“Did you know (many) Scientists are afraid of the Bible?”

Originally posted by badmedia
I agree and disagree. I don't think scientists are afraid of the bible images.

But science is definitely afraid of consciousness and choice. They never include consciousness into much of anything. In a world of action/reaction, these things have no place. And because they can't explain it's position into things, they simply ignore it.

And the bible outside of the images talks about consciousness/god.

What I love about quantum physics is that it actually doesn't ignore consciousness. And I think it in many ways does explain the things Jesus talked about, which have up to this point been ignored in science.

Consciousness doesn't come into play at all in quantum mechanics.

I have but one simple question that I believe requires answering before any further discussion takes place....

“Did you know (many) Scientists are afraid of the Bible?”

Name then please. In fact if you can name just 10 scientists that would be greatly appreciated.

Oh and FYI....

There was no specific list or accounting of all the books that made up the Bible until the commission of the first Bible by the Emperor Constantine in the 4th Century AD. Parts of the bible are believed to have been written around 1,000 BC however there is no verified proof of that. The collected writings were not put into what is now called the bible until around 320 AD.

The Bible has absolutely no PRIMARY source to account for it. All sources of the Bible are SECONDARY at best and therefore disclude the Bible as being historical fact.

Why is this still in General Conspiracy? The OP has made a baseless claim that 'many scientists are scared of the Bible' providing absolutely no basis for evidence to support this. This should be moved to Skunkworks where it belongs.

If it were to remain in General Conspiracy the Title should be changed to 'I believe that....' or 'In my opinion....'.

Originally posted by Kryties
Why is this still in General Conspiracy? The OP has made a baseless claim that 'many scientists are scared of the Bible' providing absolutely no basis for evidence to support this. This should be moved to Skunkworks where it belongs.

If it were to remain in General Conspiracy the Title should be changed to 'I believe that....' or 'In my opinion....'.

Great posts Kryties, I feel the exact same way. Bullsh*t like this clogs the forum and wastes everyones time. No matter how many *true* FACTS that we bring to the table, this idiot is still gonna keep dodging bullets and repeatedly quoting the bible... its ridiculous.


Zeitgeist: Addendum
Again talks about how as you said there are NO primary sources, and the fact that there were so many *PRE-CHRISTIAN SAVIORS* that shared the exact same traits, puts the whole story in mythological territory by associations.

People of the time were aware of this, so whats the logical answer? THE DEVIL DID IT!!!!!111LO~L

"The devil whose business is to pervert truth, mimics the exact circumstance of the divine sacrements........................" "Let us therefore aknowledge the craftiness of the devil who copied certain things of those that be divine" -tertillian 222 AD


Come on the whole religion thing is such a joke, how can you look at your modern world and say, yah this how god woulda done it. Get over it, its a sham so what you wasted your life believing it, get over it and start a new life!

Consciousness doesn't come into play at all in quantum mechanics

If this is true, then what turns the particle wave of possibilities into a single particle? Why does observing an experiment change the experiment if it has nothing to do with quantum physics?

Originally posted by king9072
Zeitgeist: Addendum
Again talks about how as you said there are NO primary sources, and the fact that there were so many *PRE-CHRISTIAN SAVIORS* that shared the exact same traits, puts the whole story in mythological territory by associations.

People of the time were aware of this, so whats the logical answer? THE DEVIL DID IT!!!!!111LO~L

"The devil whose business is to pervert truth, mimics the exact circumstance of the divine sacrements........................" "Let us therefore aknowledge the craftiness of the devil who copied certain things of those that be divine" -tertillian 222 AD

Where the guy they quoted there went wrong was that he tried to claim that his version was the only true version. The philosophy behind the images is what is kept hidden, and if you focus on the philosophy rather than the material image you can see that. As the movie you quoted even pointed out in another point.

The original movie that showed all that stuff actually made me understand that. It showed me that it was not divine because of the image/material stuck to it, as those images have always been changed to meet the time/culture. It was divine for the truth hidden in the philosophy of what was being said. On a spiritual level, I agree with them. On the image/material level where mainstream religion lives today, I think it's the exact opposite of divine.

If you start talking about the actual teachings of christ, rather than talking about how great his image is, mainstream christians will call you the devil they are so far manipulated. I know from experience They accept authority as truth rather than truth as authority, which is completely against the teachings of christ. And on the flip side, when I try to point out how Jesus was right in what he taught etc on a philosophic and spiritual level, those who are against christians paint me as being one of the above. IMO, both are merely looking at the material.

reply to post by OldThinker



I dont think the scientists are scared of the bible I think they just objectively look at the idea that just because it was written a couple of thousand years ago it does'nt make it true.

You spit out as much babble from the bible that you want it still does not make it true.

Again as I posted elsewhere today God did not create adam and eve he created dinosuars and neandertals. There enough proof around to say that these where the first living creatures on earth.

the bible talks about creating birds and trees and water and so forth and so forth not dinosuars and neandertals, and if he indeed create the dinsaurs then he has wiped out life twice on this planet has'nt he or the bible forget to talk about the meteor that struck the earth. I think it would be the other way around Christians are now debating the idea of carbon dating to not be very accurate and yet they want to stand up with the face of jesus's face on that cloth and say it dates back to the time of christ go figure


[edit on 10/6/2008 by mullet35]

Originally posted by mullet35
I dont think the scientists are scared of the bible I think they just objectively look at the idea that just because it was written a couple of thousand years ago it does'nt make it true.

You spit out as much babble from the bible that you want it still does not make it true.

Again as I posted elsewhere today God did not create adam and eve he created dinosuars and neandertals. There enough proof around to say that these where the first living creatures on earth.

the bible talks about creating birds and trees and water and so forth and so forth not dinosuars and neandertals, and if he indeed create the dinsaurs then he has wiped out life twice on this planet has'nt he or the bible forget to talk about the meteor that struck the earth. I think it would be the other way around Christians are now debating the idea of carbon dating to not be very accurate and yet they want to stand up with the face of jesus's face on that cloth and say it dates back to the time of christ go figure

I really don't get why people fight over creationism and evolution. I don't think evolution disproves god at all. I don't even see how evolution proves creationism wrong either, and vice versa.

If I am making something, I don't start with the finished product. I keep working on it until it's the finished product.

I'm a programmer, and when I write a new program it starts out somewhat simple, and then I keep building and adding to it until it's doing what I want it to do. And then even after the main coding of the program is done, I will constantly be going back to make small changes as the need comes.

To suggest I didn't create the program because it evolved over time is crazy. And to suggest my creation couldn't evolve over time into it's current form is equally crazy.



[edit on 6-10-2008 by badmedia]

reply to post by badmedia


It was always a 'single particle', the act of measuring it just makes it collapse. While this wave/particle duality is mysterious, it has nothing to do with what our consciousness.

[edit on 6-10-2008 by science lol]

reply to post by badmedia


I just dont understand how people change the story to defend the bible where in the bible does it talk about the dinosaurs this is the first life on earth. besides small bactria and other little tiny creatures dinosaurs where the first life form on earth right, now how about that meteor you just going to right that off because modern man was not around then so its only lower life form being lost so the bible does not touch on it. Life is life and all life is supposed to be a creation of god and if that is the case why not give recignition to the loss of it in the bible. The meteor and the supposed flood that is 2 major events that wiped out the majority of life on this planet but the bible only talks about one of them.

As for the flood go and find aboriginal rock art to prove that it happened they had spirits to explain major events in thier the rainbow serpent made one of the large rivers for example. If their was an event of this nature on the planet they would have a spirit to explain it. but then if it did happen they would even be around would they, they weren't on the ark stop having blind faith and just look at the obvious



[edit on 10/6/2008 by mullet35]

Originally posted by science lol
reply to post by badmedia

 

It was always a 'single particle', the act of measuring it just makes it collapse. While this wave/particle duality is mysterious, it has nothing to do with what our consciousness.

[edit on 6-10-2008 by science lol]

Well I know it's all connected and stuff, and so the wave is still a single particle. I get you there, and I get that level.

But you say the act of measuring. Well what is doing the measuring?
What is the measuring and results being presented to? And what is doing all the measuring in our senses so that we only see and can sense the collapsed particle? Is it not consciousness?

I just dont understand how people change the story to defend the bible where in the bible does it talk about the dinosaurs this is the first life on earth. besides small bactria and other little tiny creatures dinosaurs where the first life form on earth right, now how about that meteor you just going to right that off because modern man was not around then so its only lower life form being lost so the bible does not touch on it. Life is life and all life is supposed to be a creation of god and if that is the case why not give recignition to the loss of it in the bible. The meteor and the supposed flood that is 2 major events that wiped out the majority of life on this planet but the bible only talks about one of them.

Just people who focus on material/image and don't truly understand IMO. When they try to pass it off as the only truth etc, which is a lie, they get dogmas. People who accept authority as truth, rather than truth as authority.

As for the flood go and find aboriginal rock art to prove that it happened they had spirits to explain major events in thier the rainbow serpent made one of the large rivers for example. If their was an event of this nature on the planet they would have a spirit to explain it. but then if it did happen they would even be around would they, they weren't on the ark stop having blind faith and just look at the obvious

I am of the opinion that the story was taken from existing text like Gilgamesh etc and the names changed to fit the culture. And that is was a more local event. But I don't really know. It's honestly not important to me.

What's funny is how so many "scientists" forget their history.

The greatest scientists of all time were believers. Science got it's start because the first scientists assumed that the universe was an orderly place, with natural laws, because God is an orderly entity that set down natural laws. They assumed that the working of nature and the universe could be understood because they assumed God wanted it to be understood.

There are not very many scientists who did great things who were not believers.

Science and religion are two completely separate things and do not need to be in conflict. The only real time they do collide is when people try to say that the Earth is 10,000 years old (or whatever the number is) or that ID makes more sense that religion. The are other issues but its largely a problem associated with scientific discovery stepping on the toes of 'the believers'. I could say that many religious people forget their history, with the suppression of science as a means to hold onto a paradigm. Flat Earth, centre of the universe da da you see what I mean.

Maybe if some of you religious people understood how science works with peer review etc, you would realise that it is a means to explain how things work. It may not fit in with your Bible, but do you really believe people back then knew more than us about how the world works? Look at the way people have lived in the past...

Science is not a religion, therefore the two should not be compared.

REPEAT

Science is not a religion, therefore the two should not be compared.

SCIENCE IS NOT A FAITH BASED SYSTEM. It is in fact quite the opposite.




[edit on 6-10-2008 by seenitall]

reply to post by seenitall

I apologize for using the bacteria instead of organisms. But yet again here is yet another pointless post just taking a stab at someone instead of putting in something useless. The more time I spend on this site the more pathetic alot of people seem to be.

(You said something silly so instead of informing you of the correct information Im going to take the chance to belittle you)

Or you said something I did'nt like so I'm going to Ignore you

Please how can so many intelligent people be so immature

Originally posted by mullet35
reply to post by seenitall

 

I apologize for using the bacteria instead of organisms. But yet again here is yet another pointless post just taking a stab at someone instead of putting in something useless. The more time I spend on this site the more pathetic alot of people seem to be.

(You said something silly so instead of informing you of the correct information Im going to take the chance to belittle you)

Or you said something I did'nt like so I'm going to Ignore you

Please how can so many intelligent people be so immature

Maybe they get irritated when they are wrongly corrected by people that think bacteria is NOT an organism.

I changed my post, this topic really annoys me though.

Maybe start by reading about the evolutionary history of life. Its backed up by enough data.

reply to post by sir_chancealot


Correlation is not the same thing as causation.

Originally posted by asmeone2
reply to post by OldThinker

 

OT did you have time to look for any specific scientific references yet?

Asmeone2…Sorry it took so long to get back with you…travelling for work…boy, we sure have got some opinions on this thread….thank you to all for contributing…Here’s some more info to marinate on…

OT believes Science and the Bible are basically in agreement on many things, including…man's creation - man most definitely made a very late appearance on planet Earth. Scripture says that humanity was God's final creation. Science basically agrees, although maintaining that hundreds of millions of years, and countless millions of creatures of the air, land, and sea would come and go, before man arrived. This harmonization between the Bible and science should not be minimized. This is the one claim that the Bible made about man's creation that can be scientifically verified and later confirmed. The verse…”So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.” Genesis 1:27

Also what about the very first verse of the Holy Bible. This is often disregarded or greatly unappreciated, especially when we consider the level of scientific knowledge that existed at the time of its writing. It was not always known that time had a beginning. Many cultures believed that the universe existed in cycles or was eternal. Yet, the very first verse of the Bible states, in simple terms, that both the universe and time did have a beginning. This is a fact that science has since verified with the concept of the Big Bang. Whether this belief originated or was unique to the Hebrews is not as important as the fact that it was the correct belief. For once again, the Bible and science are in perfect harmony. The verse…”In the Beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” Genesis 1:1

I did find a book for you that may shed more light on to the subject…here’s the link… www.amazon.com...

And some editorials… “Schroeder (Genesis and the Big Bang, LJ 9/15/90) is an Israeli physicist and scholar of Genesis who maintains that a properly understood Bible and a properly understood science provide consistent sets of data. In recent decades, scientific discoveries in cosmology, paleontology, and quantum physics do not demonstrate or prove the activity of God, but they do remove conflict with that activity. Rapprochement occurs when believers read the Bible on the Bible's terms, avoiding literalism, and when scientists realize that science is powerless to pronounce on a purpose for life. Schroeder is very lucid in explaining difficult scientific concepts, such as the passage of time according to the theory of relativity, and religious data, such as the original Hebrew words. Schroeder's careful and responsible handling of the data on origins from science and Genesis 1, combined with a fresh, judicious correlation between the two, is compelling. Highly recommended.?Eugene O. Bowser, Univ. of Northern Colorado, Greeley.”

There are other concepts…such as…What Holds the up the Earth? - 3000 years ago the Hindus recorded the earth was resting on the backs of several huge elephants. The elephants were resting on the back of a very large turtle that was swimming in a sea. Greek mythology claims that the god Atlas was holding the earth on his shoulders. The Bible says in Job 26:7 — "[God] hangeth the earth on nothing." What a remarkable statement of fact. The earth is suspended in space. Nothing is holding it up. Job wrote about the same time the Hindu Scripture was written. How did Job know this scientific fact?

Again- Flat Versus Round Earth - For thousands of years people believed the earth was flat. If one went too far, he would fall over the edge. This was taught in both Hindu and Buddhist scripture. In the 1500s, the first ship sailed around the world. This proved the earth was round. But the round earth was recorded in the Judeo-Christian Bible long before man discovered it in the 1500s. The prophet Isaiah (40:22) spoke of the "circle of the earth." Solomon wrote, "God set a compass [circle] upon the face of the deep." Proverbs 8:27. In our century, Arabs spoke of infidels being pushed over the edge into space. About 3,000 years ago, our Bible said the earth was round. This was not discovered until 500 years ago.

Also – The Sun, Moon and Stars - Ancient people were afraid of the sun, moon and stars. They thought they were alive — that they were gods. But over 5,000 years ago, the Judeo-Christian Bible in the first chapter of Genesis pointed out that the sun, moon and stars were created by God. Remember, our God states that He is the one and only God. This proves the sun, moon and stars that He created are not gods.
Eclipses - This was frightening to people long ago. Some thought it happened when the moon was mad at the earth and turned its face away. The Chinese believed that an eclipse was caused by a demon or some huge animal that ate the sun and then would give them up again. God told Jeremiah, "Thus saith the Lord, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them." God went on to reassure Jeremiah that the universe is under God’s control. Later scientists learned that heavenly bodies were not alive and that man need not fear them. Thousands of years before scientists discovered that the planetary bodies were inanimate, the Judeo-Christian Bible contained this scientific fact.

Also what about-the Bottom of the Ocean - Until modern times people thought the ocean floor was sandy like the desert and saucer shaped—deepest in the middle. This was even true of the pre-1900 geologists. But in the 1900s oceanographers found the sea had many deep valleys or canyons. The deepest canyons were called trenches. The Marianas Trench in the Pacific is so deep that if Mt. Everest (29,000 feet high) was dropped into it, the peak would still be a mile below the water’s surface. There are also underwater mountains. The Atlantic Ocean contains an undersea range of mountains 10,000 miles long. 3,000 years ago the Judeo-Christian Bible spoke of the valleys and mountains of the sea. In Psalm 18:15 (NIV) David wrote of God being the creator of "the valleys of the sea." God asked Job "Have you walked in the recesses [valleys] of the sea?" The prophet Jonah was thrown off a ship and spoke of falling to the bottom of the mountains in the sea (Jonah 2:6).

And lastly for now…the Paths of the Sea - In 1800s, Matthew Maury, an officer in the US Navy believed his Bible. One day Maury was reading about the dominion man was given over the animals in Psalm 8. He was amazed that verse 8 spoke of the fish and all creatures that swim in the "paths of the sea." "Paths of the sea"— how could this be? He never knew there was such a thing. He was determined to find them. Maury discovered that the oceans have many paths or currents, which were like rivers flowing through the sea. Maury wrote the first book on oceanography and became known as "the pathfinder of the seas"— "The father of modern navigation." Maury received his idea about ocean currents from reading Psalm 8:8 which was written about 3,000 years ago by King David. David wrote as he was moved by the Spirit of God and probably never actually saw an ocean. Note: Psalm 8:8 also spoke of fish in the "paths of the seas." Today’s fishing boats make good catches in the currents or paths of the sea. They know this is where the fish swim.

OT out!

reply to post by redhatty


Redhatty,

Here's an approach that makes sence to me on the 'four corner' issues

www.christiananswers.net...

Concerning all the 'weird' animal references...I don't know...maybe there were some strange things back in the day???

After all we discover a new species about every 6 months right?


I'll get back with you on the other stuff later...I've got a lot of mail to answer here...

Thanks so much for your thought-provoking comments...

OT appreciates you!