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Originally posted by NASTY LAWLESS
TO ANYONE WHO MAY BE OFFENDED FOR WHAT I SAY IN REPLY PLEASE FORGIVE ME BUT THIS IS A LOAD OF CRAP AND PEOPLE SPEWING THIS KIND OF DIATRIBE ABOUT OVERTHROWING ANY GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE UNDER CLOSE SCRUTINY FROM THE FEDS AND BE BROUGHT UP ON NUMEROUS CHARGES FOR BEING A TRAITOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Originally posted by NASTY LAWLESS
TO ANYONE WHO MAY BE OFFENDED FOR WHAT I SAY IN REPLY PLEASE FORGIVE ME BUT THIS IS A LOAD OF CRAP AND PEOPLE SPEWING THIS KIND OF DIATRIBE ABOUT OVERTHROWING ANY GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE UNDER CLOSE SCRUTINY FROM THE FEDS AND BE BROUGHT UP ON NUMEROUS CHARGES FOR BEING A TRAITOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Originally posted by Res Ipsa
I have read countless threads since joining ATS...but this is the first one that has so many thinking errors that I couldn't address them all if I had a week to do it.
1) ideals are great but if you can't get enough people to think alike you are stuck.
Agreed. However, how do you achieve consensus? The problem first faced, in my opinion, is getting past the 'noise.' But what can I say? Inertia and comfort are tough obstacles too.
2) The more people you gather in a room the quicker the IQ goes down.
Group-think and crowd dynamics are definitely not our friends. Individualism seems to be generally frowned upon in large groups. Since that dynamic is based on fear of the unknown, only a paradigm shift can effect change. It's counter intuitive to expect IQ's to "rise" in a crowd. Is it impossible to convey the ideal to the baseline IQ of a crowd? Perhaps. It makes me sad.
3) American's, in fact any Country's citizens are as a collective, not very bright. (why do think negative campaigns work) they wouldn't work on a "bright" person.
Maybe because of conditioning. After all, we are bombarded by information from sources evolution never prepared us for. I think this has a lot to do with the 'dumbing down' we hear so much about. Perhaps this can be countered somehow.
4) NO issue can be explained and understood in 30 seconds.
Nor should it have to be.
5) This government is the best structured of any on Earth, but it takes humans to run it, and humans are flawed. You could replace the entire government and you would end up the same. Quick...what is your favorite tv show? Why isn't it mine? Why isn't it everyone elses? Do you expect the government and those that run it to value "your" views more than someone elses?
The 'system' of the constitution accounts for this in very human terms. The flaw is not that we are not capable, we simply allowed ourselves to be led. Governments of the people do not lead - they follow. Whom or what the public servants 'value' highly or otherwise, is irrelevant. Their task is to serve. The only judgment that counts is ours. Thus it should always be.
6) why are democrats bad? Republican's bad? Independents? name them all if you like. Hey, I don't want Billy Bob to have an AK-47. I don't want my taxes to go for that or this.
That dog wont hunt. The devolution of political show business is a scam and a national embarrassment. Virtually everything they say is nothing more than snake-oil for desperate people.
7) Until I see 80% of America voting in a presidential election I don't want to hear ignorant rants about change. You want change then run for office, or vote. I can't stand when I am forced to listen to someone spout their ignorance and indignation of our government and they finish with..."thats why I don't vote". I want to just drill them in the face.
Vote or shut up.
I agree that voting is a civic responsibility regardless of one's faith or lack thereof in the 'validity' of the process. It is the fundamental expression of the very premise of our nation. However, how are you forced to listen to this drivel? I'm not sure about you, but around here my experience has been that most understand this.
8) read the Constitution. Are you smarter than the Supreme Court Justices through the years? Do you ever wonder why you don't find 9-0 decisions hardly ever? I certainly have read some posts in this thread that clearly have no understanding of the Constitution but must have pulled off some whack blog or something. I have heard Hannity, Limbaugh and of course O'Reilly twist the meaning too, as if they were Scalia.
I do read it. You may not have meant this comment directly at me but in turn I would have said; Are you stating that the Supreme Court represents the pinnacle of human intelligence. Is there really some reason we should not 'presume' to second guess them? I don't care for ignorant misuse of the documents and partisan applications to ideologies either. But we cannot begin to exclude the freedom of the citizens to review and even differ from the opinions of these appointed justices.
I grant you there is much here in the way of vain idealism. But ideas have to start somewhere. By the way, given the context of the quadrennial political theater we go through, I don;t think violent overthrow was the thrust of this thread. Or if it was, for the record, it wouldn't work anyway.
All due respect. Reacting to lists can sometimes be a compulsion!
EDIT TO APOLOGIZE FOR BAD FORMATTING _ there was no external source
[edit on 15-10-2008 by Maxmars]