Its official: The US is in recession, page 3

reply to post by SEEWHATUDO

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That is just part of it. Take a look at the amount of people in credit card debt. THAT is the proof that people are just living well beyond their means. We have all been hit by rising gas and food costs. That doesn't mean that some people aren't adapting or hadn't already adapted.

When you become dependent upon the system, don't cry foul when the system goes through its normal contraction and you are the one that suffers the biggest losses.

reply to post by marg6043

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Indeed, but the choices were either that or collapse. They were more than happy to get more power. WE put them in the position to get it.

reply to post by DeadFlagBlues

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Right now, we are entering into it, but it won't be official until 2 quaters of negative growth. As I have been saying, it is a safe bet that this quater is going to be negative. There is no doubt about it.

reply to post by mybigunit

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Sure, lets blame it on fake numbers. How did you manage to get the real numbers then?

Originally posted by grimreaper797
Doesn't matter what NBER defines it as,

Really??
Do you know what the NBER is?

Link

But the National Bureau of Economic Research, a private, nonprofit, nonpartisan research organization founded in 1920, is the official arbiter of whether the country is in a recession.

reply to post by mybigunit

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Because there are pleanty of people who still are dependent upon it. Basically you want to sacrifice them because you won't be the one left on the hook if we crashed the system. Rather selfish of you.

reply to post by mybigunit

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The little banks will buy up these huge amounts of assets with what money? None of those small banks are big enough to buy it. Thats why they are a small bank.

reply to post by grimreaper797

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Right, right I get it but it's okay for the wealthy in this country to ride the Governments back but the poor just need to fend for themselves.
Socialism is now, we are in it, our banks became nationalized, the very wealthy just got a great big welfare check.
Do you see what I am saying? Do you see the huge imbalance?

reply to post by SEEWHATUDO

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Its not ok, nobody said it was. But it was necessary. We are to fault for it being necessary. We elected the people who regulated the market. We became dependent upon these institutions. We invested in them. We put our money in their deposit sectors. We took out loans from them.

WE drive this economy, and that works both ways. We are responsible for its gains, and we are responsible for its losses. Nobody is to blame but ourselves for this mess.

[edit on 15-10-2008 by grimreaper797]

reply to post by anachryon

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Yes, I know who they are. They haven't declared a recession. We are entering in a recession NOW. We didn't enter months and months ago and they are just declaring it. The market is an indicator of the economy a majority of the time. This is no different. It was an indicator, and it indicated.

We are ENTERING recession now. It will be official soon enough. We have been in a bear market, but we weren't in a recession till recent.

reply to post by grimreaper797

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WE did not, my family is not dependent upon anybody or anything.
We do not need nor do we want credit so we could care less.
We do not invest in financials, so we could care less.
We depend on cash and if the cash is worthless then and ONLY then will we be dependent upon others.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
reply to post by SEEWHATUDO

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That is just part of it. Take a look at the amount of people in credit card debt. THAT is the proof that people are just living well beyond their means. We have all been hit by rising gas and food costs. That doesn't mean that some people aren't adapting or hadn't already adapted.

When you become dependent upon the system, don't cry foul when the system goes through its normal contraction and you are the one that suffers the biggest losses.

The fact that the investment houses are loaning people money to invest with them in the market is the most ridiculous part of it. Whether it be a variable rate mortgage or something like this it should be outlawed to prevent people from getting in way over their heads.

reply to post by SEEWHATUDO

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OK, so you have no bank account, you have no loans of any kind, you do not purchase from places that have gone into heavy debt? You depend upon money solely, so that means you are dependent upon the financial sector. Why? Because consumer retail is dependent upon them. You are dependent upon consumer retail, and they are dependent upon financials.

So yes, you are dependent upon them. We generally all are dependent upon them unless you can completely become independent of the system. Many people may USE cash, but that doesnt mean they are dependent upon it. If my income goes down, I simply adjust and thats that. My hours got cut, I just cut spending and spent more time fishing and hunting and buying cheaper foods.

reply to post by Sky watcher

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Make a law to ban people being stupid? Eh, that opens up a dangerous precident to me. I don't want government managing when I can or can't do business with somebody else.

reply to post by grimreaper797

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....okay, let me explain how the NBER works.
See, they're a bunch of scholars. They study all facets of the economy for months and months and months before making the "official" call.
Linky

The committee's approach to determining the dates of turning points is retrospective. We wait until sufficient data are available to avoid the need for major revisions. In particular, in determining the date of a peak in activity, and thus the onset of recession, we wait until we are confident that, even in the event that activity begins to rise again immediately, it has declined enough to meet the criterion of depth. As a result, we tend to wait to identify a peak until many months after it actually occurs.

When the NBER makes the official determination of recession, the recession is long underway and may even be already over (as with the 2001 recession). That doesn't mean other economic experts don't know while it's going on that it IS going on, as we see in the case of the news story we're discussing.

reply to post by anachryon

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And I am betting that NOW is the enter of the recession. Things have been getting worse, but they simply were NOT at recession levels till recently. If you think falling production and unemployment was bad over the course of the last year, you are in for a real kick in the face these next two quaters.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
reply to post by SEEWHATUDO

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Its not ok, nobody said it was. But it was necessary. We are to fault for it being necessary. We elected the people who regulated the market. We became dependent upon these institutions. We invested in them. We put our money in their deposit sectors. We took out loans from them.

WE drive this economy, and that works both ways. We are responsible for its gains, and we are responsible for its losses. Nobody is to blame but ourselves for this mess.

[edit on 15-10-2008 by grimreaper797]

Your assessment of the situation is ridiculous to say the least. Is it our fault most Congressmen and CEOs are lying crooks? NO!! People took out loans but who caused the ridiculous inflation that made it so tough for us people to pay back those loans? The Media has already told us how the mortgage people scammed millions of Americans by lying to them about how they could afford their new dream homes when they did not know better.

I pay my mortgage, I don't invest with crooks. We are being lied to and ripped off by the crooks in D.C. and N.Y.

If the ignorant politicians in D.C. would have bailed out the home owners and given the American people a darn break then the banks would have got their money the fair way. Now they have all the money and we are going broke.

I guess it was the American people who thought of the Credit Default Derivatives scam as well. Just wait till that bubble pops, When the government admits that they are only worth about 5% of what the banks had paid for them the whole house of cards comes down. All 600 trillion worth.

reply to post by Sky watcher

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Who voted these corrupt people of D.C. in again? Who does business with the banks again? Where does all the money they have in earnings come from?

This is capitalism, where individuals reap the benefits, and we all suffer for the mistake. Its only fascism when the government starts to regulate who reaps the benefits.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
And I am betting that NOW is the enter of the recession. Things have been getting worse, but they simply were NOT at recession levels till recently. If you think falling production and unemployment was bad over the course of the last year, you are in for a real kick in the face these next two quaters.

Things have been getting worse, and I have no doubt in my mind that they will continue to get much worse in the coming months...maybe years. I've posted enough to that effect already that you should know I'm not in for a "kick in the face."

Warren Buffet said in March that we were already in a recession.

Also in March, the President of the NBER said:

Harvard University economist Martin Feldstein, a member of the group that dates business cycles in the U.S., said the nation has entered a recession that could be the worst since World War II.

"I believe the U.S. economy is now in recession,'' Feldstein, president of the National Bureau of Economic Research, told the Futures Industry Association conference in Boca Raton, Florida.

Various economic experts have been calling it for months now. I don't know why this is so hard to believe for people.

reply to post by grimreaper797

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How about a law for "stupid" financial institutions, corrupted CEOs and moron presidents.

Our government just made a new bill to cover up financial institutions stupidity "at the expenses of tax payer" but the tax payer doesn't get any help to get by with the stupidity of the "financial institutions".

I forgot also "greed"

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