Persecution or Imagination

reply to post by Clearskies

Actually you are wrong.

That was merely the opening line to a topic I was already interested in.

I borrowed him as an excuse to talk about this very real issue and the topic has proven to be an interesting learning experience for everyone.

reply to post by Clearskies

The whole premise for this thread (a Christian on another thread who claimed persecution)
DID NOT HAPPEN.

Why not just close it?

?????

I'm sorry, I'm not getting your meaning. Can you please be more direct.

Originally posted by mmariebored
reply to post by Clearskies

 

Actually you are wrong.

Was he complaining for being persecuted on that thread?
If you 'borrowed' him, was it for real?

reply to post by MatrixProphet


He's talking about the quote in the OP.

Originally posted by Clearskies

Originally posted by mmariebored
reply to post by Clearskies

 

Actually you are wrong.

Was he complaining for being persecuted on that thread?
If you 'borrowed' him, was it for real?

I U2U'd him and we cleared it all up. Yes, his post did spark the topic but it's one I was interested in anyway. All clear now? OK then.

reply to post by mmariebored


I'm not a 'he'.
Actually, I'm glad you cleared it up, but, still the whining about Christians whining grinds on.

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by mmariebored

 

I'm not a 'he'.
Actually, I'm glad you cleared it up, but, still the whining about Christians whining grinds on.

Your motives for getting this thread closed are extremely visible.

Why do you not want others on this forum to speak of this very real issue?

What are you afraid of?

reply to post by mmariebored

I haven't asked anyone but here in this thread to close it.
I just think you ought to have proof of us claiming persecution on ATS, BEFORE the bash-fest.


[edit on 7-10-2008 by Clearskies]

There are no "victims" just volunteers!!

"They subsisted on pessimism seasoned with bitterness and then washed it all down with religion." - Paula Wall

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by mmariebored

 

I haven't asked anyone but here in this thread to close it.
I just think you ought to have proof of us claiming persecution on ATS, BEFORE the bash-fest.


[edit on 7-10-2008 by Clearskies]

Nice try. I never once said it was ONLY ATS posters who do this. I said "here in America". Try not to let your bias opinion effect your logic. And this isn't a "bash fest". The only ones in here that seem to be bashing are the ones bashing me for not believing as they do and, the biggest reason for them bashing me has been that they keep misinterpreting the OP.

[edit on 7-10-2008 by mmariebored]

Originally posted by mmariebored

Yeah. Nice try. I never once said it was ONLY ATS poster who do this. I said "here in America". Try not to let your bias opinion effect your logic.

You said on page one; here

The whole reason I posted this thread is because the person I quoted in the OP claimed they were a "persecuted" Christian.

Originally posted by mmariebored
Actually, here is how it went:

I said, "...why do you keep coming back?"

To which you replied, "I'm flipping between this and setting up my fantasy football teams for week 6. I sometimes feel that I don't have the education necessary to 'play with the big boys' on the apologetic's field, but this one is pretty easy pickin's. Maybe because it's so easy to reach for the low hanging fruit?"

**CLIPPED** I'm all done this little game of cat and mouse with you, go play with someone else, I won't respond to you anymore because I hate liars.

I see. You equate me attacking your argumentative with me attacking you. If you don't want your theory assailed or discussed, keep it to yourself. I didn't insult you. I don't dislike you. I don't know you.

I think that your theory is unfounded. I will gladly attack your theory. Your rhetoric is unsound. I will gladly attack that.

The only time that I stepped over the line is when I assigned a motive to you. I apologized for that. I still do. It was wrong.

You called me a liar. I have no recollection of ever lying to you. Are you implying that I'm a liar for having asked you to point out where I abused or insulted people?

Eric

PS I'm looking for a strong enough box to pack the gold into. Give me a few days.

Originally posted by Clearskies
You said on page one; here

The whole reason I posted this thread is because the person I quoted in the OP claimed they were a "persecuted" Christian.

Hmmm, the words " the whole" should be replaced with "one of", but I'm unable to edit that post.
All cleared up now?

To the FEW posters who posted on this topic, strongly insisting on the closer of this thread due to irrelevance, you are not the only ones on this VERY LARGE FORUM OF PEOPLE. How do you know that the thousands of other people who come in here might not come into this thread and think, "Hmm. Maybe before I exaggerate that this guy at my job is harassing me for being a Christian I should take a look at myself and try to see if there's something I'm doing that I wasn't aware of that might be upsetting him."



There is your "motive", take it or leave it but I don't care if you don't believe it.





[edit on 8-10-2008 by mmariebored]

Originally posted by 19DCW71

We are all guilty in every race or religion of this very same thing which we discuss, so lets not even try to generalize. Not a single one of us is perfect or close to it. We're all HYPOCRITES. Yes me to.

Please speak only for yourself. If you consider yourself an hypocrite that is your problem, don't attribute your faults onto others, I have no intention of sharing your guilt...

Originally posted by AshleyD

Absolutely incorrect.

I am sorry if I misinterpreted, or misrepresented, your thoughts. If so, please accept my humble apology...

No religion, or ideology, as a worst track record, in that field, then Christianity...

Incorrect. This has all been discussed HERE in massive 83 page depth. Atheistic, secular, and communistic regimes have killed more than Christianity... by tens of millions. There is also a reason why that thread lasted as long as it did. See if you can figure out why.

[edit on 10/7/2008 by AshleyD]

I stand by statement. I was talking of persecution by people who say they are Christian, or that are brought up as Christian. The way I see it:

1) Being a communist dos not make you any less Christian, even though it should. Russia, or the USSR, is, and was comprised of Christian people...their ideology as no relevance. I even have a communist friend, a Christian, that states, wen I feel like flaming him for the apparent contradiction, Jesus was the first Marxist". Who am I to judge?
I, for instance, although an Atheist, am profoundly anti-communist...

2) Those regimes persecuted whomever was seen as an enemy of the State. They did not target Christians in particular. I know the former USSR well and, at least in it's last period, of the communist regime, there where many Christian institutions open (schools, churches, monasteries etc.).
If you are referring me to the Lenin and Stalin period, they where homicidal psychopaths, who killed anything that got in their way, specially Jews...

3) It is the upbringing I am interested in. Most of those regimes you invoked where ruled by people with a Christian upbringing. Just goes to show what sort of people come out of those brainwashing years (I exclude, here, the Anabaptists and all other Christian groups that require members to be adults, before they start their "training").

P.S. I don't use, nor consult, other posts as reference...
P.P.S. Again, I apologize if I misinterpreted your post...

Originally posted by NorthWolfe CND

Originally posted by 19DCW71

We are all guilty in every race or religion of this very same thing which we discuss, so lets not even try to generalize. Not a single one of us is perfect or close to it. We're all HYPOCRITES. Yes me to.

Please speak only for yourself. If you consider yourself an hypocrite that is your problem, don't attribute your faults onto others, I have no intention of sharing your guilt...

Well I see your a deceitful hypocrite, because now you're lying. Everyone is guilty of hypocrisy to some point. I'm not even going to argue the point because it's senseleess, so I'll just state my opinion. You obviously (in your eyes are w/out fault and have lived a PERFCT life. This alone makes you a hypocrite.

You've lived a perfect sinless life. Is this correct?

Honestly. You are also a hypocrite.Look into your life and accept the reality.I'm not saying you're a hypocrite now,I'm making a point that we have at one time or another, been guilty of it. It doesn't make you a bad person,just human.But to deny it proves you truly are naive/blind to the fact and life or just aren't in touch w/reality. So please try to get off the pedestal and ground your life in the reality we UNFORTUNATELY have made as a species.

Because to honestly sit here and act as if your faultless and never commited a hypocritical act is as good as claiming your GOD.

Originally posted by NorthWolfe CND

I stand by statement. I was talking of persecution by people who say they are Christian, or that are brought up as Christian. The way I see it:

1) Being a communist dos not make you any less Christian, even though it should. Russia, or the USSR, is, and was comprised of Christian people...their ideology as no relevance. I even have a communist friend, a Christian, that states, wen I feel like flaming him for the apparent contradiction, Jesus was the first Marxist". Who am I to judge?
I, for instance, although an Atheist, am profoundly anti-communist...

2) Those regimes persecuted whomever was seen as an enemy of the State. They did not target Christians in particular. I know the former USSR well and, at least in it's last period, of the communist regime, there where many Christian institutions open (schools, churches, monasteries etc.).
If you are referring me to the Lenin and Stalin period, they where homicidal psychopaths, who killed anything that got in their way, specially Jews...

3) It is the upbringing I am interested in. Most of those regimes you invoked where ruled by people with a Christian upbringing. Just goes to show what sort of people come out of those brainwashing years (I exclude, here, the Anabaptists and all other Christian groups that require members to be adults, before they start their "training").

P.S. I don't use, nor consult, other posts as reference...
P.P.S. Again, I apologize if I misinterpreted your post...

1. WRONG!!! Marxist regimes have a long history forcing allegiance to state above any religion. According to Christianity, that is human idolatry. This alone makes marxism and Christianity incompatible. And Jesus was NOT a communist hippie!!!! Where the hell do people get these stupid ideas?

2. I fail to see how anything you said here justifies the actions taken by the Marxist regimes. And yes...they did TARGET religious people. Spin it any way you want, but FACTS don't change.

3.Another IGNORANT statement that implies complete LACK of knowledge or understanding on your part. No matter how a person is brought up, what they become is up to them, not their upbringing. Its called FREE WILL. Get it throught your head!!!

Originally posted by NorthWolfe CND
P.S. I don't use, nor consult, other posts as reference...

Well I wish you would because everything you just said was already discussed in that other thread. You are simply incorrect. I also love how atheists always wiggle out of the atrocities by claiming 'it wasn't in the name of atheism' all the while trying to shift the goal posts by saying the people of those eras had Christian upbringing. Let's make it easy then and say it wasn't in the name of Christianity. And sorry but many of those despots were atheists and did target religions, churches, synagogues, and mosques under the guise of them being, as you say, 'enemies of the state.'

Yes, those regimes killed more people than the history of Christianity combined so why you would want to 'stand by your original statement' is beyond me.

Originally posted by mmariebored
The only ones in here that seem to be bashing are the ones bashing me for not believing as they do and, the biggest reason for them bashing me has been that they keep misinterpreting the OP.

Incorrect.

1). Nobody is bashing you because you don't believe as they do. They are attacking the ignorant statements you continually make. If you truly think you are being attacked for your beliefs, then that comes across as... oh, I don't know... imagined persecution.

2). Now let's review what we have seen from those who are not Christians on this thread:

a). The 'you're a bad Christian' card (judgmentally applied).
b). The belief in God compared to Santa Claus.
c). Your unhinged preoccupation with my avatar (and claiming it is persecuting and judging you).
d). The 'turn the other cheek' card (incorrectly applied).
e). Christianity being referred to as 'stupidity' (and an excuse for persecution- Yikes!).
f). Religion being described as 'ridiculous.'
g). Christianity = 'retarded belief system.'

The list goes on but that is the gist of it from this thread alone (and not even the entire thread!). So who exactly is being ridiculed for not believing the way others do? Which side has displayed a more judgmental tone? Uh huh.

Originally posted by mmariebored
Nice try. I never once said it was ONLY ATS posters who do this. I said "here in America".

Can you please point me to this post of yours? The first person to say 'Here in America' was Asmeone2 in THIS POST. And this was AFTER a couple Christians responded to the thread. Your OP never specified Western or American Christians. Furthermore, your second post made it pretty clear you had world wide in mind. Sorry but it looks like you have been forced to eat your own words repeatedly on this thread. I've never seen so much back tracking occur in a single thread on ATS. If I missed it where you targeted Western/American Christians, I will apologize. Just please point me to this post before someone else focused the topic on Western persecution.

It looks to me like you got stuck after saying some disgusting things about Eastern persecution and suddenly wanted to say, 'Ya. Ya. Western Christians. That is what I really wanted to talk about.'

[edit on 10/8/2008 by AshleyD]

Originally posted by mmariebored

Originally posted by Clearskies
You said on page one; here

The whole reason I posted this thread is because the person I quoted in the OP claimed they were a "persecuted" Christian.

Hmmm, the words " the whole" should be replaced with "one of", but I'm unable to edit that post.
All cleared up now?

Yeah,, umm that would help remove the evidence clearskies was right in addition to the apology you owe her.