10/03/08 - Will the House Sell Out Today?

There are claims that they have 9 of the nays from the original Bill switched to yays as of last night. The spread needed was only 12 votes apparently (even though the spread on the original vote was slightly higher).

The question is have any yays turned to nays? No reports on that.

A large part of the switched votes seem to be based on "little"? items put in the Bill to sweeten the pot. Care to see some of these?

Deal Sweeteners

There are also some four dozen small provisions. Among them, with projected costs over 10 years:

-Extending an expired provision that gives Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands a rebate against excise taxes charged on imported rum. The rebate, at $13.50 per proof gallon, has been in effect since 1999. The cost is $192 million.

-Establishing a new tax credit ranging from $2,500 to $7,500 for purchasers of plug-in electric-drive vehicles. Cost: $758 million.

-Extending tax credits that expired at the end of 2007 for certain domestic corporations involved in American Samoa economic development. Cost: $33 million.

There are more - look at the article.

Some of them are downright insulting pork, ultimately just extending our debt further.

Is it enough to pass the Bill? Have you had enough yet?

If this passes, instead of a real fiscally responsible solution to our financial crisis, I think it will be the saddest day in the history of the US. It will also be the scariest event of my lifetime. I am so sick of this.

In a poll last week I stated my Presidential vote would go for the lesser of two evils. however I have no intention of voting for anyone who voted yes on this Bill, whether they are facing election today or tomorrow - I will not forget. When this is over, I print the list of the yays and use it now and the next time around.

Unfortunately both of the Presidential Candidates voted yes in the Senate this week. I have always considered voting outside of the major parties to be a throw away vote, because that's all it is, since not enough people will do the same, but I'm doing it this time anyway this time.

I've absolutely had it with this farce of a govenment that TOTALLY ignores their constituents.

If no vote occurs today then there is still hope, because they will only go to a vote if they have the votes. If this gets voted on by noon, then it was a done deal before it was debated.

REMEMBER forever who sold us out. Many of us who contacted our Reps and Presidential Candidates told them a Yes vote will get them a pink slip. Many are not even facing the ballot - not this year, but we have to make sure we follow through, now and in the next election. If we don't follow through and get them the hey out of office, our voices will never be taken seriously EVER, and they apparently aren't now. There is only one way to take our Country back, but will the follow through (vote them out) actually happen? I'm losing faith in our ability to stop the blackmail, only November will tell if the House reneges on us today.

The message has been made clear - this bailout is toilet paper and we want an economically viable piece of legislation passed - not this garbage. Still, no one has made a move to introduce a plan that works (even though they have been presented with options from Economists and Noble Laureates to consider. Even if this Bill fails again today, will someone be able to get something on the floor of value, will they finally get it - that htey have to start from scratch and do this right? It's not looking good.

It wont pass before the opening of the markets in 1.5hrs time.

And guess what day it is today? Yup... first day of short-selling being legal again.

The markets are going to tank hard today.

After it tanks hard, it wont matter whether this waste of time bill passes or not, I think Bush will be declaring a state of economic emergency. This would be tantamount to fiscal martial law.

reply to post by 44soulslayer


Actually that short selling ban is an interesting point. Had it not been in place, some market pumping would have been seen due to people covering shorts. Short selling is part of what kept the market with checks and balances (a bit too involved for me to explain fully). But I am not quite sure what we will see today, and I find it odd they would let it expire today, since the Bill is still out.

I wonder if we might see a last minute extension of it this morning.

I was listening to a pretty politically motivated Irish radio station just a few minutes ago, they mentioned about the US bailout and how ridiculously easy it was to buy the votes of the US senators.

One senator was bought by being promised large tax refunds on one of his company's products - Plastic arrows that are used as a part of some toy!!!!

They said that this is a very common occurrence in the US senate and Congress.

WTF!!?????

Buying votes in parliament? How can this be legal??

reply to post by Relentless


Ah that would be the logical step if one assumes that the government actually has the people's best interests at heart

Sadly, I very much doubt that.

I agree that short selling is a natural part of the markets. I found it bizarre that they banned it! In effect, they are preventing people from buying post-dated shares while selling the same. They're actually inhibiting the normal flow of wealth... hence the clot we are in now

What I worry about is that they mentioned yesterday that the bailout was made "more appealing" to republicans buy giving tax breaks to large corp... What if the republican congressmen want to make a point that they do not vote on something because it has corp. tax breaks in it.. Kinda like making a point.

I don't know how to feel about this bailout. At first I thought it was a bad idea..Still do. But I worry what will happen if we get another rejection from congress..this is all so confusing. It feels like a lose lose IMO

It feels like a lose lose IMO

I looks like a lose lose from here as well.

More power and less fallibility for the Fed, a drop in the USD, a large taxpayer bill AND a large quantity of the money will be going abroad.

i may be wrong, but there was an extension of the short sell ban until the 14th of Oct. ~from the news blurbs i've heard over the week~
The formal 30 extension has not been officially passed, yet



50-50 is the odds of passing.
GWBush himself was said to be lobbying a number of lawmakers,
lobbying is a nice, sanitized way of saying (......?......).
Now if the Commander-in-Chief goes out of this way to single out individuals -> one can bet that the outcome will be different this vote tally


~~~~~~~~~~~~

The SEC said the measures --- due to expire on Thursday night - -
would now last until the third business day after the $700bn plan to rescue the financial system is enacted into law,
in any case, no later than October 17.

read on site; republic broadcasting. org, dtd 2 Oct '08


so the short selling opportunity is extended to the 17th
& not the 14th as i said earlier,
thanks,



[edit on 3-10-2008 by St Udio]

It doesn't look to good for the taxpayers today. They have had every bank and financial firm lobbyist, foreign and domestic, working hard and dropping insane cash on the House since it failed.

Chamber threatens anti-bailout members

Also, we know that the amount of fear being used against them is staggering.

Brad Sherman Video

A lot of the fools, voting yes, have bought into this bailout plan. Even with their constituents and fellow representatives telling them its going to foreign banks.

Add to the mix, this news this morning...

California may need 7 billion dollar loan

and I think this bailout will pass.

I'm taking the day off to keep pressure on, for all the good it will do.

edit-spelling due to lack of coffee

[edit on 3-10-2008 by Lurkerzrule]

reply to post by St Udio


Ah thanks for the update. That kinda crushes my theory for the mode of implementation... I wonder if the broader conspiracy still stands?

I heard one of our congressmen has called for Paulson's resignation, but he also stated he was probably going to vote for the bill today. He said there's really no other choice. Sounds like you didn't work hard enough for another choice, congressman.

Another of our congressmen (as of yesterday evening) was standing firm against the bill.

Both are up for re-election.

If i understand it correctly they are voting on the bill right now.

unfortunatley Sky News is not having a running tally vote as far as ive seen so i guess we will have to wait and see after the 15 mins are up. My gut tells me this vote is going to pass, looks like Bush and his buddies have twisted enough arms to get this bill passed.


Sratch that they do have a running tally going on sky news

Scratch it again they are not voting on the bill just yet......Man i need more coffee.
[edit on 10/3/0808 by Trayen11]

[edit on 10/3/0808 by Trayen11]

Originally posted by Relentless

In a poll last week I stated my Presidential vote would go for the lesser of two evils.

Am I the only person who understands that this line of thinking is totally flawed and is part of the problem?

If people continue to vote for the lesser of two evils, why would you expect life to get any better? All you are really doing is prolonging the agony. Which would you prefer...pulling the bandaid off quickly or slowly? In the end it makes no difference, it still kinda hurts.

I also have never understood the logic behind a vote for a 3rd party candidate is a vote wasted. Why is that? Because you didnt back a winner? Because the other kids didnt do it too? A think a vote for a 3rd party candidate is a sign and signal. The more people that look outside the 2 parties sends a clear message that we have figured out the scam and will not tolerate it anymore. It doesnt matter if that Candidate does not win, its about sending a message. Let's be real.... chances are even if a 3rd party Candidate DID win the Popular vote, he would not win the Office of President. By hook or by crook, TPTB would never allow it. If the clear cases of voter fraud in 2000 and 2004 did not send you that message, then maybe it's time to look back and learn the lessons we have already been taught by our captors.

I suppose we will find out what the vote is after the market closes today.

I am still blown away about the whole thing. I understand why they would want the bail out. I understand their point. STILL, it is not our job to bail them out. This is obsurd.

I'm calling my Reps (who voted yes last time, unlike both Senators who actually voted no), but I expect it to pass. If the market rallies hard on this passage ( I think it will but there is no guarantee), people should use the opportunity to get out of it. Most 401ks have at least one money market fund (which are now insured to some level) which would be a safer place to hide for the time being.

I really don't see how if it passes it could be anything but bad for the dollar. Sure the can will be kicked down the road, but it will have even more sand in it next time. The size of thes interventions are increasing while the period of stabillity between them is increasing. I'm sure that they are hoping that this willextend the day of reckoning beyond the election, but there are no guarantees that it will.

I think what most disturbs me about this bill is that it allows foreign banks direct access to the US taxpayer. There is not enough being said about that and that is a travesty if not treasonous.

ALL US Representatives are up for reelection in Nov., and a fair amount of Senators are as well. Due to partisanship in drawing up districts most US Reps are in "safe" districts however, a 10% swing would unseat almost all of them. There has never been a better time to take off partisan blinders and vote against an incumbent if they supported this bill. Representatives only serve two year terms and districts will be redrawn after the 2010 Census anyway.