Judge tosses challenge to S.F. plan to issue illegal immigrants ID cards

Judge tosses challenge to S.F. plan to issue illegal immigrants ID cards

www.sfgate.com

A San Francisco Superior Court judge today ruled that the city's plan to issue municipal identification cards to residents regardless of immigration status does not violate state and federal law.

The program would make San Francisco the largest city in the country to issue municipal identification. New Haven, Conn., began issuing cards last year.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Here we are...

In San Fransicko...

Are you an Illigal alien, come to San Fransico, where US laws DONT MATTER...
Where illigal alien crack-dealers are housed by the Mayor

Where the word illigal, is not illigal, because it offends illigals...


So here is a MAJOR US city... Flaunting that they have no reguard for US law...

ID Cards to illigals...



No problem that California is 15 billion in debt...
We can still spend billions on people who are federal criminals...

After all, California can just go to Commrade Bush, and get a Goverment back bailout...




www.sfgate.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Isn't this great news too? You're really brightening my days, TKain

I know some here will have concerns that this is a way for Big Brother to keep track of even more of us, but I was absolutely thrilled when I heard that New Haven had started this program last year. I just hope we'll get something like it going here soon.

I am confused by this line in your post:

"Where the word illigal, is not illigal, because it offends illigals... "

Is the misspelling deliberate? I don't mind misspellings, it's just kind of confusing in context

[edit on 10/14/08 by americandingbat]

is there any possibility that this program could be used to track illegal immigration?

i mean does that seem feasible or am i just being silly here?

A few things...

This is not a california issue, it's a San Fran issue, so I don't think that california's state debt really matters.

Deportation doesn't work. Immigration has been doing that for years, and the population of illegals has only increased. Also deportation breaks up families, which has adverse effects socially, the process is more costly to the state then some municipal ID cards....yada yada yada...it's a rabbit hole of problems associated with deporting or arresting illegals.

Having said that, why would you not want all these people accounted for? You really want that many people living off the grid? I'm sorry, I understand where you think the principle of issuing ID's to illegal immigrants sucks, but I can't see one logical reason for not doing it. Face it, if this country was gonna do anything about illegal immigration then it shoulda been done in the 70's or 80's.

There's no happy ending to the immigration issue. We may as well grant some level of amnesty, and start aggressively securing our borders NOW.

that's what i'm thinking

there is a practical use for them issuing the ID cards.

it could keep the more honest people in the clear a bit more, so to speak, by the fact that they did the right thing and got their ID whereas, if someone were to try and resist and not get the ID and something were to happen, then they could be questioned about why they do not have the identification card and thus be made to pay a fine or something like that.

i think ultimately, if we cannot keep illegal immigrants out of the country, they should at least be kept track of in some regulated manner just for the simple fact that there is a certain percentage that are participating in other illegal activities besides simply being here and working to make a living.

In all seriousness, a big part of the argument for the ID cards in New Haven (which I was peripherally aware of since I grew up there and my parents still live there) was that illegal immigrants were being targeted for crimes.

Because they had no valid ID, they could not open bank accounts. Thieves and robbers knew this and targeted them, resulting in increased problems for the police among other things.

Illegal immigrants are here. They do work that we rely on and refuse to do ourselves. Why not let them participate in our economy rather than preserve a heavily black-market cash-based alternative economy? Why not make it easier on the cops who have to investigate muggings or housebreaks? Maybe we could even get them minimal access to preventive health care so we don't have to treat them when they show up desperately ill in our emergency rooms.

Ok, I know I went too far there. But a bank account seems reasonable.

reply to post by americandingbat


Wait till you get an IRS statement that you owe 'X' amount of tax money that you didn't know you earned because someone used your SS number and then tell me why we should coddle these law breakers. Don't think for one minute that the IRS wil give you a pat on the back and say 'Oh well, we understand'! You wil have to prove to them that it wasn't you and believe me its NOT an easy process. I have a friend who got billed for medical proceedures that he never had done in a town he never lived in three states away and it took him many dollars in fees and time to correct the problem, He then had to get his credit status fixed because he got reported for non payment of a debt he did not owe. Thats why we should start doing something about this real problem.
Zindo

PS wait till your parents get their next tax bill from New Haven. I work there and its going to start pissing the townsfolk off when they see exactly what its costing them to 'take care of' these illegals!

[edit on 10/14/2008 by ZindoDoone]

You want to know the only practical use for me...

Have them come to the place to get an ID card, and have a US immigration Bus in the back ally.

Gonna need alot of 1-way tickets to the Yucatan...

Its seems then you should be supporting ID cards. Don't you think if these people had their own ID's they wouldn't need to steal someone else's?

As far as the IRS goes, well it's illegal too, so why don't you start on that if you're really worried about it.

I can't imagine printing up a few cards costing much either. I'm sure there will be a fee involved to get one.

There's really no argument here. The illegals aren't going anywhere. Might as well know who they are. Pretty cut and dry if you ask me.

-Liquid

Originally posted by ZindoDoone

PS wait till your parents get their next tax bill from New Haven. I work there and its going to start pissing the townsfolk off when they see exactly what its costing them to 'take care of' these illegals!

[edit on 10/14/2008 by ZindoDoone]

Since my parents are rather disappointed by what a conservative I am, I doubt it

And do you have any reason to believe that giving illegal aliens an ID card so they can open a bank account will make them more likely to commit identity theft?

My point was that even with the ID's, the vast amount that do not bother with legal bank accounts and registering vehicles or having insurance or pay taxes but still have their children in school and are useing our SS numbers to work as well as getting medical treatment and NOT paying for it so my medical bills are 50% higher to cover the costs might be a reason to see that the simple act of giving law breakers ID cards is the tip of the iceberg. What these politicians see is VOTERS, not the cost of getting that vote. In the end is amnesty that will be the end product and that is not right. To many folks work hard and do whats needed legaly to come here. To just walk accross an imaginary line to demand what citizens have and do their level best to ignore our laws is wrong, period!

Zindo

Zindo,

In the end is amnesty that will be the end product and that is not right.

You seem to be caught up in this battle of right and wrong, when the issue isn't really about that, not anymore anyways. We could get into a philosophical discussion about right and wrong, but this really isn't the place.

Giving them ID cards, may very well be the tip of the iceberg to some form of amnesty, but again WHAT OTHER OPTION IS THERE? For reasons I have already listed, aggressively(and it would have to be aggressive) arresting and/or deporting illegals would do much more harm then good. Since you haven't presented another idea as to how to deal with illegal aliens then I guess this is check mate.

The only way to deter them is to get someone else to work those jobs. Could throw high school kids in tomato field somewhere and maybe have them earn college credit, or make criminals do the work for pennies a day. But even then I don't think you could find enough people to take those jobs for so cheap. Besides so many people would think that making kids and criminals do that kind of work for so cheap just isn't "right."

The point should be' No one will do those jobs for the wages being artificialy held down because we allow companies to hire them and not US citizens". They would leave by themselves if we didn't allow them to be a force in our labor market. There are plenty of people to build houses and do construction. Pay a visit to your local houseing project and see how many US citizens are hanging off the ladders. Do you see many? I doubt it. We have companies here bidding on jobs and importing workcrews from Mexico and undermining our economy in the North East. Local companies are not getting the work therefore our economy suffers. Make it harder for employers to hire them without higher penelties and the illegals will leave of their own volition. In some states this is already happening. There are also plenty of legal imigrant families who have come here and need jobs. They should be allowed and the illegals should not. It is that simple!

Zindo

This is absolutely ridiculous. Why are criminals, an invading force mind you, being rewarded? When are legal Hispanic citizens going to realize that this is not helping them anymore than it is helping the rest of the United States.

I don't care about legal immigration, however, the US should close off the borders NOW! Before MS13 parks a nuke on the White House lawn.

Originally posted by traderjack
This is absolutely ridiculous. Why are criminals, an invading force mind you, being rewarded?

Cause,

"There is no Law and Order anymore"

And, i made a mistake eailer..

I meant to say.

"It is now Illigal to use the word Illigal. Because, it could offend the illigals..."
- This past summer, the San FranPhysco board of Stupidvisors passed a proclimation that said that Illigal fireworks, no longer should be refered to as 'illigal', but as 'Undocumented"

So, those bottle-rockets you have...
They are undocuneted,

Only in San Fransicko...

Where they will regulate what kind of food you can have
where they will regulate weather you can smoke or not
Where cigs are evil, but marijuania smoke is fine
Where they will persecute you for having cig in the park
But the SF mayor houses an illigal alien Crack-dealing gangster.


And yes... i spell bad... very bad... Thanks the California public school system

Originally posted by TKainZero
And, i made a mistake eailer..

I meant to say.

"It is now Illigal to use the word Illigal. Because, it could offend the illigals..."
- This past summer, the San FranPhysco board of Stupidvisors passed a proclimation that said that Illigal fireworks, no longer should be refered to as 'illigal', but as 'Undocumented"

And yes... i spell bad... very bad... Thanks the California public school system

Don't worry about the spelling. If it bothers you, then use a spellchecker, that's what they're for. Firefox has one built in, for example, that just told me "spellcheck" is not a word but "spellchecker" is. I'm not sure I agree, but I'll go with it.

I had not heard of that proclamation – that is just hilarious! I did a Google search and came up dry; do you have a source about the story? All the references to "undocumented fireworks" I found were tongue-in-cheek comments protesting being forced to calling illegal aliens "undocumented aliens".

I just really wasn't clear on whether you were saying that the Board of Supervisors had made it illegal to say illegal and that was why you were spelling it illigal. But all is now clear.

For what it's worth, I'm a pretty far left liberal, and an ex-smoker to boot, and I think the laws against cigarette smoking in both your city and mine are ridiculous.

EDIT: because even a spellchecker can't catch a typo when it turns "word" into "work"

[edit on 10/15/08 by americandingbat]