Obama=New Party New Party=Socialist

Not that it matters to half of Americans but there is now proof that Obama really is the socialist the other half of Americans have warned he is:

newsbusters.org...

This shouldn't surprise anyone that's been listening. I dout it will change any of the minds of the hook, line and sinker crowd either...

Unfortunately the MSM reporting on this is not the major issue here.

What is truly scary is that more and more people are aware of Obama's socialist tendencies, and simply don't mind. There is an ever growing population here in America who don't view us becoming a socialist nation as a bad thing.

That's what scares me.

I'm not from America, so I confess I may not have a relevant opinion here, but why is America becoming socialist such a bad idea, at least as far as things such as a National Health Service etc.?

I just saw obama talking about jobs. Government jobs for for the stasi, sould be big business.

I doubt many americans even know what living under socialism is like. They probably are so dumbed down, like there programmers want that they cannot tell left from right.

But i like many people outside us, think socialism would be good for usa.

[edit on 10/13/2008 by andy1033]

a) there is a thread about this already
b) New Party is a weak halo of Dems
c) who cares...

reply to post by buddhasystem


There is a thread already discussing this topic here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Umm... you Kinda got it....


The "Dems" have been transformed into the Socialsit Party USA...

The Republicans have turned to your new Liberal party...

and the average man is screwed...

Soon there will be a legitimate thrid party...

soon, we wont have to take this BS Repubacrat, Demican nonsens...



But for now...

We are stuck with Obama v McCain...

The worst election in recored history

reply to post by TKainZero


The reason that Socialism will not work here is this,
Look at every Gov. sponsored project in America. It sucks and does not work. It only gives the Gov. more power when you socialize anything. more control of your money. To be honest, look around you. the things you have and the type of lifestyle you are living, you have a chance to change. By being ambitious and getting off your butts and making something of your self, the resources are there. That is the definition of a free society. That is capitalism. If it is done properly and regulated to the point of fairness, (not wealth re-distribution) but the corruption of CEOs and executives, It will work again.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
reply to post by TKainZero

 

If it is done properly and regulated to the point of fairness, (not wealth re-distribution) but the corruption of CEOs and executives, It will work again.

Well it is currently not done properly and the widespread corruption has caused massive wealth redistribution, benefitting a very small percentage of our population. If this is capitalism then it not hard to see why socialism has become so popular. Personally I endorse a sytem where we socialize to some degree all the essential elements of our modern well being. Energy, Healthcare, Basic food supplies, etc. Goverment would hire or oversee and regulate private corporations and allow them profits based on how well they have performed their mission. I think this would be a good compromise. It would allow companies to make profits but would also make those profits dependent on doing the right thing for all of society.

Socialist, for Americans is just another word for Evil. It was demonized by the Reagen administration in the 1980's and has remained as such for conservatives ever since.

Most Americans cannot even accurately describe what Socialism really means.

Edit: Which is ironic, because the same group who label Socialism as the anti-christ have never even comtemplated the pitfalls of Capitalism.

(Because it would be sacrilege and would result in damnation)....

[edit on 10/14/2008 by Choronzon]

i care.

so i gave ya a star.

Originally posted by GTasker
I'm not from America, so I confess I may not have a relevant opinion here, but why is America becoming socialist such a bad idea, at least as far as things such as a National Health Service etc.?

Simply put:

Socialism is unconstitutional.

Socialism allows government to overstep its bounds and stick its big nose where it doesn't belong.

Originally posted by LiquidMirage

Originally posted by GTasker
I'm not from America, so I confess I may not have a relevant opinion here, but why is America becoming socialist such a bad idea, at least as far as things such as a National Health Service etc.?

Simply put:

Socialism is unconstitutional.

Socialism allows government to overstep its bounds and stick its big nose where it doesn't belong.

Which of course doesn't answer his question. Also, the government overstepping it's intended bounds is hardly something rare. Just look at the current administration.

To use "socialism" as an argument in itself (since the soviet union wasn't such a great idea, everything about socialism must be bad) is getting ridiculous. Some "redistribution" must sometimes be done to build a better society.

If you can shell up 700 billion to bailout the wall street gamblers, surely some money to infrastructure, health care and other things that makes a modern society function shouldn't be a problem, right?

Originally posted by LiquidMirage

Originally posted by GTasker
I'm not from America, so I confess I may not have a relevant opinion here, but why is America becoming socialist such a bad idea, at least as far as things such as a National Health Service etc.?

Simply put:

Socialism is unconstitutional.

Socialism allows government to overstep its bounds and stick its big nose where it doesn't belong.

Like it hasn't oversteped already taking many of our freedoms, a mix of the 2 could be good, look a switzerland for example.

Not saying thats exactly what I want but saying it works.

From each, according to his ability, to each, according to his need.

Who gets to define "need"? This will result is nepotism and corruption beyond yor wildest dreams.

Your wife needs a heart transplant? Sorry. The developmentally challenged child across town "needs" to have their teeth straightened in order to improve their self-esteem.

And why should anyone strive to succeed, since all they need to do is claim "need" to get anything they want?

State ownership of the means of production.

It is a well-proven fact that private industry always outperforms gov't ownership of industry. Gov't ownership has no competition, which breeds inefficiency, high costs, and corruption.

Since gov't decides who gets the management roles, socialism results in a true two-class system of society.

Since gov't owns the means of production, how will it finance it's own "needs"?

That is where you,the taxpayer, come into the equation.

Get yourself ready for tax rates exceeding 60%.

Since you will be unable to afford the basic necessities under this system, price controls will need to be implemented. Inflation will soar.

Think our economy is in the crapper *now*? Vote Obama/Biden and see how bad things can really be!

They have already stated:

The need for wealth redistribution (Obama)

Paying higher taxes is "patriotic" (Biden)

They have not tried to hide their intentions. They have come out in the open and told you what they intend to do.

Yet people are too blind to realize that a noose is being slipped over their heads...

You will get the gov't you deserve.

I'm British and to me Fascist is a dirty word and Communist is a dirty word. Socialism is a funny one, because early socialist thought is very Christian, Methodist. Then the old Comms took it into their mantle.

I'm gently right wing leaning, and always want to engage in the debate, but Europe is not Socialist. Angela Merkel in Germany once wanted a flat tax, Sarkozy wants Thatcherism and they are the two powerhouses in Europe aside from the failing powerhouse that is New Labour in Britain.

Europe differs from America in that we believe if we can get policies together that help all of us, we will pay the up front rather than bitch over what's what. That is the ultimate difference between the EU and the US. That is not socialism, it is wisdom.

reply to post by redled


There is little comparison between Europe and the US. Many European nations are smaller than some US states. You are all crowded into one geographical area, and the differences between your countries are little more than cultural.

European unemployment, taxation, and inflation rates are higher than the US. Your petrol costs are much higher than ours. The GDP of the entire European Union is a fraction of the US GDP.

Those are the advantages of co-operation? That is "wisdom"?

Originally posted by jsobecky
reply to post by redled

 

There is little comparison between Europe and the US. Many European nations are smaller than some US states. You are all crowded into one geographical area, and the differences between your countries are little more than cultural.

European unemployment, taxation, and inflation rates are higher than the US. Your petrol costs are much higher than ours. The GDP of the entire European Union is a fraction of the US GDP.

Those are the advantages of co-operation? That is "wisdom"?

We use a lot less of the world's resources than you, and you will come round to this way of thinking. You have more land sure, and so will have more of the fertility of the Earth for it. We co-operate with what little land space we have and have less differentials between income brackets and less homicides. Point is, to be like us is not socialist, most of us stood shoulder to shoulder with you against the clearly ideological USSR.

reply to post by TKainZero


NO, all wrong.

1.) Bush, Mccain, the BUSH and Rovian power lines have done ANYTHING they want to do. Mainly; KEEP WEALTH to top 5%, give tax breaks to large corporations. WHEN people lose jobs, then apply for food stamps and cash assistance and MEDICAL that is state and federally funded, IF YOU PAY TAXES, you pay for it. DEBT is then SOCIALIZED truly, as is a bad life for those not in with those mentioned in my first point.

2.) Stealing elections, suppression of votes, DIVISIVE politics that use racism, stretching truth. FACT; GOP is the party of HITLER today. Guantanimo Bay anyone??? Persecution? Breaking laws, NATIONALIZING DEBTs. If you are one of those 5% who get wealth SOCIALIZED AWAY FROM POOR AND MIDDLE CLASSES to your family, I guess I am typing for ignorant brains.

3.) PEOPLE can be rich, and still pay taxes. ANOTHER fact; jobs go over seas, normal Americans lose jobs, and it CUTS the economy as less is bought (LOOK at the RECESSION we are in now), and THESE CORPORATIONS want the rewards of being "American" but think the military and their lifestyle is all that matters. UNTIL I hear somebody like Palin's son is DEAD, and SEE HER REACTION, for all I know he is deployed to ALASKA on some outpost where nobody can see him, he is safe, and at some outpost sending text messages on the activity in the waters between Alaska and Russia. OBAMA WANTS to make sure these corporations NO LONGER USE LOOPHOLES AND DEREGULATION to cause messes, then get their damn MILLION DOLLAR "Thanks for screwing it up, but you are rich so we have to keep your status then bring in somebody else to collect money doing NOTHING for it" award.

--THIS crap is just that--CRAP. It is "Okay" to socialize debt for the "Wealthy" and "Elite", but if a person wants NORMAL people to be able to eat, and SURVIVE, he is a "Socialist"? Yeah, okay, I see your logic. Mccain and the Neocon (artists) have their idiot guys like those arrested on here also to spread nonsense.

Originally posted by LiquidMirage

Originally posted by GTasker
I'm not from America, so I confess I may not have a relevant opinion here, but why is America becoming socialist such a bad idea, at least as far as things such as a National Health Service etc.?

Simply put:

Socialism is unconstitutional.

Socialism allows government to overstep its bounds and stick its big nose where it doesn't belong.

Yeah, ask Bush about socialism towards the rich. Lets just call it what it is; FAVOR his friends, the rich, the elite, then everyone else can starve and just SUPPRESS their votes, lie, use legal tactics with CORRUPT judges like the ONE in Ohio BEFORE the Supreme Court judge corrected that mess. NO votes should be purged, moron. This Neocon crap is idiocy. THE true line is rich and poor. MANY argue the NWO is the TOP of this, and hates on them. THE GOP IS THE NWO IN AMERICA. They have become the party of Hitler. See their lies? Hitler once said, and this is a paraphrase; "If you repeate a lie, especially a larger lie, over and over, it will be more believable." EVEN on camera, even with recordings, even things said to MY FACE, Neocon types rephrase, spin around, but NEVER admit wrong. FIRST rule of a lie; NEVER admit it. SECOND rule; NEVER ADMIT IT. Third rule; redefine, dance around it, re-explain that DOES NOT undermine your initial lie, if you must, BUT NEVER ADMIT IT.

Tucker Bounds, Nancy Pf (odd last name, oil lobbyist though), Rove, and others are professional liars. I'd love to play No Limit Hold'em against them. SO predictably dishonest. People IMAGINE the NWO, cite odds and ends, BUT right in front of our faces, there is division, evil, international laws being ignored (Guantanimo Bay for instance and TORTURE), people being "ABOVE THE LAW" also. Yet we allow fools to come into out forums then spread garbage. Insane. I can give proof of everything I say. SOCIALISM has been going on, BUT FOR THE TOP 5% and it was NOT an issue. NOW, suddenly, a guy gives HOPE that he might make sure normal people with families like me MIGHT get a tax break, MIGHT have a CHristmas, might be able to make the car payment, and some rich little prick and some Neocon MANIPULATOR has the audacity to say "Socialism is wrong." You and mommy's money will be okay kids, that rich family will still be okay, just tax laws enforced and actually have to take SOME responsibility. I wish I could sit at a restaurant, INHERIT my seat, then have EVERYONE else pay 10 dollars to my 1 dollar, then on top of that, I would be RICH, and have like a million dollars to their HUNDRED dollars. The ratio is NOT that kind. So I don't want to hear the "Socialism crap."

--YOUR beloved "Mccain" pupped who Rothschild (one of them) ENDORSED, who the NEOCONS support, who Bush supports, he ONCE said the same thing on taxes as Obama; NOT even close to fair for most citizens. BUT, he sold his soul to the DEVIL for a shot and he still might STEAL it. IF there is a GOD, he won't get near the Presidency.