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Convicted paedophile found strangled and dumped in woods

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posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 06:50 AM
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Killing Hitler was entirely different, people were actively dieing because of him. Putting him in prison would have only made the death toll rise.

This man, whatever the majority of you want to think, may never have offended again.

Unless you want to say what he did is a mental condition, you cannot know how he would have lived the rest of his life. And if you do want to say it is a mental condition then you think someone should die because they did something they cannot help?

This situation has to be faced without any sort of emotion really, because emotionally I detest that man...emotionally I'm not at all bothered he is dead....But morally I know that is wrong, morally I know he should be sitting in prison somewhere. And I refuse to let emotion sway me on this issue.

[edit on 11-10-2008 by StevenDye]




posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 07:42 AM
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Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
Unfortunately, being locked up in prison is actually a better quality of life for some criminals. Partly because their living conditions sucked before, and partly because the prison systems are not as you'd think. They have certain luxuries and they have companionship. And for some it's actually mirror living conditions.


Well i know all this, the prison system should be reformed to be a horrible, dank, disgusting place. It should be a punishment, not an upgrade. However i seriously have thought about it and i'd rather die than go to prison. That's speaking as someone who's faced his death not a flippant remark.


Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
Interesting you mentioned that though, I mean if some people think being locked up in prison for life is actually worse then death. Then wouldn't that make putting them in prison much more extreme then a street justice guy killing him?


Yes it would be worse to be locked up and that's exactly why i want it. Furthermore it's more civilised than simply killing, even if it is a worse punishment.


Originally posted by StevenDye
Killing Hitler was entirely different, people were actively dieing because of him. Putting him in prison would have only made the death toll rise.


No the person i was responding to said "there is never a reason to kill" and i was just showing how sometimes there is and his/her view was rediculous.


Originally posted by StevenDye
This man, whatever the majority of you want to think, may never have offended again.


Predatory paedophiles that are released have been found to reoffend if they can get access to children. It's a statistical fact.


Originally posted by StevenDye
Unless you want to say what he did is a mental condition, you cannot know how he would have lived the rest of his life. And if you do want to say it is a mental condition then you think someone should die because they did something they cannot help?


Would you call being straight or gay a mental condition? Whilst paedophilia is listed as a mental condition in some countries i think it's incorrect. Furthermore your idea of not being able ot help it is flawed as it is a choice to actually commit the act. Some people are celebate despite their sex drive. These people could resist and many do. It's very clear that there are many people out there that are attracted to children but never offend. They control their drives, you and i might even be friends with such people and have no idea about their thoughts.

As long as they're just thoughts then they should be left alone, when they act on those thoughts they should be imprisoned for life. It is a sexuality, not a mental condition but it's an illegal and harmful sexuality. If they offend, they'll offend again, statistical fact.

So again, i can know how he'd have lived the rest of his life. He'd have been more cunning and careful in his crimes and abused more children. I can say that because it's the pattern of a predatory paedophile.


Originally posted by StevenDye
This situation has to be faced without any sort of emotion really, because emotionally I detest that man...emotionally I'm not at all bothered he is dead....But morally I know that is wrong, morally I know he should be sitting in prison somewhere. And I refuse to let emotion sway me on this issue.


I'm facing it quite without emotion. He should be sitting in prison, he should never have been released from prison, he should have been left to die in prison. That is the fate that every paedophile who acts upon their thoughts should face.

The person who killed this man should be arrested and tried just like any other murderer.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 07:48 AM
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Sick old man but uh murder for molestation?
The punishment didnt fit the crime there, lil overkill.
Hopefully they find who murdered him and put him away for life.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 08:02 AM
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Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984The person who killed this man should be arrested and tried just like any other murderer.


Maybe the REAL problem with society is that people have no limits which state "cross this line and I will feel a pesonal responsibility to even the score". Complaicancy is the ideal mindset for the sheep. To those that say "only the legal system should handle it" I have to ask is there anything in life you truly love and would protect with your life? Do you have ANY boundaries that would require YOU to act? Or do you really believe that if someone rapes your kid, or tortures a family member, that is ultimately "none of your business" and the right thing to do is to let the the "government" handle it or not as they see fit?

I see that mindset as really messed up. Life is personal. Crimes of this nature are personal. If this was an act of revenge I applaud the person for having a backbone and taking action in a direct, personal sense.

I honestly admire the person that did this in many respects. If he/she is fairly sane then it was NOT that easy for them to carry out. Acts of this nature usually require forethought and a strong stomach. They felt a true obligation to even a score and they did it. They are an inspiration.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 08:30 AM
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This sick twisted man deserved what he got, actually he probaly deserved worse. He had a record of multiple offences against INNOCENT CHILDREN. No form of rehabilitation could help him, death was appropriate!! When our so called law makers can let a man like this out into society, what other option is their but for society to show our law makers that acts of this nature are not acceptable and morally wrong if not entirely evil. I bet his victims are happy knowing he is dead rather than being cared for in a prison cell.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 08:36 AM
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Why are none of you advocating street justice for the judge who let the pedo off easy? Should he not be killed as well, since he put children at risk?

What about the fashion designers and media influences that portray the image of a hairless, youthful prepubescent girl as the ideal "woman"?

I would argue that both of those factors are infinitely more harmful to children, yet since they are just abstract concepts - they cannot be shot in an alley or beaten to death in the woods - hence, you all flock to the one dead pedophile, as though killing individual people off one by one is some kind of solution. It's disgraceful that any of you think this type of justice is acceptable.

Where do you really draw the line? Killing drug dealers too? How about people that buy alcohol for underage minors? How about those that rape the elderly? How about those that rape anyone? What about hit-and-runs? What about accidental deaths due to gross negligence?

Who gets to decide? Normally - it would be a judge, in a court of law, preferably among a jury of peers. The day we leave justice up to the mobs, is the day we regress back into the dark ages and times of the witchhunt.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 09:06 AM
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I see only one problem with this.
After they killed the pedophile they didn't inform the judge that if he continued to dump peds onto the streets that families and children live on, that he would be the next one found in the woods.
This is OUR country, and when our system refuses to protect us, it is our right and duty to do it for ourselves.
Plain and simple.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 09:16 AM
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Originally posted by Prima Facie
This sick twisted man deserved what he got, actually he probaly deserved worse. He had a record of multiple offences against INNOCENT CHILDREN. No form of rehabilitation could help him, death was appropriate!!


So there we are, another prime example of judge, jury, psychologist and executioner, all in one. Imagine a mob of 100 of these people. When you get 100 angry igonrant people together in a mob - you could literally point at a random person on the street, declare "pedophile!" and then watch the crowd tear them apart without so much as a single second for inquiry or reflection.

This is the same mentality that has rednecks shouting "kill him!" about Obama at the extremist right-wing rallies. Come to think of it, vigilantism is a very right-wing and fascist concept.


Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
What promise do we have that the lawyers, the Judge, the police, the juror, and the people watching from home, are not guilty of the same exact psychological needs you are accusing these street justice guys of? Just because it went through the justice system? Just because it went through the official channels?


I absolutely agree with you. In fact, I DO believe there are plenty of judges, lawyers, cops, etc. that do just that - exert their murderous nature via their professions, and it's no better than the vigilante... however, these judges, lawyers and police are not anonymous like vigilantism tends to be (and in this case was) therefore, each of them are accountable for their actions.

What I am against, is the romanticizing of murder - especially with the mob mentality that has been displayed in this thread.

[edit on 11-10-2008 by scientist]



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 09:51 AM
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Originally posted by greeneyedleo
Yes. I am serious. When one harms a child (abuses, molests, child porn), murders an innocent person or rapes....they have forfeited their "right" to live their life on this earth amongst the rest of us.

My opinion
Wish it were in fact true. Our justice systems sucks...thus the reason I study it an want to be part of it....for maybe someday I can make a difference.

[edit on 10/10/2008 by greeneyedleo]


Well what kind of difference is that then killing people for their crimes
that they commit

and peadaphiles are sick and violent individuals and shouldnt be allowed into the streets but it doesnt mean we decide to take their lives and to murder them

surely some people here can understand that killing someone is wrong ans so if the peadaphiles actions aswell their both wrong on a huge scale.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 10:41 AM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
Maybe the REAL problem with society is that people have no limits which state "cross this line and I will feel a pesonal responsibility to even the score". Complaicancy is the ideal mindset for the sheep. To those that say "only the legal system should handle it" I have to ask is there anything in life you truly love and would protect with your life? Do you have ANY boundaries that would require YOU to act? Or do you really believe that if someone rapes your kid, or tortures a family member, that is ultimately "none of your business" and the right thing to do is to let the the "government" handle it or not as they see fit?


You missed the point i was making. To quote arostotle "The law is reason free from passion". What you are demonstrating is an emotional response.

Lets be clear. I don't have kids, but if i did and this guy had abused them, then yes i would no doubt have reacted and killed this man. That would be because my mind was clouded with rage and is not how the law works. If i did kill him then i should be put in prison and it's that simple. If you start saying such acts are ok then anarchy will rule, the line will get less and less clear and eventually people will be killed over shop lifting.

We have to use our laws as they're written. What we should start doing is giving tougher sentences to these child molesters, preferably life sentences meaning life. That way we know they can never offend again, we know that people will like the sentence and we know that vigilante actions can't be taken (unless some inmate gets to them).

The law is one of the things that seperates us from the beasts.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 10:45 AM
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reply to post by StevenDye
 


dye

I have been watching you and dock6 banting back and forth on the view of the value of life. But unfortunately I see you think that you stand on some great moral high ground about solving this issue and you have not come up with one resolution that will satisfy the crime. Dock6 has been very articulate and controlled in his responses with you has provided well informed data. You re solution does not satisfy justice, You some how think the money that all taxes payers which are earned by their blood and sweat offor their nation are responsible to maintain these pediphiles for their entire life. I cannot articulate as well as Dock6 has so I will leave it too her/him to continue if he/she so chooses.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 10:45 AM
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reply to post by StevenDye
 


dye

I have been watching you and dock6 banting back and forth on the view of the value of life. But unfortunately I see you think that you stand on some great moral high ground about solving this issue and you have not come up with one resolution that will satisfy the crime. Dock6 has been very articulate and controlled in his responses with you has provided well informed data. You re solution does not satisfy justice, You some how think the money that all taxes payers which are earned by their blood and sweat offor their nation are responsible to maintain these pediphiles for their entire life. I cannot articulate as well as Dock6 has so I will leave it too her/him to continue if he/she so chooses.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 10:45 AM
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There does not seem to be an equitable solution to child molesters.
There is a state in USA that when the criminal sentence is complete the state declares the child molester mentally ill and locks them up in a mental institution for the rest of their life. So they have the criminal sentence to finish and then they stay locked up till they die.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 10:51 AM
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Originally posted by billyjoinedat2k8surely some people here can understand that killing someone is wrong ans so if the peadaphiles actions aswell their both wrong on a huge scale.


If this was revenge then the acts are NOT equal. The pedophile initiated the exchange; the killer responded.

Seriously....killing is sanctioned by most all forms of modern human society within limits. Killing during military conflict is fine! Killing murderers in most countries is perfectly okay! Killing animals is normal most everywhere! Criminals killing innocent and living to laugh about it is fine too!

We are animals. In the animal kingdom "might is right".

[edit on 11-10-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 10:53 AM
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Originally posted by ashamedamerican
This is OUR country, and when our system refuses to protect us, it is our right and duty to do it for ourselves.
Plain and simple.


Am I missing something here? I thought this happened in Great Witchingham? You identify yourself as an American, but Britain is yours?



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 10:56 AM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 11:04 AM
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Originally posted by spacemanjupiter
You sure have some idiotic sense of justice. Maybe you shouldn't be living the 21st century.


Well I do hope that *snip* up attitude takes hold. Perhaps when criminals decide to rape someone's kid, or break into someone's house, or beat down some elderly lady for the $10 in her pocketbook they have cause to think "gosh does the meat I plan to mutilate have any relations that might come after me?"

It is quite apparent the government does not truly care! And based on this thread half the populace does not really care either!

Seriously many of our countries are going to hell in a handbasket, and it is because NO ONE CARES! Or perhaps most are willing to take the pc safe route? It is shameful!


[edit on 11-10-2008 by Sonya610]

MOD Note: Do Not Evade The Automatic Censors

[edit on 10/11/2008 by semperfortis]



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 11:05 AM
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reply to post by scientist
 


The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

This may be a first...I'm agreeing with you. I believe in the death penalty for convicted molestors, but this was not the way to go.

Former victim seeking vengence? A random act? An outraged parent seeking retribution? Who knows...and that's the point.




As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 11:10 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.





Originally posted by CuriousFinger
Good for him!!! I hope we see more of this.


This is to all of you who agree with this sentiment.

More of this? Street justise? What has this done, save further undermine a justise system that is none to stable to begin with...

What's next? Street justise, or murder rather, for other crimes? Speeding? Jaywalking? Panhandling? Or users choice crime of the day? Think about what you're advocating here, vigilante law. Soft sentence from a judge? So change the laws, change the judge, don't go this route...it does more harm ultimately than a thousand sexoffenders...

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.


[edit on 10/11/2008 by seagull]



posted on Oct, 11 2008 @ 11:11 AM
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Originally posted by seagullFormer victim seeking vengence? A random act? An outraged parent seeking retribution? Who knows...and that's the point.


A random act? Perhaps it was a deranged serial killer that happens to target 75 year old men. Or perhaps it was a mugger that has a habit of dragging their victims into the woods and partially conceiling the body?

It doesn't sound all that random.

Actually the dead guy being covered by an old door was a bit strange, though I understand open space is rare in the U.K. and maybe shallow graves don't mean much in highly populated areas. But it does sound rather symbolic (closing the door so to speak).


[edit on 11-10-2008 by Sonya610]




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