I have some curiosities that mabey you all can clarify for me.

First, I have studies the Bible endlessly, I do not feel that it is all what we think it is, a literal book of facts that pertained to the Hebrews/Jews.

When studying the Egyptian history, I find some interesting things. First, I read that circumcision started with the Egyptian Pharaohs. Second, I read that Amun-Ra was once carried in a box/Ark by the Egyptians.

Now let me ask some what ifs.

What if-Abraham was not Isaacs father. What if the long ages in the Bible were added so we dont associate the Hebrew history with the Egyptian history. What if, when Abraham and Sarah were in Egypt, and they lied to the Pharaoh about Sarah not being the wife of Abraham...what if Sarah got pregnant by the Pharaoh. What if Sarah, was carrying the bloodline of the Egyptian rule. What if this is the reason, even though the Pharaoh was mad at them for this lie, he still sends them away with many gifts. What if the secret of the Hebrews was that they were shunned out of Egypt and they tried to take the God out of Egypt. What if the whole reason God did go with Sarah and Abraham was because the baby that was due for the next inheritance was the baby of the Pharaoh. What if this is why we see a people that have now no land and who are not a nation....trying to become one and trying to say they have 'rights' to a particular land all because they considered themselves special enough to rightfully kill masses of people to take their land in Gods name.

Could there be a deeper Egyptian tie going on in the Old Testament that people are over looking?

Is there more to the name....Is-Ra-El?
Some say, Israel means Ra is God.




[edit on 4-10-2008 by LeoVirgo]

[edit on 4-10-2008 by LeoVirgo]

well there's a couple possibilities i noticed while reading your posts, and from my own studies.

i had established a theory that Ra was the sumerian Enki, and that Enki was the biblical serpent in the Garden of Eden. i originally came upon this theory while reading the legend of the destruction of mankind and comparing its information to the sumerian texts. it refers to ra in the text as having skin like gold, bones like silver and hair like lapis lazuli, which just so happens to also be the description of enki's E.ABZU temple in ancient sumer. it was gold on the outside, silver on the inside, with blue lapis lazuli decoration. it seemed as if the structure had been personified, and melded with the identity of Enki. followign the flood his name was changed to EA, which i believe is when the stories of Ra come about (akkadian period), so i theorized that RA = EA = ENKI. the only part that's still up in the air for me (And then only marginally) is it really RA = EA = ENKI = SERPENT IN THE GARDEN. I really don't know.

next part...

So I also looked into the identity of Enki's father/brother (depends on the text), who's name was Enlil. Enlil, etymologically is also EL, so now we have a real problem in the context of the IS.RA.EL reference.

Because it would seem to be saying Enki is Enlil, based on your theory.
Based on my theory, which claims the word comes from the name Sarah, it would seem as if the word play could be the problem. i don't really know about that either. If Enki was Enlil or if Enki was EL (God), then why is he attributed with actions in the sumerian-akkadian texts tthat are referred to as the actions of Satan in the bible?

final part...

according to the biblical scholar Michael S. Heiser,
the word Elohiym (or Elohim) was used interchangably when referring to angels, the gods and Jehovah, depending on which translation of the text you were reading. He theorized, based on his extensive knowledge in ancient hebrew and several other ancient languages, that the word Elohiym (EL for short) was a word that describes a race of beings. he further elaborates that he believes they were characterized as spirit beings of massive power, some moreso than others and the one of them in particular, is Jehovah, who is the head Elohiym.

So it's possible then, based on your theory, that Enki and Enlil are both simply angels, or rather elohiym, spirit beings, who are not necessarily jehovah. This is the problem with ancient languages and texts. the clues are limited, the translation errors abound and the data is condensed!

Hello Undo...thanks for your thoughts. Very interesting, I have always felt there is a tie to all the old myths, that they somehow entertwine.

Interesting even more the idea that Ra/Eniki would be the serpent in the Bible because I believe the serpent was doing a much needed action, helping us evolve. They thoughts are that God wasnt being mean and tempting Eve in something so grand as a wonderful fruit, but yet, God needed this to happen, God needed the spirit to come into mater to claim the lost light of the spirit (possible the reasons why we say the angels fell).

I tend to think along those same lines about the Elohim. I could accept Yhwh being an Elohim much more then I could accept Yhwh being God, the one and only above all things. The Elohim could be the sons of God that are refered to the text of Cannon, sons of El. I feel that El is more then a generic term for God. I feel that the Elohim can be capable of wrath but God, the One, is not. (Just my personal thoughts)

Isnt it strange that God tells Aaron that Moses is becoming an Elohim? And in Psalms I remember reading something that sounded to me like a God giveing inheritence to the Elohim. Were these Elohim given certain nations as their inheritence and did some of these Elohim become prideful in this gift?

You mention Eniki and Enlil...when I read the story about one of them taking the sacrd name from the other, tricking them in doing so (mabey you can clear up who took it from who)...I cant help but to think of the famous YHWH we see in the OT. Was this truly a sacred name and if so, could it of been stolen and abused for wrathful power?

Any proof for this theory? Any ,at all? If you say that book is false, why you rely on certain facts and dismiss the others?
In the text it says that pharaoh's wife gave birth before Sarah did. So this blood-line thing should not work. And people becoming nation - is several hundred years later.
I am not even talking about Is-ra-el thing.

I think the influence of Egypt on the Jewish people is an understudied area.

I just noted this in another thread--even most Christians conceede that Moses was raised as an Egyptian prince, therefore had more than passing exposure to their culture and beleifs.

I can't help but wonder how much of this was passed on in his writings and personality.

well my take on that is that the original adam and eve were black people. and that later, more races from offworld were brought here. the rest of the races are just a result of interbreeding on this planet.

Hey guys, I think everyone here needs to brush up on their Sitchin. Enki was the creator god. His equivalent in Egypt was Ptah. Ra was a son of Ptah. Enlil was the brother of Enki and also a rival who lived in the Edin. Enki created man in the image of the Anunaki, while he was consigned to Africa, by modifying apeman with alien DNA (the serpent) thus giving the new homo sapiens knowledge, but not long life as the Anunaki. Enlil craved the new creation to do work for him in the Edin. As a sterile hybrid this new creation could not interbreed and so could be controlled. By further DNA manipulation and even using his own semen, Enki created homo sapiens sapiens a completely new man. This peed off Enlil who could no longer control the population of man, and so banished him from the Edin. Man, gifted with intelligence, survived and multiplied on the earth. Ea is an epithet of Enki meaning "the master of water". El is a name for god. Therefore Is-Ra-El surely is stating something here. The pharaohs of Egypt all wore a headdress with the symbolic Serpent (Enki, the creator). My own opinion is that you can trace the expansion of civilization out from Egypt by following the trail of the Serpent, from China and Asia all the way to the Americas.

Pretty crazy stuff eh?

Yes,all religions share insane beliefs that can never be empirically proven.Does that make them foolish to believe?Sure,Yes,And definitely.It is interesting to see how they basically rip each other off, usually leading to a retarded conclusion of racial superiority.I do not believe that we are going to find any secrets,as too much time has passed and the true origins of these beliefs have been convoluted into the present and will be lost forever in the mists of time.Researching these things is,at best,Like an interactive myth building exercise.And that is it.The only thing we can glean from this type of study is that people and cultures were murdered,beliefs co-opted,then books were burned and new ''truths'' were written shortly afterword.End of story.

you might also find this interesting:

enki saved the king of sumer from the flood. in other words, he saved the nephilim line of hybrids

enlil saved noah's line from the flood. in other words, he saved the humans.

this is why in the sumerian-akkadian-babylonian texts on the subject, we find that enlil is really angry at enki.

but the texts make it sound as if enki has saved the humans from the flood. nope. he saved THE KING OF SUMER, who was a nephilim.

this is why it says in genesis 6 that there were nephilim in the earth in those days and also after (referencing before and after the flood), because enki had saved his own creation, his hybrid nephilim.

in the sumerian version, you see enlil is angry at enki for going against the wishes of the council on the subject. but the text does not point out (and it should, but what do you expect, it was written by enki's priests) that the wishes of the council were to be rid of the hybrids, not the humans.


[edit on 4-10-2008 by undo]

Abraham's wife cohabited with the Pharoah, and stayed there for some time... Joseph himself says he was "a father to Pharaoh", how much more do you need?


This is the whole point of the idea of bible women being impregnated by kings. Abraham was a king, but his seed was Ishmael. Sarah was his queen, but God saw fit to have her imprgnated by Pharaoh, which is the truth behind Abraham's reaction.

Isaac was the son of a pharaoh right before Yuya (the biblical Joseph) and Amenhotep III (who was the biblical Solomon) and then Akhenaten, who is Moses.