The American way of life is dead… , page 9
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 9 times


reply posted on 4-11-2008 @ 03:44 PM by poet1b
reply to post by magicmushroom


Nowhere did I claim that the U.S. is the only nation with freedoms, I just claimed that we were the first to fully embrace such concepts since maybe the Romans. These days many Europeans may actually enjoy more freedoms that those of us in the U.S..

All I am pointing out is that the liberty offerred by U.S. idealism as expressed in our declaration of Indpendence and our constitution is possibly the biggest factor in making the U.S. successful as a nation, and that isn't changing.

Why do you insist on making everything about the U.S. verses the world? Why must my defense of my country be twisted into a claim of superiority? Why do you always grossly distort what I am saying?


reply posted on 4-11-2008 @ 04:11 PM by poet1b
reply to post by magicmushroom


Nope, that is just the way you interpret things.

Mod Edit: No need for the snarkiness. Cheers.

[edit on 9-11-2008 by alien]


reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 04:58 AM by poet1b
reply to post by magicmushroom


Where is the superiority? Where in any of these statements do I claim the U.S. is better than any other nation, or that Americans are superior to any other nation?

How does telling people who don't think the U.S. will get through this to forget about the U.S. make any claims of superiority?

Racism? Where do I make any statements about race? All immigrants includes people of my own race.

All you have done is prove me right once again, and yourself wrong.


reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 05:08 AM by poet1b
reply to post by sadchild01


All you are stating is your opinion. Where is your proof that all of these technologies were only developed by degreed engineers. Who pioneered the rocket industry? Where did these technologies evolve from, and who made the critical breakthroughs.

If you had a clue you would know that the concepts on which skyscrapers were designed were developed by copying the framing techniques developed by carpenters just outside of Chicago.

The people of the U.S., like the people of western Europe excel at technological innovation because we are free to explore new concepts, new life styles, new arts, new ways of thinking.

What really shows your lack of understanding is that you can not see a connection between science and art, between innovation and imagination. It is no accident that the countries which dominate in technology also tend to dominate in the arts as well.


reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 08:13 AM by sadchild01
reply to post by poet1b




Where is your proof that all of these technologies were only developed by degreed engineers.


and you are stating opinion , as you have virtually no proof , that major revolutionary breakthroughs were not from degreed engineers



Who pioneered the rocket industry?


the first truelly accurate rockets were pioneered by Alexander Dmitrievich Zasyadko , was a Russian-Ukrainian gunner and specialist in rocketry, Lieutenant General
In 1797, Zasyadko graduated from the Artillery and Engineering School in Saint Petersburg (currently Mozhaysky Military Engineering-Space University). In 1799, he participated in the Italian campaign of the Russian army under the command of Aleksandr Suvorov, Russo-Turkish War of 1806-1812 and Patriotic War of 1812.(also was responsible for the start of rocket industry in Russia)

and as for the space rocket launch system , it was a Sergei Korolyev

Having graduated, Korolyov began work at an aircraft design bureau designated OPO-4, or 4th Experimental Section.
----
n spite of the Soviet progress on ICBM technology, Korolyov was preoccupied with the use of rockets for space travel. In 1953 he first proposed the use of the R-7 design for launching a satellite into orbit. He pushed his ideas with the Russian Academy of Sciences, including a concept for sending a dog into space. He also had to overcome resistance in the military and among party members.
In 1957, during the International Geophysical Year, the concept of launching a satellite began to appear in the American press. The US government was not well disposed toward the idea of spending millions of dollars on this concept, and so it was effectively frozen for a period. However Korolyov's group followed the Western press, and they thought it possible to beat the US to the punch. He was finally able to win over support because of competition with the United States by suggesting that the USSR should try to be the first country to launch a satellite.

The actual development of Sputnik was performed in less than a month. This was a very simple design, consisting of little more than a polished metal sphere, a transmitter, thermal measuring instruments, and batteries. Korolyov personally managed the assembly, and the work was very hectic. Finally on October 4, 1957, launched on a rocket that had only successfully launched once, the satellite was placed in orbit.

The effect of this launch was electric, and produced many political ramifications for the future. Khrushchev was pleased with this success, and decided that it should be followed up by a new achievement in time for the 40th anniversary of the October Revolution. This was less than a month away, on November 3rd. The result was Sputnik 2.
en.wikipedia.org...


again we entered space age thanks to degreed engineers



If you had a clue you would know that the concepts on which skyscrapers were designed were developed by copying the framing techniques developed by carpenters just outside of Chicago.


one of the first true skyscraper structures were was pioneered by British architects Alfred Waterhouse and Richard Lane , and Richard Lane had studied and completed architecture related studies in the famous École des Beaux-Arts in France ,


The United Kingdom also had its share of early skyscrapers. The first building to fit the engineering definition, meanwhile, was the then largest hotel in the world, the Grand Midland Hotel, now known as St Pancras Chambers in London, opened in 1873 with a clock tower 82 metres (269 ft) in height. The 12-floor Shell Mex House in London, at 58 metres (190 ft), was completed a year after the Home Insurance Building and managed to beat it in both height and floor count. 1877 saw the opening of the Gothic revival style Manchester Town Hall by Alfred Waterhouse. Its 87-metre-high clock and bell tower dominated that city's skyline for almost a century.
en.wikipedia.org...



The people of the U.S., like the people of western Europe excel at technological innovation because we are free to explore new concepts, new life styles, new arts, new ways of thinking. What really shows your lack of understanding is that you can not see a connection between science and art, between innovation and imagination. It is no accident that the countries which dominate in technology also tend to dominate in the arts as well.

more opinions from you ...
nah, thats no longer the case now and yes science is not equal to arts as it is based on statisical evidence and laws of physics




[edit on 5-11-2008 by sadchild01]


reply posted on 5-11-2008 @ 05:14 PM by poet1b
reply to post by sadchild01


I listed some of the biggest breakthroughs in the history of technology developed by non degreed inventors. You have yet to list any, only people given credit at various points along the process, which could mean anything.

You talk about this Zasyadko as producing the first accurate rockets, but you post on Korolyov, not Zasyadko, from wikpedia, which is not a credible source.

The Germans in WWII were the ones who made the big breakthroughs in rocket technology, and they followed the research of an American from the twenties in Arizona. Russia got their technology from German scientist captured after WWII. This is well known.

How was this tiny skyscraper in the United Kingdom built. Was the design copied as the major structural design used for modern skyscrapers? Do some more research and you will find out that no, the breakthroughs were developed in the U.S. based on how carpenters started framing homes.

books.google.com... 8&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=6&ct=result#PPA446,M1

books.google.com... TT244bk1AK2j2EspFE&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=1&ct=result#PRA1-PA324,M1

www.americanheritage.com...

The historical tradition has it that the balloon frame originated with a sudden, dramatic invention, but the historical tradition appears to be wrong. Most innovative construction methods grow out of the cumulative effort of many builders, and there are times when innovations combine to the point where a completely new way of building overturns the old way of doing things. That seems to have been the case with the balloon frame. However, the traditional story of its invention still has many advocates, and it deserves to be told, if only because it is an important founding myth of the city of Chicago.



reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 12:40 PM by jakyll
reply to post by magicmushroom


I still can't star you so you get thumbs up instead for....well,lets just say all of your posts.


reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 01:03 PM by jakyll
reply to post by poet1b



Once again, I will repeat the undeniable fact, China is not the worlds technology leader. While they MAY become the worlds technology leader, that is a very big MAY, and they certainly haven't done it yet.


The 2007 statistics show China with a technological standing of 82.8, compared to 76.1 for the United States, 66.8 for Germany and 66.0 for Japan. Just 11 years ago, China’s score was only 22.5. The United States peaked in 1999 with a score of 95.4.

www.gatech.edu...



The Germans in WWII were the ones who made the big breakthroughs in rocket technology, and they followed the research of an American from the twenties in Arizona. Russia got their technology from German scientist captured after WWII. This is well known.


Actually the first modern rocket pre-WW2 was launched in Auburn,Massachusetts by Robert Goddard.

During the 20's independent research took place with the United States,Austria,Britain,Czechoslovakia,France,Italy,Germany,and Russia had a rocket research program.The most advanced and extensive work was done in Russia.During WW2 the Germans were the pioneers.And the US and UK also stole technology,and people,from the Germans in a race of power and technology.And America's research in rockets,jets and space travel would have been nothing without the genius of just one man,Wernher von Braun.A German rocket physicist and astronautics engineer captured by the US forces.






[edit on 6-11-2008 by jakyll]


reply posted on 7-11-2008 @ 04:16 AM by poet1b
reply to post by magicmushroom


Exactly what race are Americans? Your claims that certain other countries are superior to American is more racist than mine.

Why don't you admit you hate and resent America, and only come here to bad mouth the U.S..


reply posted on 7-11-2008 @ 04:36 AM by poet1b
reply to post by jakyll


And another post earning a hearty laugh.



You link clearly states

A new study of worldwide technological competitiveness suggests China may soon rival the United States as the principal driver of the world’s economy – a position the U.S. has held since the end of World War II.


Do you understand what the word "SOON" means? That number only means that China has improved greatly as a technology innovator. Considering how far behind China was, those are easy numbers to obtainl. Like I pointed out earlier, Japan was predicted to take over as the worlds technology leader a while back, and that didn't happen either. Japan has now fallen behind the U.S. in potential, before ever catching up with the U.S.. What evidence is there to prove China won't turn out the same way, especially since Japan has out done China in technology throughout the ages.

The Soviets took plenty of German scientists to develop their program, Helmut Gröttrup, a physicist by training and a top expert on the V-2’s flight control system one of the main players.

Before WW II, the U.S. was not a nation that put a great deal of effort into military technology, so they hadn't put much effort into developing rocket technologyl. Only after WW II when the cold war began and the space race, did the U.S. start putting considerable effort into military technology, an area in which we quickly excelled.

To think that the U.S. would have gone nowhere without Von Braun is nonsense. Typical thinking of the average elitist.
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