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The Christian Lie!!!

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posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 02:00 AM
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Originally posted by cancerian42
Ok, if eating animals is moral, then eating humans is moral. We are omnivores after all and it would be one less mouth to feed. You say: No, that is wrong, it's murder. I say: Was it considered murder when it was a last resort for starving people? We didn't lock them up and put them in jail afterwards. So if it isn't evil then why don't we do it all the time?


if you are an atheist, eating a human is no different than eating an animal (since we are animals). however it is still wrong. its still considered murder (even if a court doesnt agree). even from a species point of view, eating ourselves is bad for the gene pool and the overall survival of the species.

if you are a christian, eating humans is wrong too, but the key difference is that humans are not ¨animals¨

from both points of view, your logic is flawed




posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 02:04 AM
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Originally posted by LeoVirgo
Before everyone jumps up and says Jesus ate a lamb and had wine with the last supper....IT WAS ALL SYMBOLIC.


how can you take something that is so blatantly literal and make it symbolic? passover WAS lamb and wine. they finished passover and then jesus instituted the new covenant and plainly told them to drink. its symbolic to you because you want it to be.

john the baptist also lived off of eating locusts (alive).



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 09:21 AM
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There are 6 Greek words used as 'meat'

bromata literally "food" (e.g., Mark 7:19)
trophe nourishment (e.g., Matthew 3:4; John 4:8; Acts 27:33, etc.)
phago a verb form meaning "to eat" (e.g., Matthew 25:35)
sitometron a grain measure (Luke 12:42)
prosphagion something eaten other than bread (John 21:5)
trapeza a short stool usually for serving food (Acts 16:34)

The Greek word for
meat is kreas (`flesh'), and it is never used in connection with
Christ.



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 09:56 AM
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reply to post by miriam0566
 



Mabey creepy crawly things arent a biggie. I guess we could say, well if he ate Locust, then he must of ate some of our four legged animals. Mabey.

The passover, in my personal opinion, is something in the works that is not the Prime Father of all things. Possibly this Yhwh is a 'son of El' as like in the Cannon stones or a part of the Elohim or even a 'master' of the vineyard who had become greedy with the 'owners' harvest and precious fruits(deceiving the harvest (US!) that God needs blood.

You may believe God, The Most Prime of all things killed all those babies and you may believe that just as the Bible says, there are justification for it because of the hardening of the Pharoahs heart and lessons to be learned to the Hebrews of the power of God yada yada....I have placed that concept of God behind me. The passover is not the original intention of The Father.


With saying that, I look for God in the Bible through graces, mercies, love and peace.

When we see the harvests, God wanted them to 'offer' their best fruit with no blemish to God. This was Gods way....an offering, out of ones will, we offer our fruits and ourselves to the Father. When you start to think of things the way I am thinking, many new curiosities show through in the Bible, to show, Gods had is woven there, beneath the deception. That is why in the NT it is repeated in the teachings of Jesus that the people kept questioning him on that they didnt understand. He keep s telling them, 'I tell you things but you do not hear, I show you things but you do not see'.

We see first the offering of the wheat, barley and the fruit. Ironically these are on the same days that celebrate the Holy Holidays such as Passover, Pentecost and Shavuot. I believe that the original meanings of these important times was OFFERINGS, the passover is not of God. This is what I believe to be 'masses are truly deceived. You might not see it this way, but this is what I live by.

Jesus offered himself. OFFERED. Many think by Jesus saying 'I come to end all sacrifices' that he means he is the last sacrifice. He came and taught PEACE and ate of the gifts of the mother earth and the gifts of the animals. Still, the masses did not except his 'strange ways' they even called him a blasphemer, the only way for Jesus to teach his way of peace, for even the future to understand his unexpected message, was to OFFER himself and allow his Father (our Father) to work through his flesh. Jesus offered his life to show us not to fear death and to not think we should come to God out of force or fear.

To me, the answer to all of this is in the meaning of Love givin in the Bible. The NT says love is NOT prideful, love is NOT jealous, love is HOPE, love is PATIENT, love NEVER fails. If God is loving, the God in the OT seems to of been bi polar then for there was pride, there was jealousy, there was no hope (killing humans is loss of hope) and there was no patients in the thought that possibly these corrupted evil nations of people might one day see the light before their own natural time of death.

These are personal views, you can think your way, its the beauty of the free will.

Peace,
LV



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 10:00 AM
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The night of the passover Jesus was the symbol of the Lamb. It was tradition to eat the lamb the night before the beginning of the 7 days of unleavened bread. Jesus showed us, he offered the bread to them, told them this is my body (why didnt he take the meat and say, this is my body?) He taught us why he wasnt afraid to offer us his bread and wine (body and spirit) because he knew he would soon be with his Father.



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 10:26 AM
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Just found this, which is interesting to say the least....the greek word used in the NT for the 'locusts' is 'akris'

The Greek name akris, properly denoting the insect, is applied in the Levant to the carob-pod.

en.wikipedia.org...

Carob powder and carob chips are used as an ingredient in cakes and cookies. Carob is sometimes used as a substitute for chocolate, however the flavour is significantly different. The seeds, also known as locust beans, are used as animal feed. They are also the source of locust bean gum, a thickening agent used in numerous processed foods. In Egypt, carobs are consumed as a snack. Crushed pods are used to make a refreshing drink. Compotes and liqueurs are made from carob in Portugal, Spain and Sicily. Carob has proven effective in relieving diarrhea in infants.

Peace,
LV



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 10:44 AM
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reply to post by jimmyjackblack
 



Dude I would have to agree with the christians on this one, your really making a tit of yourself here my friend.

And if we were not supposed to eat animals why would the jesusgod make them out of meat in the first place?



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by LeoVirgo
 


When you talk about four legged animals are you refering to those in the bible ? as the bible claims that insects have four legs, which we now know they do not. Unless of course you pluck a few off before munching them.



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 10:56 AM
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When I first posted response to the 'locusts that John ate, I said mabey, clearly not acting like I KNEW....then, I searched the word in google, and...

The greek word used in the NT for the 'locusts' is 'akris'

The Greek name akris, properly denoting the insect, is applied in the Levant to the carob-pod.

We shouldnt be too fast to assume we know....I dont assume I know...I let others know what I have come up with and what my spirit sees, that is all I do.



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 01:47 PM
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reply to post by jimmyjackblack
 


Looks like someone needs to read Leviticus.



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 01:56 PM
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Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by LeoVirgo
 


When you talk about four legged animals are you refering to those in the bible ? as the bible claims that insects have four legs, which we now know they do not. Unless of course you pluck a few off before munching them.


Let's not lie shall we? That verse is discussing GRASSHOPPERS.

Leviticus 11:21-22

" Yet these may ye eat of every flying creeping thing that goeth upon four, which have legs above their feet, to leap withal upon the earth; these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind."

Grasshopper:




Bald Locust:





posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 01:57 PM
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reply to post by LeoVirgo
 



Google this: "Bald Locust pic".



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 02:11 PM
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reply to post by miriam0566
 


I think you must have misunderstood my point. I wasn't making a case for why eating humans is okay, I was making a case for why eating animals is NOT okay. I was talking about the natural human morals of what is right and wrong, not based on the bible or science. I'll condense my point here about what I said earlier: if you can choose not to eat meat (whether it be animal or human) than you should choose not to do so. I believe that is perfectly logical. Sorry if you got the impression that I was a cannible.



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by LeoVirgo
You may believe God, The Most Prime of all things killed all those babies and you may believe that just as the Bible says, there are justification for it because of the hardening of the Pharoahs heart and lessons to be learned to the Hebrews of the power of God yada yada....I have placed that concept of God behind me. The passover is not the original intention of The Father.

With saying that, I look for God in the Bible through graces, mercies, love and peace.


so what your saying in so many words is god doesnt fit your definition of ¨moral¨ so you have decided to pick an choose what you want to see. that an interesting way of going about it.

the passover like most things jewish was symbolic of something else. it was a foreshadow of things to come.

first one must understand the ransom. adam was created to god´s standard. he DESERVED to live until he sinned. god´s own sense of justice set the standard of death of sinning long before adam partook of the fruit. in fact god told him plainly, if you eat of this fruit, you will positively die. adam knew of the consequences. still he misused his freewill and sinned. that sin did something to him, and now that imperfection is passed on to us.

is it really fair for someone to be condemned to death from day one without any say in the matter? god doesnt think so. the first prophecy uttered by god immediately adam sinned was pertaining to the ransom. he promised a seed.

if adam´s death sold us into sin, the death of a perfect man could release us of sin.

able understood this. thats why his sacrifice was acceptable whilst cain´s was not. he understood blood was involved.

the entire jewish law was a ¨tutor¨ to humankind, preparing them for the promised seed. animal sacrifice was symbolic of the need for the messiah (since animals are not equal to humans, the sacrifices never actually forgave sins).

even the passover was symbolic of that. the lamb seasoned with bitter herbs directly mirrored jesus´ death. jesus is even called a slaughtered lamb in revelation.

the very day of the exodus is a foreshadow of when god will bring his people out of satan´s world and into the ¨promise land¨.

yes, god is love. but god is also a god of justice. god had to send his son to die because god is bound by his own standard of justice. he cannot simply ignore a sin, his holiness doesnt allow it. this is why blood was needed, to balance the scales. not because of bloodlust.

the fact is, animals are not equal to humans. they were put into subjection under adam in eden. they were permitted to be eaten with noah. god even gave us the proper teeth to eat them with. even our digestive system requires certain things in meat. even the jewish law allowed for certain meats to be eaten.

peter even had a vision of the meats forbidden by jewish law being declared clean.

in conclusion. saying that meat is bad is not biblical

1 tim 4:
[1] Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
[2] Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
[3] Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
[4] For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
[5] For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 08:43 PM
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I think there is no room for logic in this specific topic, ethical logic has nothing to do with the point of this topic at all. It's about what the Bible and all of general spiritual laws in general says about eating animals, and or insects and what ever else you wish to add into the equation.

Any points made from supermarket purchased instant bags of logic sturred around in your domes acounts for absalutly nothing. Lets deny ignorance and stick to the supporting facts please.

I want to get Truth out of the conclusion in this topic.



posted on Oct, 8 2008 @ 09:17 PM
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well I think the post was well thought out , good info and sources but to me it sounds like a "VEGAN pushing VEGatarianism"???
I havew never heard of peolple saying that vegans are satanic, not once that suprises me

Well I am a christian and
I dont like the killing of animals for ummm how was it pput??? oh selfish reasons, Back in the old days most people killed to sustaIN life!!!
I do agree that most hunters nowadays have plenty of monet to eat it just makes them feel less guilt shame to say they do it for the meat.

OP you really brought up some good points, I have read the bible through and through and that just went right passed me. I guess its all what your looking for in the bible and food was not on my mind..Being saved and know GOD was it I guess ..
Thanks for the post I will definantly keep that in mind when I read now lol



posted on Oct, 9 2008 @ 01:14 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by LeoVirgo
 

























When you talk about four legged animals are you refering to those in the bible ? as the bible claims that insects have four legs, which we now know they do not. Unless of course you pluck a few off before munching them.


Let's not lie shall we? That verse is discussing GRASSHOPPERS.

Leviticus 11:21-22

" Yet these may ye eat of every flying creeping thing that goeth upon four, which have legs above their feet, to leap withal upon the earth; these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind."

Grasshopper:


Dude why you calling me a liar ?

Even these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind. But all other flying creeping things, which have four feet, shall be an abomination unto you. Leviticus 11:22-23

Did the author of your bible remove the have four feet bit?

Or did you do it? Naw you wouldn't do that would you ?

Shall we all read this again ? Ok here we go from the bible which is Inerrant,


Even these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind. But all other flying creeping things, which have four feet, shall be an abomination unto you. Leviticus 11:22-23

Yes indeed folks the bible clearly shows how insects have four feet



posted on Oct, 9 2008 @ 02:06 PM
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reply to post by moocowman
 


You're a moron, that verse doesn't say "All flying creepy things have four feet".

It says any other thing that flys or ceeps which has 4 feet other than beetles, locusts, bald locusts or grashoppers cannot be eaten.

It doesn't say all insects that fly have 4 feet. That's absurd.



posted on Oct, 9 2008 @ 04:24 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by moocowman
 


You're a moron, that verse doesn't say "All flying creepy things have four feet".

It says any other thing that flys or ceeps which has 4 feet other than beetles, locusts, bald locusts or grashoppers cannot be eaten.

It doesn't say all insects that fly have 4 feet. That's absurd.


Well you seem to have stooped to the level of name calling, never mind I forgive you.

If that is how you choose to interprit the verse then fine go with it, so can you actually name a flying creeping thing that has four feet ?

Flying horses don't count by the way as the concensus of opinion is that they are imaginary.



posted on Oct, 9 2008 @ 04:48 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by moocowman
reply to post by LeoVirgo
 


When you talk about four legged animals are you refering to those in the bible ? as the bible claims that insects have four legs, which we now know they do not. Unless of course you pluck a few off before munching them.


Let's not lie shall we? That verse is discussing GRASSHOPPERS.

Leviticus 11:21-22

" Yet these may ye eat of every flying creeping thing that goeth upon four, which have legs above their feet, to leap withal upon the earth; these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind."





So, you didn't exactly explain why you removed this portion of the verse from your post -

But all other flying creeping things, which have four feet, shall be an abomination unto you

Was the Enemy guiding you hands when you chose to omit a very relevent chunk of a bible verse?

Were you consumed with pride when you called me a liar and bore false witness against me, please bare in mind I did not accuse you of anything.

Did you give in to the temptation of Satan when you called me a moron and did you feel better because of it ?

What have you done my friend ?
Why did you knowingly choose to edit the word of God Allmighty, do you think so little of your saviour as to try and use deception to fool the truthseeker.

Do you not think that the Lord is happy with his word, and would wish even one word to be changed or removed?

Beware my friend, Satan the deceiver will beguile you in any way he can, you are showing your true colors.



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