Dow Closes. Up 936 Points

And yet another fear mongering talking point blown out of the water:

"The DOW rallied only because of low volume!"

Wrong. Today's volume is the 15th highest of all time. Only 14 other days in the NYSE's history have had a higher volume.
Source: online.wsj.com...

OK, I'll stop now, I might send the fear mongering people into a hysterical fit with all these facts as they struggle for a reason to explain away what was supposed to be "Black Monday" according to most on ATS

[edit on 13-10-2008 by LowLevelMason]

Suckers rally. Deadcat bounce. We have years of bad news ahead. The dollar is going to be worth less. Gas prices dropping as expected. Yay!? Just wait. Thank GW and crew and poppa for taking the United States down a notch. Very intricate planning has brought us to this point. Question whether all UFOs are extraterrestrial. Question who would benefit from a UFO scare. Question who benefits from the massive drop in world markets.

Originally posted by netwarrior

The printing presses are in hyperdrive right now.

I believe we are a ta point where it is not physically possible to print all monies promised due to limitations on obtaining ink, paper and the physical time it takes to print the bills. I am unsure the actual capacity of printing presses to create bills if they ran non-stop.

Lucky money is mostly virtual!

reply to post by tide88


I understand that....and I do stand corrected.

However, do we really know for sure that the money hasn't been used just because the government says so? I believe this government as much as I believe the Earth is flat.

Do I believe that the worlds economy is going to crash? I don't know because I am not in the government or the banking system. But some posters here seem awfully sure that it's not. No one can say 100% that it will or not. That is why I question those who are certain that it won't.

Like you....I am just asking questions.

reply to post by Mainer



Metaphor.

I think the actual "green" money supply in the US is only 3% of all the money that is out there. 97% is nothing but ones and zeroes, on and off, volts or no volts.

Originally posted by LowLevelMason
And yet another fear mongering talking point blown out of the water:

"The DOW rallied only because of low volume!"

Wrong. Today's volume is the 15th highest of all time. Only 14 other days in the NYSE's history have had a higher volume.
Source: online.wsj.com...

OK, I'll stop now, I might send the fear mongering people into a hysterical fit with all these facts as they struggle for a reason to explain away what was supposed to be "Black Monday" according to most on ATS

[edit on 13-10-2008 by LowLevelMason]

This is true. However, the fact that banks were closed today DID effect the trading. I don't want the market or the economy to fail, frankly, I like my cable, I like my vacations, and I even like WalMart.
Nevertheless, I am bettin' on hard times ahead. This was, is, whatever, a dead cat bounce the size of Siberian Tiger. This is market volatility defined.

Sorry to smack down your sunshine, dittohead feelings of hope.

Originally posted by Mainer
I believe we are a ta point where it is not physically possible to print all monies promised due to limitations on obtaining ink, paper and the physical time it takes to print the bills.

Maybe they should start printing bills in larger denominations?

$10,000 bills
$100,000 bills
$1,000,000 bills
$1,000,000,000 bills

[edit on 13-10-2008 by In nothing we trust]

Originally posted by In nothing we trust

Originally posted by Mainer
I believe we are a ta point where it is not physically possible to print all monies promised due to limitations on obtaining ink, paper and the physical time it takes to print the bills.

Maybe they should start printing bills in larger denominations?

$10,000 bills
$100,000 bills
$1,000,000 bills
$1,000,000,000 bills

[edit on 13-10-2008 by In nothing we trust]

It worked for Zimbabwae! Oh... wait...

Also, to correct a wrong perception several seem to harbor about me, I am NOT a doomsayer. If anything, I was one of the most doe-eyed dreamers on ATS for quite awhile. The simple fact is, the last month or so have made me open my eyes to alot of stuff I used to spend countless precious hours defending against your so-called "doomsayers" here. I'd love to be doe-eyed again, really, I would. Unfortunately I cannot afford myself the luxury of viewing one abberrant "good" day after a long string of truly horroriffic economic days as suddenly returning us to the land of sunshine & farts. Our market had a tumultuous an extraordinarily volitile day today, the important thing isn't the direction it went, but the fact that it went in this direction so drastically. One thing about the economy, drastic is NEVER good and NEVER sustainable.

Also, like I said before, regardless of whether today's upswing sustains itself or ends up being completely wiped out by week's end, one issue remains. We, the American tax payers, still stand before this market SCREWED by our own government. The bailout was, plain and simple, financial rape. It was every bit as damaging as the Japanese soldiers rape of Nanking in WWII. Furthermore, Wall Street was an implicit accomplice in that raping of America. Don't know about you, but I have just a little bit of trouble making eye contact with someone who just railed me, let alone congratulating them on their score.

this bounce should have bite.

this was throwing the kitchen sink at the problem

I'm not sure why pauslon didn't use the plan that Europe did initially, but the europeans leading the way with the bailout (made Paulson look utterly inept or corrupt) or both, the forefathers would have hung him in times square if they were around. too bad they are not. He would have had lot o' company

don't think the market will go that much higher but it could at least find a stable trading range for a month or so, earnings are going to be awful, so the bottom is not in, but the short term bottom appears to be, so long as no one else drops a credit crisis grenade in the building

the big question is let's see if the bank's start lending again

You guys,who are breathing sighs of relief don't see the bigger picture here the trans-national bankers and their facist backers got what they wanted they fatally weakend the dollar and made the point that the markets will do what they want them to do so if anyone gets the nerve to speak out against them they will simply let the golbal economy crash.This was a power play pure and simple.

[edit on 13-10-2008 by mike dangerously]

Originally posted by cpdaman
... so long as no one else drops a credit crisis grenade in the building

I'm sure any other bad news will be released in private to Paulson and Bernanke so that the offending party can receive their secret payoff to give the illusion of a healthy balance sheet.

the big question is let's see if the bank's start lending again

You mean too poor people with bad credit and no income right?

[edit on 13-10-2008 by In nothing we trust]

Hmmm, haven't heard about any change in plans by GM in plants that are going to be shut down and the resulting job losses. Correct me if I am wrong, but will that not translate to less morgage payments being mae on time by people that were responsible but victims of knee-jerk reactionary planning by those that never worked a day in their life?

In my factory, a supplier to a locomotive builer, we had an order of parts for 700 or so to be built this year. We did maybe half of those so far. Next years order to date is for 27...my particular area can build those parts in 10 days provided we have parts on hand. So, yeah. I could finish out the remaining job orders for this year and next by Halloween easy.

A 2 billion point upswing of the Dow Jones does not fix the problems of the system:

That being a valueless currency that only has a remotely vague tangibility which is getting more added to the mix an the Fed orders more printed.

The people with large amounts of cash have no tangible means to spread the wealth and make more the old fashioned way by having a wide and diverse trade.

People with less brains than they will admit play the market instead of going to casinos with the hope of they will become the house with the odds in their favor.

People that have less depend too greatly with full faith and credit that those they do trade time in labor to that become richer will honor the contract of collective benefit. All too often it is the hourly worker that suffers while the salary worker has made their stake and moved on.

And lastly, that people willing put up with such a closed loop system in which they have not voice nor control over their own destiny due trying to participate in low risk advancement of their own lives and that of their family. Me, I have it easy as I have never married nor fathered children. I can pack up my stuff and move out to where no one lives and substance survive until my eventual mortality finds me. But the family of 4 can not in good conscience subject themselves the same way especially when the friendly fractional reserve banker wants his interest on dollars that never physically existed in the first place. All because some billionare would like to know why his $10 million investment devalued itself by $500 on an otherwise dreary Thursday out of pure subject concensus of the probable value of his stock at that particular moment. Nevermind the fact that it will rebound tomorrow or the next day to a net gain of $200 because the foreclosure papers have already been drawn so no sense in letting that effort go to waste.

Personally I find it hard to get too excited as I could have dropped a $100 on Ford Motor Company last Friday and could have sold today for a $2 gain, then there are those pesky broker fees....now if I had a spare $100 million last Friday, E-Trade would have cut a me check for $1,999,950.

But if I had $100M laying around I would back a summer blockbuster for a far larger return. Put about 6000 to work directly and indirectly via movie theaters. And maybe won an Acadamy Award for not being a tightwad or whatever that catagory is called now.

If I remember my history correctly, the stock market made enough of a comeback that people stopped worrying right before the greatest stock market crash in history.

I'm going to just watch and see what happens in the near future with the stock market in today's economy. I'm just glad I don't have anything in it.

Originally posted by Mystery_Lady
I'm going to just watch and see what happens in the near future with the stock market in today's economy. I'm just glad I don't have anything in it.

A wise lady.

JK

Originally posted by Ahabstar

The people with large amounts of cash have no tangible means to spread the wealth and make more the old fashioned way by having a wide and diverse trade.

People with less brains than they will admit play the market instead of going to casinos with the hope of they will become the house with the odds in their favor.

There is a huge disconnect between reality in the greater economy and the stock market.

This post is addressed to the Low Level Mason-

I want to see the stock market go down. I want it to crash and burn. I want the elite bankers to melt away into the abyss. I want the monetary system to crumble, and all those people associated with financial management (from accountants to consultants to stockbrokers to the Rothschilds and Rockefellers of this world) to find employment in servitude of their fellow man rather than themselves.

I want to see the Federal Reserve scam abolished. I want all the corrupt crooks in charge of the Fed held accountable for their actions. I want every citizen of this planet to know how our way of life was hijacked in 1913. I want to see that DOW shrink to absolute zero.

I have no fear in the world about anything. If you fear my words, then it's obvious you are a slave to the system, a slave to money.. a slave to money values.. the utilitarian value associated with it.. and it is YOU who is the fearful one.

I am not a fear mongerer. I am a freedom mongerer.

Hit the end with a champagne bottle cork in the random act of celebration. The swap is bubbly.

Columbus Day

Culumbuy Das

The subliminal message Columbuy Das commands you. The greed takes the shape of a tin soldier that a brainchild shall play with.

"Let me take you to the fountain," said Orlock to the blind and began mince the words.

those who buy
hit the sky
those who sell
go to hell

reply to post by RiotComing

We scream that we want change. The problem is not many are ready to give up the luxuries they are now enjoying. They don't want to leave their comfort zone.

I have felt the same as you but just had not voiced it yet for fear of seeming uncaring of the hardships some people will find themselves in.

We are not going to have good change in our way of life without sacrifice. I am ready to get back to nature and the 'good life' our forefathers had.

Thank you for your post. You said what I wanted to say but had not the courage to do so.

It started as soon as Europe put some money inthe system:

Europe put $2.3 trillion on the line Monday to protect the continent's banks, a figure that dwarfs the Bush administration's $700 billion rescue program, in its most unified response yet to the global financial crisis after a stumbling start.

link to article (Yahoo)

reply to post by dlongwell547


I'll make some bets:

The fact that the Dow is up tells you nothing about individual companies and consequently job cuts, which is perhaps the root driver of the economy. People without jobs don't have any discretionary spend money.

A lot of stock was sold and then bought again not necessarily in the same proportions. Weaker companies are going to take a hit and some may disappear.

GM is already merging with Chrysler, a move predicted months ago which is likely to result in job cuts. Detroit in general is going to have a surge in unemployment. And there may be more mergers ahead, given how ford is doing. That alone could be scary as the auto manufacturing sector is such a large chunk of our industry, it depends on steel, it affects local producers of paints, glues, plastics, manufacturing equipment and so on.

Ebay already announced job cuts as well.

The extent of the job losses will not be fully understood until after Christmas where consumer spending will reflect quite clearly how the economy is doing.

-rrr