Why organised religion should be purged from society.

bernie.cncfamily.com...

First off,I would like participants of this thread to read this speech by a gentlemen named Jiddu Krishnamurti.I will give you a little background.This man was ordained to be a messiah when he was 13 years old.The speech he gave was delivered in 1929.He was to address thousands of followers and listeners.After enlightenment,he disbanded the Order of the Star,the society which had groomed him for this role.What courage this man possessed!Much of what he says is as relevant then as it is now.It transcends all religions,none are beyond its reproach,and its ideas are testable and logical.

I first read this speech when I was studying the life and writings of Bruce Lee many years ago when I was a teenager.This speech profoundly impacted Bruce Lee,because of its philosophical underpinnings.This speech helped him to understand and conceptualize the philosophical tenets of Jeet Kune Do.

This is not a call to violent action.Rather,it is a call for people to start exposing organized religion,including organized atheism,for what it is.Make copies of this speech and post them where you can.This will not effect change overnight,but it will plant seeds in the minds of humanity.You are likely to be attacked,which is symptomatic of power structures afraid of losing the control they have wielded over humanity for so long,and of people who are afraid of intellectual freedom.This is not anti-religion,it is anti-organized religion.

It is time to take back our personal relationship with truth,as it truly is a pathless land.No longer should we be frightened into submission by an angry God,or told that happiness and salvation are islands that exist only in certain spots of the oceans and seas of the different faiths.We should all have the right to an education of all religions,starting from a young age,and the freedom to choose or not to choose any religion at all.Every religion should be relentlessly scrutinized and exposed if any wrongdoing by its established leadership or "flock" is found.It is time to start a mass campaign against hypocrisy and subterfuge.

Is there a difference between the man who forces someone to read the bible as truth, and the man who forces someone to not read the bible?

I think not.

Originally posted by badmedia
Is there a difference between the man who forces someone to read the bible as truth, and the man who forces someone to not read the bible?

I think not.

What?Where did I say I would force someone to do anything?You need to read this more slowly,more carefully please.I encourage everyone to read the Bible,the Koran,The Tao Te Ching,etc.etc.And by the way,You are right.That is my point.Are you agreeing with me?I cannot tell.Please,explain your point,and how it is relevant to this thread.I am not attacking any ones personal belief system,just the arrogant idea that theirs is the only true belief system.

I was agreeing. What I said is what many people seem to not get. They see their image/1 truth as being the only correct one, and as such they do not see or understand what I said. They think it is different because their idol is right, and theirs is wrong. That in action, they become exactly what they rebel against. The other side of the coin is still on the same coin. A dualistic reality, which is easily manipulated.

And it's not just in religion, it's in politics and everywhere else.

I also call it believing in the variables instead of the equation. Like if you are focusing on the image of Jesus, rather than the philosophy. Because you could put any image in the place of Jesus, it's the philosophy that is important. When I program something, I just create equations. From those equations I can generate an unlimited amount of results. Your interaction is just where you decide to change some of the variables. To say 1 result was more true than another result would be a lie.

Like take a google search. Every search runs across the same search code. Your search term is the variable you change. If you took 1 page of results, called it the "truth" and all other results are invalid, then you would be focusing on the variables instead of the equation. Or you would be focusing on the image(result) of Jesus, rather than the philosophy(code) of Jesus.

And like with what I said, there is no difference in the person who forces the bible, and one who forces no bible because the action(code) is the same.

I agree with you, I just look for ways to explain it so that people can understand it better.

Good point.Thanks for clarifying.I think that the search engine analogy is a great example.

reply to post by daeoeste


This is an excellent post which I will Flag and star. I am studying different religions (apart from Christianity) and find a common thread through all these religions- the need to behave in a 'moral' way and the concept of judgement on actions in this life after death. The search for truth is individual and often lonely. However, there is a problem here. Having found what appears to be a truth, how could it be possible put the theory into practice without a community of like minded people? How is it possible to spread good actions without others willing to go into their disparate communities and spread the 'goodness?' Human beings have developed language as a condition of living in groups; tribes and then villages and then towns etc... I suppose this is the point of organised religion - much more can be done together than a diaspora of intellectuals reasoning the truth for themselves.

My main point is that there will always be a need for organised religion in society.

reply to post by daeoeste


Just remain calm, in a few years you'll be able to help the antichrist remove organized religion from the face of the Earth.

Patience my friend.

We lead by example.Ethics exist apart from religion.Religion is no longer needed as an organizer.In fact,It only leads to fractures in humanity as a whole as long as it has existed.This IS the grand conspiracy.We are all affected by it,whether we believe in one or the other.It is no longer needed in our society,and is used mainly to enslave,not to enlighten.If it was here to enlighten us,we would not have the troubles we have in the world today.We cannot look at only the good it has done and and tip the scales towards that good.It has done more harm as a whole than good.Good,selfless and ethical action does not only exist in religion or atheism.We should be our own leaders.The only point of organized religion is to hijack peoples natural understanding that something greater than ourselves exists.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by daeoeste

 

Just remain calm, in a few years you'll be able to help the antichrist remove organized religion from the face of the Earth.

Patience my friend.

This is exactly what I am talking about.Note how there is a perceived "Greater awareness" of some external spiritual threat,and the person uses this in the hope that any reader will be frightened into submission by this "knowing sage" who believes that I am unknowingly or knowingly helping his or her "devil" by deceiving people with a simple idea.If you were alive to see the actual formation and evolution of your religion my friend,you would run screaming,wondering how it was you and yours were so manipulated for so long.

[edit on 113131p://2417 by daeoeste]

Yes notyourtypical hit the nail on the head! Which is sad because antichrist will do this and he will form all religions into his one world philosiphy at the same time ridding the world of Christ. And if we try and hold on to christ we will be sluaghtered or imprisoned.

Many saints predicted this, I made a post about it, and the bible predicted this and it will happen.

You see freemasons have also been planning this one world order for decades, but they need to bring this plan about by wars. This is why they have infiltrted the catholic church and infest the hierarchy so they can bring this about in the church so he will sit in the temple of God.

and this isn't far off. If I am right about the two 12 year old boys then this antichrist will be here in about 2016/2019

so you will get your wish soon, and it will only last 3 years then antichrist will be destroyed.


and the (true) Christ will return to end this pathetic world and bring real peace.






[edit on 12-10-2008 by JesusisTruth]

[edit on 12-10-2008 by JesusisTruth]

Goodness.What I wrote goes against any order of any kind.You people really need to read this more carefully.You can be christians.And you should.No one should be persecuted for their beliefs.I encourage people to have them.What I do not encourage is the arrogant assumption that yours is the only one that has any merit.This is plain as day,and the source of persecution.Your adherence to this idea of "universal perfection" does not save souls,for every one you think it saves creates more enemies out of people who do not conform to those ideas.He did hit a nail on the head,driving it into the walls built to reinforce the gilded cages of knee-jerk dogma.

Yea but you just said.

" you should be Christian I encourage it "


yet brother our scripture says.

about jesus.


" I am the way the truth and the life "

" If you do not believe in me you shall perish "


so how can i listen to this Jesus who worked tons of miracles, and yet believe that God would not have one solid truth and everything is just the equal belief?


everything cannot be true or God is divided against himself in truth so one has to be right.


peace.

Gosh, I think some folks in here have missed the point of the message. It is not about putting down your beliefs. It is about weakening organized religions. The organized religions have been in control for centuries.

Spirituality is an INDIVIDUAL thing. Truth can not be coerced on people. It can not be organized.

Do not depend on others for your happiness or your spirituality.

Originally posted by JesusisTruth
Yes notyourtypical hit the nail on the head! Which is sad because antichrist will do this and he will form all religions into his one world philosiphy at the same time ridding the world of Christ. And if we try and hold on to christ we will be sluaghtered or imprisoned.

so you will get your wish soon, and it will only last 3 years then antichrist will be destroyed.

What does this have to do with the topic? This fellow J. Krishnamurti is against any kinds of organized religion, including one world religion under your "antichrist."

Truth is not a person to follow. That includes J. Krishnamurti, Jesus, Muhammad, Budda, your antichrist, etc. The message is what's important.

Originally posted by Deaf Alien
Gosh, I think some folks in here have missed the point of the message. It is not about putting down your beliefs. It is about weakening organized religions. The organized religions have been in control for centuries.

Spirituality is an INDIVIDUAL thing. Truth can not be coerced on people. It can not be organized.

Do not depend on others for your happiness or your spirituality.

Yes!!!This is my simple point.Some people warp what Jesus said.I am taking on years of misquoting and altering original texts,as far as Christianity and Islam are concerned.It is individual truth that should be emphasized.I do not believe that a loving god would sentence most of the earth to eternity in hell for not believing in him.There are over 300 sects of Christianity present today,all arguing that their interpretation of the bible are correct.

reply to post by daeoeste


I keep hearing the same christian argument over and over. Their argument is that without religion and god (actually THEIR religion and god), there would be chaos. Everyone will do whatever they want to do. There would be no morals.

In essence, they are saying that we MUST have some form of organized religion to keep us under check, to impose morality on us, to make sure we don't go killing each other.

This is one of their biggest strawman arguments. We do not need religion for morals. We are perfectly capable of being moral.

reply to post by Heronumber0

My main point is that there will always be a need for organised religion in society.

Not necessarily. It is true that humans are social creatures. They band together to form clans, tribes, families, etc. They have their own cultures and philosophy. Some can share their beliefs and spirituality and even debate and discuss about them without fear of persecution.

The real danger is when someone comes along and proclaim one true religion and truth. The rest is wrong. Some people will start to follow this person and organized religion is born. Then comes the persecution of other people for their beliefs. Then the killing starts. And separation starts. Then wars start over different beliefs.

You see the point? No. There is NO need for organized religion.

The ancient greeks had the right idea. Many discussed and debate various beliefs and philosophy freely. Their culture blossomed. Many great writings came out of it.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


The anti-Christ's goal will not only be to remove organized religion, but to basically eliminate any form of spirituality. When it comes to that, I will fight against him with my last dying breath.

[edit on 12-10-2008 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

The anti-Christ's goal will not only be to remove organized religion, but to basically eliminate any form of spirituality. When it comes to that, I will fight against him with my last dying breath.

[edit on 12-10-2008 by SpeakerofTruth]

I will gladly join any fight to abolish spirituality.But I thought you said earlier that he would form a new,unified church?It would most likely be a new christian faith.Keep your eyes on the ball,brother.Christians are not above deception.If organized religion is ever abolished,which would be a great step forward in the evolution of humankind,people could still believe and have faith.

edited to sayh,that was not you who said that.Sorry!!

[edit on 013131p://3217 by daeoeste]

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

The anti-Christ's goal will not only be to remove organized religion, but to basically eliminate any form of spirituality. When it comes to that, I will fight against him with my last dying breath.

How did the anti-Christ come in this? The topic has nothing to do with anti-Christ.

Anyway, to be clear, are you all for organized religion? Do you believe that it is necessary?

But I am with you on fighting against anyone who tries to eliminate any form of spirituality. I will fight anyone who tries to impose his beliefs or religion on me.

However, if anyone tries to eliminate organized religions, I will just sit back and enjoy the show.