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Albert Pike on the True Nature of Masonry

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posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 10:04 AM
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Albert Pike on Masonry: The True Nature of the Society
Many masonic apologists at various websites have offered "defenses" in response to anti-masons, attempting to dismiss the popular quotations drawn from Masonic master-philosopher Albert Pike, which show freemasonry to be syncretistic and anti-Christian. So here are the actual quotes from Pike's "Morals and Dogma." Thanks to the IndependentConservative for this collection.

[gratuitous link removed]
www.abovetopsecret.com...
4) Advertising: You will not advertise or promote other discussion boards, chat systems, online communities or other websites on ATS within posts...


[edit on 10-10-2008 by 12m8keall2c]




posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 10:57 AM
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Thanks for playing, really, but I believe Albert Pike has been discussed ad nauseaum on these boards.

I think both the masons and anti-masons are over Pike.

PS if you would like to make specific claims are allegations I am sure we can address them.

[edit on 10/10/08 by emsed1]



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 11:06 AM
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reply to post by emsed1
 



That's a funny comment. Did you intend for it to be funny ?

Masons 'are over' Pike ?

But Pike exposed Freemasonry

Shouldn't your comment be: ' Pike is over Masons' ?

Actually, we could expand that to say, ' The ATS community is over Masons also '



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 11:07 AM
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You're fighting a losing battle my friend. The people who are aware of the evils of secret societies such as the Slave Masons need no convincing.
The people who are members of the Slave Masons will NEVER be convinced. Trust me I have tried untill I was blue in the face. People WILL NOT hear what they don't want to hear. If it challenges an already existing world view then you waisting your time.

You will have just as much luck convincing these morons who believe the official story of 911 that it was an inside job.

People will hear what they need to hear and will not hear what challenges their already deeply held firmly rooted superstitions.



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 11:09 AM
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Originally posted by Dock6
' The ATS community is over Masons also '


Good to hear. Maybe we'll see a decline in this kind of tripe, if that's the case.

You people and your boxes...



Originally posted by cbass
People will hear what they need to hear and will not hear what challenges their already deeply held firmly rooted superstitions.


Ironically, that is the reason I believe so many refuse to listen when we repeatedly explain how the theories don't jive.

Sums it up nicely.


[edit on 10/10/08 by The Axeman]



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 03:09 PM
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I often ponder why the Christian anti-masons spend so much time with Pike. Its a rather dumb move - your taking 1 person, whose writings have no authority over freemasonry, and beating people with out of context quotes over and over again. You then, of course, IGNORE all of those Christian masons who have ALSO written books and whose words ALSO have no authority over freemasonry, who more often than not completely disagree with Pike.

It would be sort of like me going through everything written about Christianity and picking out those authors who have held high positions in different denominations that have said Christianity is Mirthra worship renamed. I could do it, I could provide lovely quotes claiming all Christians were worshiping what they could call a pagan God, but it wouldn't really be accurate or representative of Christianity. Yet this is the exact kind of tactic being used here.

It seems like the only goal is deception by the anti-masons. Too bad for them, they keep failing fantastically with it.

[edit on 10-10-2008 by LowLevelMason]



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 03:42 PM
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Not to open another end of the can of worms of 'Mason' v 'Anti-Mason', but I thought I'd mention a non-Pike quote I found, during my debate with my esteemed friend emsed1:


The Two-Fold Nature of Masonry
...the originators of Freemasonry designed our Fraternity to perform a double function: (1) To supply and apply the idealistic and ethical mortar for securely binding the unfolding social organizations of Man on the West side of the foreseen Renaissance; (2) To serve as the concealed connector to the illuminated Spiritual Initiates and their Arcane Societies.
Link


Enigmatic, huh? Wonderful fun can be had speculating on the nature, agenda, and relationship to those 'illuminated Initiates' and their 'Arcane Societies'.



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 05:59 PM
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Originally posted by Ian McLean
Not to open another end of the can of worms of 'Mason' v 'Anti-Mason', but I thought I'd mention a non-Pike quote I found, during my debate with my esteemed friend emsed1:


The Two-Fold Nature of Masonry
...the originators of Freemasonry designed our Fraternity to perform a double function: (1) To supply and apply the idealistic and ethical mortar for securely binding the unfolding social organizations of Man on the West side of the foreseen Renaissance; (2) To serve as the concealed connector to the illuminated Spiritual Initiates and their Arcane Societies.
Link


Enigmatic, huh? Wonderful fun can be had speculating on the nature, agenda, and relationship to those 'illuminated Initiates' and their 'Arcane Societies'.


The problem is, yet again, that all we're doing is having a quote off. Since no one speaks for freemasonry and no quote represents masonry. While I cannot find my notes at the moment, at some point years ago I compiled about 50+ quotes from Christian Freemasons actually proclaiming Freemasonry was really a Christian organization and held no secrecy.

So, here we go again:



Freemasonry has no individual or universal "authorities" when it comes to the interpretation of its rituals and symbols.

- Arturo de Hoyos, 33° and Dr. S. Brent Morris, 33° Grand Cross
from Chapter 3 of "Is it true what they say about Freemasonry?"

Now, in truth, the degrees of these gentlemen do not matter. No degree is higher than the 3rd and every mason can say whatever he wants about freemasonry and none of it has any authority. However, since people INSIST that it does:

Dr. Morris even has the Grand Cross designation, which - if we believe the anti-mason propaganda - puts him above Albert Pike (since they think that honors = higher power). So I have 2 33rd degrees, one with a higher "rank" than Pike, saying your quote does not apply to freemasonry. Meanwhile, the source for your quote from what I can find is "only" a 3rd degree Master Mason.

According to the Anti-Mason degree games, I win!


[edit on 10-10-2008 by LowLevelMason]



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 06:15 PM
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Ah well done Sir! You forgot to divide by word-length, however! Do long and short quotes get ranked proportionally? I am hesitant to dive into the actual formal rules, as if I remember, they are 1000's of pages long.


But, back to the point of the quote, it wasn't rituals and symbols I found most interesting -- although they are. It was the strong impression given that 'inner' masonry (or at least some organizations thereof) acts as a 'conduit' to other arcane organizations, beyond masonry. Now, while I am sure that there are many 'high-level' (or well-studied, if you will) masons with various other connections to other private organizations, etc., the implication that this is a structural and deliberate purpose of the inner/outer divisions of masonry is quite interesting.

Of course, it doesn't seem to be something that's disprovable.



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 07:03 PM
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You get extra points if you use "Satan", "Lucifer", or "Bapomet"! And a gold star if you can find quotes with "ritual abuse" in them.


The problem with this whole "inner group" thing, as you point out, is that no one can provide evidence for it and its not falsifiable because of the way the myth has been constructed. However, this does not mean that the theory has a ring of truth, it just means conspiracy theorists have constructed a theory such that they can't be proven wrong.

We could do the same thing. We could accuse the anti-mason conspiracy theorists of being in a elite, top-secret group that is not disclosed to normal conspiracy theorists. These theorists in this elite group are orchestrating anti-mason conspiracy theories from the top.

You see, I've done the same thing without any evidence what so ever. Now, all I have to do is find some snazzy out of context quotes about conspiracy theory and we've got our own Anti-CT movement going!



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 08:57 PM
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Originally posted by Dock6
reply to post by emsed1
 



That's a funny comment. Did you intend for it to be funny ?

Masons 'are over' Pike ?

But Pike exposed Freemasonry

Shouldn't your comment be: ' Pike is over Masons' ?

Actually, we could expand that to say, ' The ATS community is over Masons also '






Good catch!



posted on Oct, 10 2008 @ 09:42 PM
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I have to agree with LLM on pretty much every point. if you still believe that the 33rd degree is higher then the 3rd, talk to a York rite mason from england, 3rd is as high as it goes and they dont give a good G*d Dang about the 33rd degree of the scottish rite.

Whats more, as stated, it is rediculously easy to create the un-disprovable conspiracy when your talking about things that happened before our grandparents were born.

Can you prove that egyptian god Anubis didnt really have the head of a dog? can you prove that dog-head anubis didnt sniff butts and lick his scrotum all day? Dogs do it... the a dog head god must do it too.

The use of Lucifer in pikes quotes as evidence of satanism is equally obsured. The hebrew God's greatest foe doesnt have a hebrew name? and his only known name is a roman name? Rome wasnt built in a day and it wasnt built when that scripture was written.

And as stated, Pike was not the end all of masonic authority. the british dont practice the scottish rite much, more now then back then, but still not that much. so pikes work is met with a passing "Huh... interesting, moving on" by british masons.

And the use of masonry to conceal the connection between the illuminated initiate and the arcane society. this pracitce is as old as egypt. The egyptians, the greeks, the romans, all used secret teachings to protect more secret teachings. protecting them from fanatics who wont allow for any opinion but their own, from people with "Mercanary intent", and from people who simply cant handle the responsibility "Absolute power corrupts absolutely"

Now, i will never ever begin to try to convince anyone that masonry has never been befouled by the occasional dubious individual, and maybe he/they were able to sway others to his/their cause. But the teachings of the order are nothing sinister, it was developed and founded for the best of reasons and intentions.

The path of the rightious is beseeched by the tyranny of evil men. both those who have fought the order for their own ends, and those who have abused the order from within.

Whats more, i believe that the order is a pillar of stone, and it's strength is made of the souls of those who join it, if good and rightious men deny the order for fear of supposed evils, then only the evil will join it, and then it really will be everything that the anti-masons fear.

[edit on 10-10-2008 by Secret Master]



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 11:08 AM
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As fascinated as the Anti's are over Pike and the way they drool over "Morals & Dogma" it's going to be interesting to see what they have to say when the new version comes out. Yep. New version. Same text of course, it's timeless, but this will be "Annotated" and will show the sources of Pike's material, as he openly admits in the introduction that he has borrowed more than half the text from other sources...sources that he didn't bother to cite, as the book was never intended for anyone but Southern Jurisdiction Scottish Rite Masons.

I'm not sure when it's coming out, but I know it's in the works. It will be available from the Supreme Council, SJ to anyone who wants to purchase it.

It'll be a little hard to continue to say "Pike said this" or "Pike said that" when the source of his quotes are shown to the thinking members of society. I'm sure the others will continue to lie about him though; God rest his soul.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by senrak
God rest his soul.


Uhh....you meant to say Jahbulon rest his soul, right?



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 01:05 PM
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LMAO at Augustus, you shouldnt be sayin that word lol
The thing I like most about Pike quoters is most of them havent even read M&D. I am a Mason and I am only half way through it as it is a fairly DRY read. So posting quotes out of context, after not reading the entire Tome is hilarious.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 01:23 PM
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Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus
Uhh....you meant to say Jahbulon rest his soul, right?


True! What ever was I thinking?


And don't forget 'ol beelzebub.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 01:29 PM
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I've been enjoying Morals and Dogma for a good bit now, don't have as much time to read the book as I'd like but Mr. Pike seems like he was a interesting fellow.
When it comes to his views on Masonry, look at the title of the book, flat out states it's for the Scottish Right, more specifically the Southern Jurisdiction.
And, on his authority, one of the first parts of the book tells you how it's a collected work, Pike compiled the book from others and then worked in his own views.

Pike, in and of himself, was a intelligent person. he held several views that I agree with. Others, I tend to disagree.
It's a book on his points of view and his belief about masonry.
There are a few statements he makes that taken out of context can raise some hairs, but you read the entire book, you'll have a pretty good understanding of what he meant.
From there, you can use his philosophy, ignore it, or adapt it.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 01:56 PM
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Originally posted by RuneSpider
When it comes to his views on Masonry, look at the title of the book, flat out states it's for the Scottish Right, more specifically the Southern Jurisdiction. And, on his authority, one of the first parts of the book tells you how it's a collected work, Pike compiled the book from others and then worked in his own views.
There are a few statements he makes that taken out of context can raise some hairs, but you read the entire book, you'll have a pretty good understanding of what he meant. From there, you can use his philosophy, ignore it, or adapt it.


I agree with you RuneSpider. And I'll add that if you DO read the entire book, which the frothing-at-the-mouth Mason-haters and Pike-bashers do NOT, one of the first things you encounter is the Introduction by Pike himself, where he not only points out that he didn't write everything in the book, but additionally he says:

"Every one is entirely free to reject and
dissent from whatsoever herein may seem to him to be untrue or unsound."

In fact, these words appear in EVERY edition of M&D ever printed. I've noticed that this intro is conveniently left out of most of the on-line versions available from various sources. Anti-Masons doing legitimate research have no excuse for not knowing this (or rather for ignoring it, I should say) Those who think "Googling" is real research, well, there's no hope for them anyway.

Pike continues:

"It is only required of him that he shall weigh what is taught, and give
it fair hearing and unprejudiced judgment."

Somehow those frothing-at-the-mouth Mason-haters and Pike-bashers tend to have difficulty when it comes to "fair hearing" and "unprejudiced judgment." Too bad for them.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 02:04 PM
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I heard that President Ford was the top Mason in his time.

That's 33rd level right.

Anyone else know anything cause all the astronauts were masons
and Ford was on the JFK panel.

He missed 911.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 02:30 PM
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Originally posted by TeslaandLyne
I heard that President Ford was the top Mason in his time.
That's 33rd level right.


Not exactly.

Former President Ford (upon whom be peace) was a 33rd Degree Scottish Rite Mason, the title of which degree is "Inspector General-Honorary" He wasn't "top" anything at all, he was simply honored by the Scottish Rite for his contribution to society in general. (I doubt he had much time to be active in Lodge meetings). The highest degree in Masonry is "Master Mason" which falls third in line, not thirty-third. The numbered degrees of the Scottish Rite aren't higher per se than the Lodge degrees simply because they have higher numbers.



Anyone else know anything cause all the astronauts were masons
and Ford was on the JFK panel.


Some astronauts (Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin, for example) were Masons. Certainly not all of them. So, I'm not sure where you're leading here.



He missed 911.


Ford was alive on 09/11. He died in 2006. What's that have to do with anything...or astronauts for that matter?




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