptcy may take up to two years: report
www.reuters.com...

Southeast car parts suppliers feel Detroit’s pain
Michigan may be epicenter of crumbling industry, but the problem travels
www.msnbc.msn.com...

[edit on 5/13/2009 by Hx3_1963]



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