Do You Believe Our Military Would Not Defend The American People?

reply to post by Mcloud313


There was a time, not too long ago, when I would have plastered that little disclaimer "of course they ALL arent like this" all through that post. No, they all wont behave so badly. But the few that will behave so badly will find friends in the uniform who will defend them. Those friends will find more. And before you know it it's the minority who would stand against the corruption. I've lived under more than one corrupt police presence that despite all the evidence and all the eventual convictions just kept on beating the drum of excuses and insisting what they had done was "right" then the convicted theiving cops, raping cops, murdering cops, retire with full pensions paid for by the very people they robed, raped and murdered. Maybe being a certain age when the feds shot Vicki in the head shaped my current outlook. Maybe watching so many cheer when millions were spent on SWAT teams to capture an old man and his wife for not paying the taxes that fund the security forces that assaulted them upset me a little. Maybe having an enlisted man give me @#$% for not thinking having my rifles taken away from me was the best idea since allowing him to keep his opened my eyes a little bit.

I'm tired of the PC standard "not ALL are like whatever." I'll start saying "I suppose there may be a few who wouldn't be so cruel" as I have learned that fits much better.

Another thing I've learned is that the more you just want to be left alone. To not bother anyone and not to be bothered yourself. The more likely it seems you are to be beaten, arrested or killed by some branch of law enforcement.

[edit on 30-9-2008 by thisguyrighthere]

reply to post by Critical_Mass


Thanks for the support! People have been so supportive of our troops. It's hard to believe that the ones who motivate us to accomplish our missions would be harmed intentionally in any way by us.

I totally agree with about the police. I'm only 50 miles away from you in a violent section of Flint. I see corrupt police officers on a daily basis. I know a few that have quit the force because of the politics involved.

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


Let's settle this right now! I never once said your rifles should be taken away. What ever you own will be grandfathered in. From my knowledge the ban also doesn't stop you from purchasing rifles from other owners. Just halts the purchasing of new Automatic Weapons limiting to how many are in the public. I was not giving you crap, simply giving my opinion. You started tearing up and turned it into a personal explosion.

If the US Government were to declare war on its citizens, sort of like Martial Law, they'd use mercenaries like Blackwater to push the people around.

Only thing is, our amazingly proud boys and girls in our military HATE blackwater and their security croonies.

If Martial law ever broke out we'd have our National Guard and Military on our side, and the Government would be using the blackwater #stains to fight us.

Regardless, we have the 2nd amendment, and more guns than any other industrialized nation. Make friends with the dude down your street that has a gun rack on his pickup truck.

reply to post by TheHunted


You understand economics? The end result is only the very rich will be able to get their hands on these things. You might not be outright pulling them from my hands but you're making it impossible to repair them, find replacement parts, and purchase others. It is essentially taking them off of the market. To remove them from the market then tell me it doesnt affect me it all because I can still "theoretically" get them even though their value would more than quadruple is the most insulting thing of all. It's like telling a New Yorker that he can get a pistol permit. He just needs a team of lawyers and a few thousand dollars but, hey, he can get one.

You're either clueless to the reality of the situation or you think everyone else is too dumb to understand so it doesn't matter.

You hand over that shotgun yet? If it saves just one life after all.

reply to post by TheHunted


The reasoning for the military is to protect it's country's people and land. It's the paranoid people that seem to believe everything is out to get them and all good has gone bad while evil prevails in ways that make no sense to a normal person due to the fact these paranoia's are looking and thinking of any reason they can to pass their paranoid virus onto others.


[edit on 30-9-2008 by Tomis_Nexis]

I think the question of the military being used against American civilians comes from people viewing the military as just another extension of the government, which is distrusted more and more as time passes. They (the gov't) have been caught in lies to get the people to approve of some action they want to take time after time. What would stop them from creating some false crisis or threat to keep the military in line with their plans? The military is just a cross section of our society and, unfortunately, the average person on the street just isn't that intelligent. That's not an attack on the military, just an observation of society in general.

I don't believe, nor do I think most others believe, that our military is made up of mindless robots that would kill their brother on command. They, however, wouldn't likely be near their friends or family. In a standoff it would only take one stupid act on either side to cause a real ugly situation. Civilians who stood up to the government would be labeled as traitors, rebels, or outright terrorists.

Once again, I don't think the military would just come in guns a blazin' but one stupid act, whether real or set up, could easily escalate and become real bad real fast. I think that is what peoples concerns are.

The question is ... will the military make a distinction between a real traitor/terrorist and a true patriot trying to defend his family and constitution against an oppressive government/organization?

Originally posted by TheHunted
As a vet I don't understand why many believe that they would fight against citizens if given orders. How many people believe this and why?

Domestic threats include the NWO and our Government.

yours is a great question - I've been wondering if it would ever show up here

so many threads about "the powers that be" rolling over the people unopposed

I've always thought - if it ever actually came to that - they'd have to fight their way through their very own armed forces first

I think there would be a split - and it would be ugly - not everyone will see things the same way

but, the military is not any more mindless than the citizenry - and they are also citizens

I read in a book titled "On Killing" about the battle of Gettysburg and rifles that were picked up afterwords that had been loaded as many as 18 times without being fired. The soldiers on both sides would go through the motions of loading and firing without pulling the trigger. These men could stand face to face with bullets flying, but couldn't fire on a fellow countryman. There was thousands of weapons found after the battle in this state. There has been incidents where the military has been called on and did shoot civilians, but they were being fired on by the civilians. What scares me is the mercenaries. These guys are from all over the world, and some of them are giving the orders.

Soldiers are taught to be loyal to their COs and never question (civilian atrocities in Iraq and also prison camps bear this truth out). My dad as a WW II vet would always repeat the slogan that was drilled into him, "Yours is to do or die, but never question why!" That is scary sh**T!

reply to post by TheHunted


But you are the bad guy and everyone here knows it.

You would not come to help but to plunder, rape and destroy just like is being done in Iraq.

We are not Iraqis and we will not stand there while you have "fun" with our loved ones.

I would rather kill every last one of you than give up my guns or be separated from my family and put in one of your camps.

I know I will die fighting you but I will die for a good cause while you will die for evil.

You are all for the most part evil and sick.

I was 11Bravo 15 years ago and I served overseas.

I worked at Ground Zero and know what your kind did then.

Your kind have taken my lungs but not my spirit

I know how things work.

You have failed us by letting this scum destroy our Constitution and our economy.

Regardless of what you think Americans will not stand by while you rape
our Wives, Mothers and Children like was done in abu ghraib.

Most people I know are hiding their guns from your kind as I write this.

The next time they will be seen is when they are pointed at those who would violate our most valued freedoms and rights, AKA you.

You want to redeem yourselves ?

Go to Washington and use all your bullets there and then the people will know they can count on you.

I know that most of you will be to cowardly to do this but the ones that join us will be held in high regard.

I hope it does not come to this but something tells me that it will.

Do I believe US Forces would turn their guns on American Citizens.
In a word.
Yes.
Just look at how the police *turn* on people like wild dogs.
The Military?
Trained to kill?
Taught it's right?
You bet your spit shined boots I do.

Oh...
Do I support *Our* troups?
You bet I do.
When their guns are pointed at someone else.


...taps...



[edit on 30-9-2008 by silo13]

two things i want to put in here. First off, taking new orleans citizens was a crime, as there was rampant looting and robbing going on, and there were NO police to respond, as phones largely were not working either. So here we have massive criminal looting, and robbery, and we are taking away the peoples ONLY defense. The guard was there, yes, but they didnt respond to housecalls for robberies.
As to who would people think the military would support the government against the citizens.....thats because they have historically. All through our history the police and military have been sent in against the local populations during protests, riots, labor strikes, fights for equal rights, sufferage, everything that we claim makes us great as americans was taken in direct conflict with the police, the military, and the bankers and business owners. Women fighting for equal rights and sufferage were fired on, killed, imprisoned by the military and police. African americans fighting for equal rights and freedom were fired on, imprisoned, and beaten by the military and police. Labor workers fighting for humane work conditions in a time where factories where responsible for massive death and disease were fired on, killed, and imprisoned by the military and police. Students protesting wars have been fired on, killed, and imprisoned by the military and police. Its all there in our history. Now, of course, there are, then and now, soldiers on the other side of the line too! But we all know which ones are firing the bullets. We all know which ones are doing the imprisonment. The sad fact is that in our country, the ones who oppress are always the tigers with claws and teeth, whereas the ones DEFENDING the people are always the declawed old tabbies.

Originally posted by Maxmars
Take 100 soldiers from Wisconsin, assign them to secure a water treatment facility in Alabama. When scores of thirsty people come storming over the hill to get water by force, do you THINK the 1st Lieutenant is gong to stop and say, "Hey fellas, let these citizens through."?

No, they will be told who IS and who ISN'T an enemy combatant; and that line has been virtually erased over the last 8 years. [/quote

Wow,
Great post! Quite a few of the significant happenings over the last 8 years have struck fear in the average american and this analogy by Maxmars really sums it up. This is why some americans belive nothing that the powers that be or the media feed them.

Folks keep saying that soldiers are brain washed. I must inform you they still know right from wrong. You can't assume that because they have been trained by the government that they will everything instilled in them by their parents.

Originally posted by TheHunted
Folks keep saying that soldiers are brain washed. I must inform you they still know right from wrong. You can't assume that because they have been trained by the government that they will everything instilled in them by their parents.

From your posts I gather right = safe soldiers and wrong = free Americans?

You said yourself that lady was a threat and they had no choice because their safety was at stake.

Tell me what right is and what wrong is.

I've asked 2 friends that are in the military. Both said basically the same thing. They would hope that military personal would reject any orders to harm an American citizen, but a lot would still follow orders since it's instilled in the brain to follow orders no matter what. I found that kind of worrisome.

I sure hope that military personal would do the right thing and turn and fight for the Constitution and our rights if anything major would happen. Most do have families as well and their families would be in the same boat as the rest of the civilians.

EDIT: Wanted to add....

I would ask every law enforcement or active military buddy that you can think that if something was brought down through out the grapevine or they would hear anything (ex: Marshal Law), that they would contact you. That way you could post it here. That would be a lot of ears out there.

[edit on 30-9-2008 by Quazi176]

reply to post by thisguyrighthere


There you go again speaking a whole lot of nonsense. You keep referring back to the old lady video, which is obvious you haven't watched yourself. In that scenerio it was the police not the Guard that disarmed. I think its a bit sexist to think that a woman is not capable of pulling the trigger. I don't agree with the excessive force used. But in this case I understand the disarment.

You keep critisizing the job the Guard did. How come you didn't go down there and help? Because you don't have it in you to endure what they have been through. You are a talker, well talking doesn't get the job done, action does.

So either you need to man up and handle business or drop it right where it is. Because until you sacrifice something for the people like our military has you are just another number.

Sadly, the military will do as they are ordered by the government. The alternatives could be far worse - Revolution, Civil War or a Military Coup.

reply to post by TheHunted


Typical high school reaction. "Man-up" and "until you have, then" statements.

If I had had family there who asked for my help I would have helped. I will hold a door for someone but I wont drop everything and sacrifice a moments time to travel halfway across the country and hand a bottle of water to a stranger. I'm selfish like that. Do unto others I think is the way of it. I would not want any people government or private to come onto my property for any reason unless I asked them to be there. I dont care how "dire" the situation seems to be or actually is. It's shameful for Nagin to have whined and cried and passed blame as he did. It was invasion for federal personnel to be there.

It wasnt long ago that the President did not do a little tour of "disaster" areas. If the President went flying by it was seen as a threat. If military and federales marched on in for whatever reason it was looked on with suspicion and distrust. Now if it rains too much everybody begs and pleads for "help" from satan himself.

Government has been very successful farming dependence in recent decades. Not only in the U.S. but across the world. Blurring the lines between individual, municipality, state and fed until they're gone. Apparently they've done the same to the line between right and wrong.