Why America needs a depression (instead of bailout)

I know alot of you have said this before, and i am here to agree with you.

America needs a depression now , more than a bailout.

I know no one enjoys a depression, but the cold hard truth of the matter remains, that we have followed unsound economic policies as a nation that have led us into this calamity.

Our two options have been simple.

1) Allow the market to correct itself, thus causing a SHORT TERM depression ; short term meaning 6months to 2years.

2) Bail out failed institutions causing SHORT TERM stock market rallys, lasting 6 months to 2 years.

?) Why is a short term depression better than a short term stock rally?

A) Because the depression is inevitable, market forces are in imbalance and are threatening to correct themselves. The bail out is a half-arsed attempt to correct those imbalanced forces.

If we continue to "buy more time" , when this depression finally sets in, after X amount of "bailouts" , it will be far far worse in its scope than anything we are facing now.

Think of the analogy, if you bottle up your emotions, eventually you will explode (and it wont be pretty for anyone). In contrast, if you just let them out naturally, you will be fine.

This "bailout", and others that will come soon like it, is simply just bottling the problem up. But as time goes by, the problems intensity will increase, and once it does escape that bottle, there will be hell to pay.

On the bright side, if we just take a hit, and go thru this MILD SHORT TERM depression like rational sensable people, we can SOLVE this current situation.

But, this is not the end of "cleaning up" the economy. Not even close. We are just fixing the latest problem caused by these people.

To solve the problem in its entireity, we have to address several major problems.
1) Get rid of FED
2) Scale back govt spending
3) Rewrite ALL the financial laws (in the favor of common sense)
4) Arrest those who got us in this mess and try them in court.
5) Add your own suggestions here.

But those issues are for TOMORROW , as TODAY we must make the tough choice that faces us.
Accept a mild short term depression, in return for a healthy booming economy in the future.

The alternative is far worse, taking a short term boom right now, and when it busts, either face a BIGGER bailout, or an even worse Depression/Recession.

As it stands now , if we skip the bailout and let depression hit, there will most certainly still be FOOD at the Grocery Store. And jobs will still exist.

If we bail them out, down the road in a few years, I cannot garuntee that the Depression will be mild and short term.
If this situation escalates over the next few years, I warn you clearly that there may not be food in the store, or jobs down the street.

This is a very important thing we must all think long and hard about.

Bite your tounge, and accept the mild depression with a smile. For we are saving our children from ever going thru this mess by refusing to PROLONG it.

I now step off the soapbox. Ty for listening.

reply to post by muzzleflash


But the powers in charge might get their asses thrown out or locked up if a depression were allowed to happen and a large number of the population become enraged at the government.

There has got to be a reason why nearly half of Congress wants a bailout but 75%+ of Americans are opposed.

Voting yes for a bail out means you'll have bread,
but you lose your Freedom.

Voting no for the bail out means
you'll have Freedom, and no bread..

I'll take Freedom anyday...
Besides..Bread's not good for you anymore..
I agree with your post!

Survival of the fittest is all i gotta say...

Some people here in America don't want to live (suicidal ones), lets have a year of depression so the strong can do what they can, maybe not.

the reasons why Congress attempted to push this bill on us are manyfold.

I will try to at least list a few reasons. Some hard fact, some speculative.

1) They wanna cover up the mess they created.
2) They get kick backs and personal favors from those institutions saved.
3) The international bankers want to consolidate control of economic assets
4) They may not understand the economy and actually think a bail out is the best bet
5) List anything u can think of here.

The reasons why the bill , in its current form, did not pass today.

1) America is fed up
2) their phones are ringing off the hook
3) when they pick up the phone all they hear is screaming and cusswords
4) They are scared of not getting re-elected
5) Add your ideas here.

and Yes, those in charge must have their assets confiscated , and be tried in a court of law and judged by the people, and possibly convicted and thrown in federal prison --->granted we can prove them guilty

Yes we need a depression to create a sense of empowerment unto the people, so they may rise up and cleanse this govt of its demons.

Well things just about HAVE to fall apart for there to be a new way created to live on this planet in a more diverse economy, with a more green/clean energy bent. Maybe this is exactly the impetus needed.....humans are smart enough to figure this out and I for one dare to have hope.


Take a look at this emergency food supply from costco
www.costco.com...
Looking very good to me.....


[edit on 29-9-2008 by theRiverGoddess]

As they say, "What goes up must come down"

Well, the govt' keeps pushing it up up up, so it will never go down agian.

Sad fact of reality is, the higher you keep pushing it up, the harder its gonna crash when it finally comes down.

I am only suggesting we let it go down, and accept a short term depression.

I garuntee in our current state of existance, when this depression hits , Taco Bell will still sell burritos and tacos for 89cents.

Your job at Walmart will still exist.

This is not a Full Scale Economic Melt down - YET

if we keep pushing this bubble up up up and away , it will become a Full Scale Worldwide Economic Meltdown within 5 to 10 years.

When it finally does crash, we are gonna starve. Because Taco Bell and Walmart will go under too.

But right now - we are safe to take a depression and hedge our bets on dismantling the FED and related govt' legistlation that got us in this boat in the first place.

Thanks for your comments all, economics is really a fun subject to talk about. Im glad others are interested

Originally posted by theRiverGoddess
Well things just about HAVE to fall apart for there to be a new way created to live on this planet in a more diverse economy, with a more green/clean energy bent. Maybe this is exactly the impetus needed.....humans are smart enough to figure this out and I for one dare to have hope.

[edit on 29-9-2008 by theRiverGoddess]

Perhaps you are correct River, for I myself cannot think of "A better place, or a better Time" to deal with these things than "Now".

I like you, Dare to have hope.

I have faith in the good of mankind, to triumph over the evil.

What else is a decent human being to think?

There is one good outcome of a possible "depression" (I'm from Ireland,we're in official recession,so same goes..)such a happening will make this whiny ungrateful,gimmie gimmie,oh woe is me,pussy ass generation take some stock,get some perspective,realise what a real problem is(and NO its not the fact that your order at coffee shop was mixed up!) and finally turn such boys and girls into REAL men and women!!

This statement is something coming from a 21 yr old female,I'm sick and tired of my generation,95% of them are an embarrassment to the rest of us.

We got a booklet of coupons from local supermarket through letterbox the other day,WHAT!?sure i was only a youngin when such things took place (80s in Ireland....*shudder*)I'm a celtic tiger cub,such a thing shouldnt be taking place!

Irelands Celtic tiger ain't a purrin' anymore and the mess that the good ol' U.S has gotten into...Damn that just makes me wanna weep!

but you know what, suck it up beeyotches! Ain't nothin a certainty in life,let alone your goddamn beloved bank balances.

I'm off to cut out some milk tokens,if i'm in a good mood i may consider giving away some butter vouchers,can't say i ain't generous!

And yes i have just drank close to an entire bottle of wine, 3.99 at LIDL's, who am i to pass up a bargain!

The funny thing is that a depression won't hurt the poor as much as you might think.The poor are use to doing with less,therefore they can handle it better.The wealthy however will be the ones to really suffer.Living a lifestyle where money is no object will be a memory for most of the rich. I could just see the rich folks sharing a can of beans...

We need this depression to weed out the weak components of our economy.Maybe just maybe people would get interested in becomming more interdependent in this country.If you can't afford to import it,learn to make it at home.Create jobs and build a real economy!!!

Originally posted by daddyroo45
The funny thing is that a depression won't hurt the poor as much as you might think.The poor are use to doing with less,therefore they can handle it better.

This is true.....people living on the edge already dont have very far to jump.....

Its the lawyers in the long run that will feel the hurt of what changes will come as I see it.......well and the elite, no matter how well they have cushioned their nests they are going to be horrified by the change.

Dan Tanna said once......"that is is much easier to punish and rich person than a poor one, and it is much easier to reward those who have nothing"........and I see the genius of such a philosophy....

What the bankers and all that will gain with this bill will not tell the people i that the markets will fix themselves eventually, but the big financial corrupted institutions that make this mess will have to compromised and many will not make it.

For us the regular tax payer and hard working American life will be just as usual.

If you can not afford something with hard cash then you do not need a loan to buy it.

So at the end we will come stronger and more independent out of this economical crisis that in reality is the crisis of the bankers.

Originally posted by justAgirlSmartererThanU

And yes i have just drank close to an entire bottle of wine, 3.99 at LIDL's, who am i to pass up a bargain!

hey, let's see if you have endurance,

yee haw, from the independent republic of Horry county, south carolina

I am OK with a depression but not OK with complete and total sociatal collapse! I hate the bail out and do not think it will work anyways so either way I am screwed so at least without the bail out I am screwed but I owe less...

I'm more of a lurker here than a poster, but this post really struck a chord in me. Like you, I've accepted the fact that we will probably end up in a short term depression period and I've prepared for it as much as I can financially.

Originally posted by muzzleflash

To solve the problem in its entireity, we have to address several major problems.
1) Get rid of FED
2) Scale back govt spending
3) Rewrite ALL the financial laws (in the favor of common sense)
4) Arrest those who got us in this mess and try them in court.
5) Add your own suggestions here.

But those issues are for TOMORROW , as TODAY we must make the tough choice that faces us.
Accept a mild short term depression, in return for a healthy booming economy in the future.

My next suggestion would be for all of the politicians to defer their salaries for five years to "bail out" the economy. This would include their pension plans as well.

Each of those congresspeople should have voted "no" today because it was not in American's best interest and it was NOT what Americans wanted. Since those that voted "yes" seemed so eager to save our economy, perhaps they should make the ultimate sacrifice.... their own money.

Originally posted by wutone
reply to post by muzzleflash

 

There has got to be a reason why nearly half of Congress wants a bailout but 75%+ of Americans are opposed.

Very well put and I think you just nailed it! Think about what our government has become. Laws for everything. Government has grown and grown until they consider themselves to be our caretakers. Individuals are no longer trusted with the smallest amount of common sense - the seat belt law is a prime example. We must be insulated from everything including knowledge of what's really going on itself.

We have become a micro-managed, spoon-fed, skirt-tugging society. Big Brother has become Big Momma to Americans - always there to take care of the skinned knee.

Today, I listened to Nancy Pelosi talk again of the need to insulate Americans from this crisis and take care of the middle class. Governments role was never intended to be the care-takers. That mentality is exactly what got us in this mess. Have you noticed that every message is aimed at the middle class which most people agree hasn't existed in close to a decade. Being low-income, working class isn't even chic anymore. It has become the unmentionable class it seems.

The poor will survive as mentioned above. They/we are used to doing without. A return to focusing on needs and being able to separate those from wants will honestly make us a more satisfied society. This instant gratification, me first, what's next lifestyle - is showing itself to be exactly what it is - an unfulfilling, never satiated, moving on down the road, never look back emptiness inside every person that won't go away. We are separated by what we have - not by what we don't. Strangely depression may be the only path to happiness and joy.

Great thread....now who would have 'thunk' we might actually have to fight 'for' a depression to fix this problem.

Do the right thing. Vote for the depression.

Hard times always focus peoples attitudes. A better America will emerge from the ashes. The wealthy and inbred elitist blood suckers will die and that's just too freakin bad.


[edit on 29-9-2008 by In nothing we trust]

reply to post by In nothing we trust



Yikes your scaring me man...person...mate......(does this count as a second line as I was responding to INWT.......)


[edit on 29-9-2008 by theRiverGoddess]

I was taken by quite a bout of introspection today as I watched the MSM reporters panic and histrionics after the bailout failed. This is really about so very much more than the value of one's 401K or stocks. It's really about the need for both the government and for many of the people in America to experience a radical shift in priorities. We've all lost touch with the things that are truly important in life - friends, family, pets. We're all so busy trying to get ahead or just get by that our loved ones go neglected much of the time. I'm hoping that this "financial armageddon" as the MSM fearmongers call it, turns out to be an opportunity for all of us to regain our appreciation of what's truly important.

5. the only problem with a depression is it needs a large scale war to pull us out of it and as we are already involved in a 92billion dollar war i do not see how we would be able to pull ourselves out. i mean look how many great jobs this war has created for the american economy oh yeah None so wish for the depression and then wish for a full scale world war 4