The Myth of the All Forgiving God.

Nowhere in the Bible does it say that God is all forgiving,yet it seems to have become part of Christian doctrine.

I,for one,think its about time that this belief is permanently got rid of because its untrue and it contradicts what the Bible teaches us.


There is one sin that no amount of repenting will save you from,and that is the Unforgivable Sin/the Eternal Sin.

If such a sin exists then logic dictates that God is not all forgiving.



This leads to the question,if God is not all forgiving does that mean he is not all loving? (another concept not found within the Bible.)

Can an all loving,morally good and perfect being leave someone to the fate of eternal damnation,when,in some cases,the only thing they are guilty of is the Unforgivable Sin?

(I say only thing because if we bring the 20th century poster child for insanity,Hitler,into this,we have this scenario;Hitler believed in God,his actions in this life means his destination in the next life is a foregone conclusion....unless;as the end of WW2 was drawing near,he sincerly repented for all that he had done and he begged God for forgiveness....after such a thing would he remain in hell? Not according to the teachings of the Bible.)



Humans can only commit a finite amount of sin,yet hell is an infinite punishment.Eternal punishment is not compatible with omnibenevolence.

God likes to mess with people IMO, like killing most the world in the flood, or sending people to massacre innocents. That's mostly OT stuff though, he doesn't seem so evil in the NT.

I think it's probably the case that God is not very forgiving, just Jesus was.

In the Old Testament, God forgives, but always at a price. In the New Testament, Jesus is the price. In the New Testament, Christ states "There is only one unforgivable sin; blasphemy against the Holy Spirit." Mark 3:29. It is also referernced in Matthew and Luke.

The tennet is that God hates the Sin but Loves The Sinner. Therefore God can be all loving, and forgive all sins, except that one.

Of course to accept this, you have to believe that Jesus is both God and man.

The tennet is that God hates the Sin but Loves The Sinner. Therefore God can be all loving, and forgive all sins, except that one.

Can you condemn someone you love to eternal punishment??

Standing back and letting someone make mistakes etc isn't the same scale as eternal damnation.

I think people make a mistake by making up definitions of God. We put Him inside our own limitations and God just does not fit.

I think people make a mistake by making up definitions of God. We put Him inside our own limitations and God just does not fit.

Hi there.

Very true.But we can't think of it any other way,can we?
We are human,therefore we think like a human.

We picture God as we won't him to be.

reply to post by jakyll

after such a thing would he remain in hell? Not according to the teachings of the Bible

If I am correct there are two unforgiveable sins - not believing and suicide...

So, whether he saw the proverbial light at the end, it wouldn't matter - he offed himself - so due diligence went out the door.

Kinda sick how a twisted institution such as christianity and catholicism maintain their membership levels through the the threat of eternal damnation if you do not buy into their program.

That's some rough telemarketing...

As far as im concerned, nature is our god, something most of us can agree on im sure. Obviously we are all subject to its laws, it dictates our lives on so many levels, its the very thing that made everything possible.

But, even the collective intelligence of the scientific community struggles to understand the very nature of the thing that gave rise to all that we could ever experience, imagine or know.

Too many people work against nature, but nature seems to be very forgiving, but can also be very harsh on us. I think, if we push nature too far she will push back, tenfold and some more!

When i was a child, i was brought up as an atheist with the understanding that religion was a means to control the masses through fear. I couldnt understand why there were so many different religions fighting against each other in the name of "god". How very sad that people feel that "god" would appreciate the suffering and slaughtering of its own children

But, even if the biblical god were a reality, it from my point of view would appear to be very forgiving (if it even knows of our presence, the universe after all, is unimaginably huge), otherwise we would have been erased from the universe long ago, dont you think? but clearly we are all here still making the same mistakes as we have made since the beginning of our known history.

I doubt i will live to see the day that we can all agree or at least, all get along, let alone working with nature as opposed to aginast her.

/end of rambling

chapter29.

If I am correct there are two unforgiveable sins - not believing and suicide...

The Catholics have tried to make suicide a sin by saying that the person cannot repent for it....they forget that the just and unjust will be resurrected and will have a chance to repent at that time.

Kinda sick how a twisted institution such as christianity and catholicism maintain their membership levels through the the threat of eternal damnation if you do not buy into their program.

It sure is!
And i don't think i've read that part where Jesus went around preaching hell and damnation.




enduser.

As far as im concerned, nature is our god

Nature is important,but one god faiths don't seem to realize this.









[edit on 4-10-2008 by jakyll]

reply to post by jakyll



lol nature is important? its the most important thing there is for without it, we are nothing, literally!

reply to post by jakyll

And i don't think i've read that part where Jesus went around preaching hell and damnation.

You thought correctly - at least in regards to the above quote...

My comment was in regards to the institution itself...you must have missed that, but hey, cool...

My comment was in regards to the institution itself...you must have missed that, but hey, cool...

I didn't miss it.
The institution is supposedly founded on the teachings of Jesus so therefore my statement is relevant.

reply to post by enduser

lol nature is important? its the most important thing there is for without it, we are nothing, literally!

I was meaning more from a spiritual point of view.
My own fault for not explaining.

Thanks for clarifying

anyway, if the kingdom of heaven can be found within, wouldnt that make heaven and god already part of you? im probably way off the mark though so please correct me

one of the strange things ive never understood, why do catholics symbolically eat the flesh of christ and drink his blood? seems rather sick to me. and why are so many religions fixated with material wealth? whilst in london i saw a priest or bishop (god only knows which one it was) wearing a gold cross larger than some gangster rappers bling. crazy world we live in, or should i say, crazy humans.


[edit on 4-10-2008 by enduser]

reply to post by jakyll

I didn't miss it.
The institution is supposedly founded on the teachings of Jesus so therefore my statement is relevant.

Supposedly?!?!

You don't have much faith in your...faith.

So, you're stating that this institution based their teachings on a carpenters philosophies...the same institution that meedles in government affairs, has a major problem with its 'employees' molesting children, hoardes fortunes rather than share the wealth with its Flock....

Ya, I bet da' man would be quite proud of what he started...

Hypocrisy seems to fit both your beloved institution as well as yourself.

Supposedly?!?!
You don't have much faith in your...faith.

The institution i meant is Catholicism,not Christianity.

So, you're stating that this institution based their teachings on a carpenters philosophies...the same institution that meedles in government affairs, has a major problem with its 'employees' molesting children, hoardes fortunes rather than share the wealth with its Flock....

This is Catholicism.

Hypocrisy seems to fit both your beloved institution as well as yourself.

I'm not a Catholic.

reply to post by enduser

anyway, if the kingdom of heaven can be found within, wouldnt that make heaven and god already part of you? im probably way off the mark though so please correct me

It would.Some Christians believe this and have done from the very beginning.

one of the strange things ive never understood, why do catholics symbolically eat the flesh of christ and drink his blood?

They say its a symbol of his sacrafice.Though personally i think that there's a lot've misunderstanding regarding that practice,and the meaning behind it.

and why are so many religions fixated with material wealth? whilst in london i saw a priest or bishop (god only knows which one it was) wearing a gold cross larger than some gangster rappers bling.

Lol.
Have you noticed they'll tell you the exact opposite?

Think of how much money the Vatican has,then add to it all the antiques,the priceless works of art,the statues etc.It boggles the mind that they say they don't care for material things.


Church of England is no better.
The Archbishop of Canterbury lives in Lambeth Palace.Its not as grand as the Vatican but its still a slap in the face to Jesus.







[edit on 4-10-2008 by jakyll]

There is no Hell. The only sense that it exists is metaphorical. We are right now the furthest we'll ever get from God. We can't sense him in the world. If there was a Hell though, we'd have a sense that he does exist which means we'd be closer to God in Hell than on Earth in a sense, which pretty much negates the point of view of the existence of Hell.

[edit on 4-10-2008 by ghaleon12]

[edit on 4-10-2008 by ghaleon12]

reply to post by enduser



I like what you posted about nature and God. What if our nature, in its purest form, shows the nature of God. Is this the nature of love?

I feel there is a great deception that has happened to the masses, in believing God is this Father who reguired blood of animals ect....

I think the bad things here in this world are just as important as the good. When someone does someone wrong, God is not seeing through the wrong doers eyes, but through the victims eyes. I see it like a sifting through the light and dark and the light is what is going to sift through. I think God gave us our conciousness not only to weigh our own bads from goods but also to weigh the nature of what God is.

Good post. God did create us in his image. Love (bestowal) is the quality of God. An important rule is love thy neighbor as thyself, but it isn't meant on an external level but on an internal level. The "bad things" in the world are sometimes represented as the black letters on a solid white (being good) backgound. From the contrast between black and white, we can gain better understanding.