McCain was not tortured, PoW guard claims, page 4
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 7 times


reply posted on 16-10-2008 @ 03:31 PM by Retseh
Yet another garbage thread.

Vietnamese prison officials were denying prisoner torture back in 1967, and they still are today, you're 40 years out of date. Fyi - torturers are rarely forthcoming about their crimes.

A couple of other minor points.

Lt. McCain who was completely immobilized when he was dragged half alive from Truc Bach lake, had his shoulder crushed with a rifle butt, and was bayoneted in the groin "for fun". He still bears the scar.

He was denied medical treatment until the delightful vietnamese discovered that he had a famous military father and then he was given enough treatment to just barely keep him alive.

His cell mates in the second jail he was transferred to are on record as saying they expected him to die within a week. McCain was then beaten on a regular 2 hourly cycle when finally he broke and agreed to make an anti-american statement, he then tried to commit suicide but was stopped by his guards. All this has been verified by his cell mates and never once questioned by anyone except those who did the torturing, but that's enough to give it some purchase with the mindless in this site.

While the Vietnamese have consistently denied these allegations for over 40 years, every prisoner, not just McCain has given details of the torture they were forced to endure, so I suppose they must all be liars.

Whatever you think of McCain's politics, he served with incredible honor and bravery in Vietnam, and to attempt to mud sling that is the work of vile and ignorant scum.

[edit on 16-10-2008 by Retseh]


reply posted on 16-10-2008 @ 03:40 PM by Camilo1
Originally posted by Retseh
Yet another garbage thread.

Vietnamese prison officials were denying prisoner torture back in 1967, and they still are today, you're 40 years out of date. Fyi - torturers are rarely forthcoming about their crimes.

A couple of other minor points.

Lt. McCain who was completely immobilized when he was dragged half alive from Truc Bach lake, had his shoulder crushed with a rifle butt, and was bayoneted in the groin "for fun". He still bears the scar.

He was denied medical treatment until the delightful vietnamese discovered that he had a famous military father and then he was given enough treatment to just barely keep him alive.

His cell mates in the second jail he was transferred to are on record as saying they expected him to die within a week. McCain was then beaten on a regular 2 hourly cycle when finally he broke and agreed to make an anti-american statement, he then tried to commit suicide but was stopped by his guards. All this has been verified by his cell mates and never once questioned by anyone except those who did the torturing, but that's enough to give it some purchase with the mindless in this site.

While the Vietnamese have consistently denied these allegations for over 40 years, every prisoner, not just McCain has given details of the torture they were forced to endure, so I suppose they must all be liars.

Whatever you think of McCain's politics, he served with incredible honor and bravery in Vietnam, and to attempt to mud sling that is the work of vile and ignorant scum.

[edit on 16-10-2008 by Retseh]


Could not agree more.

McCain is a hero and a man worthy of all respect and admiration. This thread is a disgrace and dishonours not only McCain but most patriots that have endured torture in prison.

Shame on the OP. This is pure defamation


In law, defamation (also called calumny, libel, slander, and vilification) is the communication of a statement that makes a false claim, expressly stated or implied to be factual, that may give an individual, business, product, group, government or nation a negative image. Slander refers to a malicious, false, and defamatory statement or report, while libel refers to any other form of communication such as written words or images


Source

en.wikipedia.org...


reply posted on 17-10-2008 @ 10:17 AM by Harlequin
reply to post by Camilo1


Ignorance is bliss for you really

the OP in his own words was asking a question; who do we believe?

apparantly your education is lacking in understanding


reply posted on 17-10-2008 @ 11:11 AM by Retseh
Originally posted by Harlequin

Ignorance is bliss for you really

the OP in his own words was asking a question; who do we believe?

apparantly your education is lacking in understanding


Your petty childlike insults against Camilo aside, here is what the OP actually said:



Who are we to believe - a man who has shown he is quite prepared to get into the gutter to further his ambitions?

Or an ex prison guard with little or nothing to gain or lose by saying this.

McCain knows the real answer to this - maybe in his mind it WAS torture, but according to the ex guard, it wasn't.

A matter of perception then?

Or another lie.........



So McCain "gets into the gutter" and is "a liar" while an NVA prison guard associated with torture is just a man "with little to gain".

If you can't see through the vile persona of yet another cynical anti-American Brit troll then it is you who needs an education at least in terms of the British mentality.

A significant number of British nationals are now just as opposed to the happiness and success of the United States as any extremist organization, and they will dredge up any piece of anti-American garbage and peddle it as the truth, but we have come to expect that, and even tolerate it, since they are capable of little more than cynicism these days.

But when one of those repugnant individuals dares to impune the war record of a bona fide decorated American hero, and calls him a liar who is happy to go into the gutter, they cross the line.


reply posted on 17-10-2008 @ 11:45 AM by Harlequin
reply to post by Retseh


child like insults - gosh , how little you know - the OP was asking a question and yet YOU detract from the conversation; how petty.



reply posted on 17-10-2008 @ 12:02 PM by Majic
Our topic:

McCain was not tortured, PoW guard claims

Let's please focus on that and leave the personal commentary for someplace other than ATS.

Thanks.



[edit on 10/17/2008 by Majic]


reply posted on 17-10-2008 @ 12:38 PM by Retseh
Originally posted by Majic
Our topic:

McCain was not tortured, PoW guard claims

Let's please focus on that and leave the personal commentary for someplace other than ATS.

Thanks.



I completely agree, but when you allow the OP to call a war hero a liar who is happy to descend into the gutter, it's already personal. It should have been stopped then.


reply posted on 17-10-2008 @ 01:22 PM by sputniksteve
Originally posted by budski
Originally posted by dbates
reply to post by budski

No, at GITMO they don't break your ribs and knock out your teeth. And to think that McCain actually received special treatment since he was an Admiral's son. Other prisoners were hung from their arms till their shoulders broke and had their thumbs removed.



There is evidence to suggest they DO do that at gitmo, abu ghraib and ALL the other prisons - and we're not talking about other prisoners, we're talking about McCain


Sorry Budski, but just on your last post you said this was all about introducing Gitmo and what not. So what is it, was this all to bring up a comparison to Gitmo, or was it to say that John McCain is a liar?

I think you need to make up your mind what you are trying to accomplish here.


reply posted on 17-10-2008 @ 02:12 PM by Jenna
Originally posted by budski
Who are we to believe - a man who has shown he is quite prepared to get into the gutter to further his ambitions?

Or an ex prison guard with little or nothing to gain or lose by saying this.


Yes because it is simply impossible that the guy who was in charge of the "jail", as they like to call it, would ever lie and say that they didn't do anything wrong. Just as I am sure it is a completely likely story that with all the POW's that were there during the war, and afterwards for that matter, that this guy remembers one of hundreds of prisoners who were tortured and remembers him clearly enough to say that McCain was never tortured. I'm sure that if it had happened then the guy who was running the show in that particular "jail" would be the first to come forward and say "Gee we're sorry we tortured you. Our bad! Won't happen again!" I'm sure that is exactly what he would do.

As we all know, it is completely impossible that this guy was paid a substantial sum of cash to try to discredit what McCain and others have said about what they experienced while there. It's impossible that this guy would lie about torturing, or ordering the torture, of anyone whether it was McCain or some other POW.

Yes I'm sure it was exactly as this guy portrays it.

Did you by chance see this part of the article?

However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get any cooperation"


My emphasis. Look at that, a quote by one of McCain's cellmate's who says McCain was tortured. I'm sure he is lying too right?

Originally posted by Loke.
When people start to say: its the vietnam people fault he got a broken shouldet etc etc. i can only point you towards 2 kinds of people who bears the responsebility.

1.The government who drafted and put these young people into a war in a foreign country where their government had nothing to do.

2.The poor drafted soldiers parents who did not defend their childrens right not to go to war for TPTB.


Yes because it's not the torturers fault they tortured the POW's. Just as it's not the abuser's fault they beat their spouse, child, or parent, nor is it the rapist's fault they forced sexual activity on another person.


reply posted on 17-10-2008 @ 02:29 PM by CreeWolf
reply to post by ZindoDoone


Of course that post was sarcasm. The truly sad thing is that some people actually thought it was serious.

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