TO ANYONE WHO MAY BE OFFENDED FOR WHAT I SAY IN REPLY PLEASE FORGIVE ME BUT THIS IS A LOAD OF CRAP AND PEOPLE SPEWING THIS KIND OF DIATRIBE ABOUT OVERTHROWING ANY GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE UNDER CLOSE SCRUTINY FROM THE FEDS AND BE BROUGHT UP ON NUMEROUS CHARGES FOR BEING A TRAITOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nasty Lawless...
7.16ths of an inch. That vast schism between ignorance and intellegence. Please travel your pinkie across it and press the "caps lock" button.

I think that it really doesn't matter who we elect. Voter fraud is becoming such a blatant thing these days. Sure, the small fry lack the organization and muscle to fight determined townspeople, but on the state and federal level I'm not so sure my vote counts. Especially since the electoral college failures in the elections of Bush and Kerry.

[edit on 15-10-2008 by Hiatus]

Originally posted by NASTY LAWLESS
TO ANYONE WHO MAY BE OFFENDED FOR WHAT I SAY IN REPLY PLEASE FORGIVE ME BUT THIS IS A LOAD OF CRAP AND PEOPLE SPEWING THIS KIND OF DIATRIBE ABOUT OVERTHROWING ANY GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE UNDER CLOSE SCRUTINY FROM THE FEDS AND BE BROUGHT UP ON NUMEROUS CHARGES FOR BEING A TRAITOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Did you pass this to the congress too

Originally posted by NASTY LAWLESS
TO ANYONE WHO MAY BE OFFENDED FOR WHAT I SAY IN REPLY PLEASE FORGIVE ME BUT THIS IS A LOAD OF CRAP AND PEOPLE SPEWING THIS KIND OF DIATRIBE ABOUT OVERTHROWING ANY GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE UNDER CLOSE SCRUTINY FROM THE FEDS AND BE BROUGHT UP ON NUMEROUS CHARGES FOR BEING A TRAITOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh really in that case "I say the united states government should be over thrown for engaging in excessive profitering during wartime and economic plunder both of which are the death penelty". I would like to remind congress that if any of that money that you just alocated out of the 800 billion you just levied gets laundered or used in anyway for anything outside the united states anyone of you can be arrested without a warrent.

And I would like to add something else on top of that "All" Federal Government employee's take a oath to uphold the U.S. Constitution that means they take a oath to protect the "united states from "all" enemies forgine and domestic".

"One mans freedom fighter is another man's terrorist", Im not the one that ran out over 500 u.s. goverment employee's over the last 7 years because I didnt like there opinion about the illegal war thats been fought for the last 7 years.

Many of the people I know that have been run out were operative's that were loyal to the constitution. I happen to know for a fact im on many government watch lists and they can watch me all they want to in fact they can even arrest me if they want I can win any case in court no matter where it is.

Oh yea and one last thing Viva la france


Falcon

The American Government Must Be Overthrown!!!

I disagree.

I think the American Government (which is to say the United States of America) must be restored!!!

Our constitutional democratic republic was created and brought into existence despite the 'influences' you see today - it was they who 'overthrew' the government of the people!"

The government was an experiment and was gifted with a living document - the Constitution - which rendered the operation and power to the population of this nation - as opposed to it's public servants. It took those irritated by American freedom multiple tries and several generations to get to the point where they could corrupt and disable our checks and balances to their benefit.

The outrages they have wrought upon us and our children (AND THEIR CHILDREN TOO) must not go unaddressed by future historians and the 'enlightened' elites in academia. The nation was and is STILL capable of being what it was intended to be. Open struggle will simply destroy her. We must demand an accounting of the 'culture' which festers in the halls of leadership. We would do better to carryout a general strike and a universal withholding of financial support for all federal agencies that insist on maintaining this paradigm of fear and illusion.

They have already claimed the title of "traitors" and they continue to engage us in distraction and lies to this day.

Scarcer I couldn't agree more. The only solution to this is the education of the people. Violence and rebellion will solve nothing. Just perpetuate the same behavior.
What the system can not ignore is a boycott.
A boycott of the banks.
A boycott of VOTING (the illusion of democracy is an insult to our intellegence)
A boycott of all the institutions that rule our country and shape our lives. We as a people have to transcend the ways of old. Violence, rebellion, yelling in loud speakers; these things do not serve us! We have to BE THE CHANGE WE WANT IN THE WORLD. Lead by example. This is the way to a true revolution. And educate yourselves. Seek out the truth.

Truth is not what some one tells you is truth. Truth is realized

I have read countless threads since joining ATS...but this is the first one that has so many thinking errors that I couldn't address them all if I had a week to do it.

1) ideals are great but if you can't get enough people to think alike you are stuck.
2) The more people you gather in a room the quicker the IQ goes down.
3) American's, in fact any Country's citizens are as a collective, not very bright. (why do think negative campaigns work) they wouldn't work on a "bright" person.
4) NO issue can be explained and understood in 30 seconds.
5) This government is the best structured of any on Earth, but it takes humans to run it, and humans are flawed. You could replace the entire government and you would end up the same. Quick...what is your favorite tv show? Why isn't it mine? Why isn't it everyone elses? Do you expect the government and those that run it to value "your" views more than someone elses?
6) why are democrats bad? Republican's bad? Independents? name them all if you like. Hey, I don't want Billy Bob to have an AK-47. I don't want my taxes to go for that or this.
7) Until I see 80% of America voting in a presidential election I don't want to hear ignorant rants about change. You want change then run for office, or vote. I can't stand when I am forced to listen to someone spout their ignorance and indignation of our government and they finish with..."thats why I don't vote". I want to just drill them in the face.
Vote or shut up.
8) read the Constitution. Are you smarter than the Supreme Court Justices through the years? Do you ever wonder why you don't find 9-0 decisions hardly ever? I certainly have read some posts in this thread that clearly have no understanding of the Constitution but must have pulled off some whack blog or something. I have heard Hannity, Limbaugh and of course O'Reilly twist the meaning too, as if they were Scalia.

I just can't cover everything and I am typing so fast that I am sure I have to be rambling and not making much sense. But I will leave you with this

The title of this thread says...."the American Government must be Overthrown" now if I was a moderator I would offer 500 pts to the first person that could answer this two part question; What amendment do you think allows you to say that? easy....but the second part is...."does it protect you? hint: what would happen to you if you yelled "FIRE" in a crowded movie theatre? Would you be able to invoke your "....amendment rights?"

My advice: Don't spout off about "overthrowing" the government....because if this government was "corrupt" it would need no excuse what so ever to pick you up and give you a room with a view somewhere. But you meant to say "overthrow" by "voting" which we all understood you to mean.

Originally posted by Res Ipsa
I have read countless threads since joining ATS...but this is the first one that has so many thinking errors that I couldn't address them all if I had a week to do it.

1) ideals are great but if you can't get enough people to think alike you are stuck.

Agreed. However, how do you achieve consensus? The problem first faced, in my opinion, is getting past the 'noise.' But what can I say? Inertia and comfort are tough obstacles too.

2) The more people you gather in a room the quicker the IQ goes down.

Group-think and crowd dynamics are definitely not our friends. Individualism seems to be generally frowned upon in large groups. Since that dynamic is based on fear of the unknown, only a paradigm shift can effect change. It's counter intuitive to expect IQ's to "rise" in a crowd. Is it impossible to convey the ideal to the baseline IQ of a crowd? Perhaps. It makes me sad.

3) American's, in fact any Country's citizens are as a collective, not very bright. (why do think negative campaigns work) they wouldn't work on a "bright" person.

Maybe because of conditioning. After all, we are bombarded by information from sources evolution never prepared us for. I think this has a lot to do with the 'dumbing down' we hear so much about. Perhaps this can be countered somehow.

4) NO issue can be explained and understood in 30 seconds.

Nor should it have to be.

5) This government is the best structured of any on Earth, but it takes humans to run it, and humans are flawed. You could replace the entire government and you would end up the same. Quick...what is your favorite tv show? Why isn't it mine? Why isn't it everyone elses? Do you expect the government and those that run it to value "your" views more than someone elses?

The 'system' of the constitution accounts for this in very human terms. The flaw is not that we are not capable, we simply allowed ourselves to be led. Governments of the people do not lead - they follow. Whom or what the public servants 'value' highly or otherwise, is irrelevant. Their task is to serve. The only judgment that counts is ours. Thus it should always be.

6) why are democrats bad? Republican's bad? Independents? name them all if you like. Hey, I don't want Billy Bob to have an AK-47. I don't want my taxes to go for that or this.

That dog wont hunt. The devolution of political show business is a scam and a national embarrassment. Virtually everything they say is nothing more than snake-oil for desperate people.

7) Until I see 80% of America voting in a presidential election I don't want to hear ignorant rants about change. You want change then run for office, or vote. I can't stand when I am forced to listen to someone spout their ignorance and indignation of our government and they finish with..."thats why I don't vote". I want to just drill them in the face.
Vote or shut up.

I agree that voting is a civic responsibility regardless of one's faith or lack thereof in the 'validity' of the process. It is the fundamental expression of the very premise of our nation. However, how are you forced to listen to this drivel? I'm not sure about you, but around here my experience has been that most understand this.

8) read the Constitution. Are you smarter than the Supreme Court Justices through the years? Do you ever wonder why you don't find 9-0 decisions hardly ever? I certainly have read some posts in this thread that clearly have no understanding of the Constitution but must have pulled off some whack blog or something. I have heard Hannity, Limbaugh and of course O'Reilly twist the meaning too, as if they were Scalia.

I do read it. You may not have meant this comment directly at me but in turn I would have said; Are you stating that the Supreme Court represents the pinnacle of human intelligence. Is there really some reason we should not 'presume' to second guess them? I don't care for ignorant misuse of the documents and partisan applications to ideologies either. But we cannot begin to exclude the freedom of the citizens to review and even differ from the opinions of these appointed justices.

I grant you there is much here in the way of vain idealism. But ideas have to start somewhere. By the way, given the context of the quadrennial political theater we go through, I don;t think violent overthrow was the thrust of this thread. Or if it was, for the record, it wouldn't work anyway.

All due respect. Reacting to lists can sometimes be a compulsion!


EDIT TO APOLOGIZE FOR BAD FORMATTING _ there was no external source

[edit on 15-10-2008 by Maxmars]

I happen to agree with the arguement that people arent perfect so I will go with that analysis. However the level of people I have talked to and interviewed over the years tell's me a different story about the level of corruption and how bad things have gotten. The shocking thing is that this thread has gotten this many responce's in such a short period of time.

I could draw up a small list of names of people that have been ran out for political reasons or because they knew too much about what was going on in there office's I have done such things in the past.

On the one hand im inclined not to do anything about it because I know that sooner or later the level of corruption will collapse in and on top of itself how many people it takes down in the process im not sure.

On the other I have to do the thing that one of the real traitor's mr. bill clinton had to say think about the children. I dont have any children but my sister does 2 of them. My sister's children are going to have levied on there back's right now over 9 trillion dollar's.

That's assuming we dont blow are planet up or God does not whipe man kind from the face of the earth sometime between today and the day where both of my sister's children grow up to start paying tax's and have job's.

This is also assuming there will be a standing government by the time they grow up. The whole purpose of having any kind of goverment or body that govern's the people is for the purpose of providing for the future. I dont see much of a future in 9 trillion dollar's in debt nor do I see much of a future with these would be 2 presidental canidate's that have been thrust in my and the other people in the worlds face as if this is the best the United States has to offer.

On behalf of the real americans I would like to apoligise for the inherent stupidity of my fellow americans who get into a buzzsaw and dinamo mentality by ruting for this fake left, right, republican and democract joke thats been going on for over 100 years.

Things would not be in the situtation had we had more stand up people like mr ron paul or mr jesse ventura. There are solutions to these problems we face we can solve them ourselves or other people I believe will end up solving them for us. It is not out of the question that a outside military force could take over the U.S. at this point.

Thats my 2 cents for now

Falcon