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The Face of the Mortgage Meltdown and the Great Economic Collapse of 2008

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posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 12:21 PM

Originally posted by Crakeur

Excellent post and some frightening information in there although, I would like to point out one thing that might clear up some issues:

Originally posted by BlackOps719
His funeral was held within two days of his passing, the ceremony was closed casket and hidden from any and all public or media coverage.

Jewish tradition - buried within two days and a closed casket.

I'm not saying he did or didn't die, just pointing this out as the claim you are making seems far more nefarious without this bit of knowledge.

also, he wasn't exactly a celebrity worthy of media coverage of his death. I don't recall seeing the media reporting from a lot of more famous people's funerals so that, too, can be discounted.


it can be seen as his using his faith's hasty funeral and closed casket as a means of removing the potential for being caught.

I'm curious, where's his family? are they all still here?

again, hell of a post.

Im not sure where his wife and two children currently reside. It could be the $20 million dollar Brentwood home in California, or possibly Arnall's $40+ million dollar mega mansion in Aspen, CO.

I am aware that Jewish tradition emphasizes a quick burial, but this man was literally gone from the face of the earth and buried before anyone even knew he had passed. There were a lot of people following Arnall's every move, everyone from angry ex employees to angry borrowers on down the line. I think most wanted to see proof that the man was actually gone, which they didnt get.

He was a notorious figure, and I am certain that it took a great deal of effort to conduct his funeral without a lot of people taking note.

Wheather or not he is still alive or not is up for debate. There are a lot of red flags that say he pulled a fast one, but obviously there is no way of proving this claim without producing a living and breathing Arnall.

The world may never know the truth.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 12:25 PM

Originally posted by Crakeur

some more info on the man

seems he donated to both parties.

Arnall was a shrewd and cunning character. He greased both wheels on both sides of the aisle, which made certain that he had nobody in government honing in on his illegal activity.

The $12 million donation to the Bush campaign is a real duzey, add on the fact that he was awarded an ambassadorship from the Bush administration and it makes for quite an ugly storyline.

The King of the crooked lenders was a Bush appointed ambassador, how embarrassing is that for an administration that is now begging and squwking for tax dollars to bail out the very same types of people that Bush cozied up to.

The whole thing stinks.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 12:39 PM
reply to post by BlackOps719

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

that's why I pointed it out. He played both sides. Apparently he gave a big chunk to Clinton as well. Smart and devious.

As to the jewish funeral. I wasn't implying anything, just pointing it out as that factor should be considered when looking at the issues surrounding his death/disappearance.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 01:39 PM
reply to post by Crakeur

It just emphasizes the fact that while this mess technically unfolded during Bush's time in office, the fact of the matter is both major parties failed miserably to react to what was coming. No measures were drawn and no plans were implemented until the weasel had already stolen all of the chickens so to speak.

Money knows no color, no sex and certainly does not recognize party lines. Democrats as well as Republicans both chose to turn a blind eye to mortgage fraud for the better part of a decade. They only now choose to react when the entire economy is teetering on the brink of disaster.

It really is a dark stain on the leadership of America when US citizens are taken advantage of and our leadership reacts only as the pulse of the nation is flat lining.

They should all be fired simultaneously.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 01:48 PM
reply to post by BlackOps719

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

absolutely correct. everyone in DC was either twiddling their thumbs or getting in on the act. Chris Dodd, Chariman of the Senate Banking Committee:

As Dodd in his role as chairman of the Senate Banking Committee proposed a housing bailout to the Senate floor in June 2008 that would assist troubled subprime mortgage lenders such as Countrywide Bank in the wake of the United States housing bubble's collapse,[23] Conde Nast Portfolio reported that in 2003 Dodd had refinanced the mortgages on his homes in Washington D.C. and Connecticut through Countrywide Financial and had received favorable terms due to being placed in a "Friends of Angelo" program. Dodd received mortgages from Countrywide at allegedly below-market rates on his Washington, D.C. and Connecticut homes.[23] Dodd has not disclosed the below-market mortgages in any of six financial disclosure statements he filed with the Senate or Office of Government Ethics since obtaining the mortgages in 2003.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 02:04 PM
reply to post by Crakeur

They all eat from the same trough of slop, and they are all criminally negligent in this horrific event. Refer to my Mencken quote if wish to know the truth about politicians.

Something bothers me to no end as well and I only discovered this recently.

Apparently politicians, celebrities and other high profile individuals also have their very own credit rating bureau that is seperate from all of us nobodies.

Thats right folks, Equifax, Experian and Transunion have a different system for rating the credit of high profile figures. The reasoning is that this sytem enables the credit scoundrels to rate these "important" people's credit reports accurately and positively. This way no person of importance will ever go public complaining about the incorrectness and the inaccuracy on their credit reports. Bad publicity.

The bureau's see to it to make extra sure that these peoples reports are squeeky clean. Meanwhile the rest of us are subject to incorrect reporting, double posting of negative debts and collections as well as old and dated information. All of these things fight tooth and nail to guarantee that our credit scores are all lower than they should be.

This way creditors and lenders can justify giving us regular folks higher rates and worse terms based on a credit report that is filled with lies and inconsistencies.

Criminal if you ask me.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 02:20 PM

off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 02:34 PM
Also there is a tie to Bush as being former part owner of the Texas Rangers Baseball team which the ballpark name was was later changed to Ameriquest Field in 2004 and later changed back to Ranger Ballpark in 2007 presumably after all of the bad press associated with Ameriquest.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:05 PM
very good presentation...

the OP looks like a '60 Minutes' or a 'Geraldo Rivera'
Story Board

engaging direction you are taking the securities bubble,
entertaining & thought provoking....

but----> is pop culture infotainment a model one should aspire.?

from the outside, s/StUdio Victoras

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:12 PM
There is another that is not getting any blame in all this mess.

Why the hell did these people sign? Before someone signs something of great importance like a house or car deal, they are given the opportunity, even at the most greedy institutions, to review the contract.

If a loan agent changes things for underwriting purposes, why didn't the customer say something? If there is some detail on the net worth or customer income that seems dishonest, why didn't the customer change it?

The sub prime American home buyer is just as much at fault as the crooked politician or businessman. They sub prime American home buyer wanted to have a house, even if they couldn't afford one, just because they thought they deserved one or to keep up with their peers.

Greed runs in all sectors of our society. The CEO walking away with millions after ruining his company or the politician getting huge contributions are just a representation of American society. McMansion owners are just as responsible for this mess, they should have stated their incomes honestly and should have been financially prepared for what is considered the largest purchase of a person's life.

And those people crying in the youtube video holding their kids trying to pull the emotional knife twister is just another proposed beneficiary from the bailouts.

Lastly there are homeowners that purchased their homes with honesty and responsibility. They put money down and were prepared. Thanks in part to the sub prime guys, the responsible homeowners are now getting the shaft with lower home values and a failing economy.

There is too much dishonesty and greed, and it seems that the people that are the most dishonest and greedy are gonna get the bailout.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:16 PM
reply to post by BlackOps719

Iam just astounded that these greedy corrupted indivuals think they can escape eternal justice..dulcebas

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:28 PM
I am an ex employee.. you have no idea how that place was... think boiler room but for mortgages... thank god I left when the caca hit the fan.. Ameriquest=evilquest anyone has any questions or wants to validate anything let me know...

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:31 PM
reply to post by wutone

you have no idea how the operation went on... notaries were dubbed closing agents and pressured customers to sign all documents fast.... it wasnt your typical bank closing.. I remember one day there were 25 closings done in within 3 hours in the 900sqft office... it was crazy.. people were faking w-2s in order to book there 15th loan and hit there bonuses.. all loans booked had 4 points min.. none were fixed.. all were 2\28 with a 3 year prepay.. this was a churn em and burn them op.. it was not your typical mortgage company...

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:33 PM
i met the owner... and if ameriquest is any indication... he will do whatever it takes ... I am sure he faked his death..

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:55 PM

Originally posted by thefreepatriot
reply to post by wutone

... notaries were dubbed closing agents and pressured customers to sign all documents fast.... it wasnt your typical bank closing..

How many people in their right mind would sing a document fast?

A customer has every right to sit there and READ the document they are signing. If there is a part of it they don't understand, the customer has every right to get an independent lawyer to help them out.

Purchasing a home isn't about a race to sign documents, it is a major decision that should be given time to be discussed. Just because there is a loan agent churning things up for commission doesn't meant that the customer has to play along.

Greed runs on both sides. The loan guys wanted their money and the customer wanted their house to stroke their ego.

As much as I don't like the practices of many mortgage brokers, they should not get all the blame. People who bought houses they couldn't afford played the sub-prime housing bubble game just as badly and I really don't feel sorry for them.

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:57 PM
reply to post by stander

I am sick and tired of people labeling people anti- semite whenever they critisize a jew or israel... this is really getting rediciolous.. so if a jew does something wrong and you critisize that person then all of a sudden your a nazi? man... we are really getting tired of this... I wouldnt be surprised if you were with the ADL..

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 03:58 PM
Ameriquest was not the root of all evil. Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac and the DEREGULATION of the market by Clinton was the problem!

I did mortgages from '91-'07. I started in the subprime market and moved shortly thereafter to conventional loans.

The downfall of things started when we went to credit scoring and got rid of human beings in the office that were underwriters. It was when Automated underwriting became king DU/LP (desktop underwriter Fannie mae and Loan Prospeter Freddie Mac)

As long as you had what DU/LP wanted as far as documentation and they approved it, it went. Both were heavily weighted on Credit scores and reserves. Things like 401k counted as reserves. Ratios of yesteryear did not apply like when humans underwrote loans. The computer did it all. I did many loans with 100% back end ratios, it was APPROVED with an accept from DU/LP though. So, it went

I NEVER EVER pushed, falisfied, manipulated or did anything to get a loan through. I many times would try and tell people that they were really buying more than they could afford, if their situation changed, they would be in trouble.

It was PEOPLE who wanted more than they could afford. People who would lie. People were also at fault here. Not just the mortgage giants. It was greed and opportunity on all sides. As far as "preying" upon elderly and minorities, I can tell you for a fact minorities got a better shake at getting a loan. The numbers were needed to keep banks in compliance. I could get absolute crap past a human underwriter in the old days if it was a black family or hispanic. They HAD to meet minimum numbers of minorities. Fair? No, not to anyone.

Back to the people though. The ones with bad credit, shaky job histories had to go b/c paper. IF you do not pay your bills on time why should you get a low rate? You are high risk! HELLO? You don't pay your bills! Cry me a river but, facts are facts. The ones I always felt the worst for were the divorcee's who's spouse had ruined their credit. I always thought that sucked. Or someone who truly got ill and couldn't work. Which, was much more rare.

I always tried to help everyone who walked through my door. I never tried to stick it to someone. I really wanted to see them in the best mortgage and best home they could get.

To blame this on McCain and Bush is just propaganda. This is a direct result of deregulation and GREED on all sides. We were so busy in the early '00's you couldn't get an appt. Serioiusly. Everyone was making money by just having their doors open.

It is completely different now. It is hard to get loans now. Banks don't want to lend money on cars nor on anything.

This did not have to happen. Credit scoring is a crock. Not using humans as real underwriters is a crock. I saw this coming, but unfortunately not to this degree.

There were two clients that stood out to me. Two that I remember and know what has happened. Both were a little shady, both were borrowing waaaaay more than they could handle. one is divorced and foreclosed the house(should never had gotten the loan) and the other bankrupted, but, was able to keep the home. As a person looking at the file, I knew that was a high probability. The processors knew it was going to happen. These were conventional loans though and they went right on through DU!

Be mad at the real problem.

oh and wutone... You had the right to get your documents early and read them all before even getting to closing. I requested that a few times for what title companies called "readers". Many people don't care, don't understand and just wanted it closed. You also had to schedule out long enough to get the papers ready days before closing.

Again, this goes down to personal responsibility. Quit crying if you don't do your homework and don't read something. No one can force you to sign and you can get up and walk away. I have seen it happen.

[edit on 9/27/2008 by llpoolej]

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 04:04 PM
reply to post by wutone

still consumers aren't that educated... you and I know they are sheep... they don't ever read what they sign... and the only state that mandates attorneys for closings is texas and NY .. no the blame is not solely on mortgage brokers or l\os but they are equally to blame(i am a mortgage broker) to give you an example.. I would have customers wanting the pick a pay mortgage from wamu and world savings(now wachovia) I would explain to them the risks involved and that its not a true payment yada yada yada.. in the end they still wanted it... why? because of all the marketing being done by the banks selling it and there best freinds and family members boasting about the super low payment they just received.. in the end I would end up booking the loan... making an average of 8-10k per deal... Banks actually paid 2 to 3 times more on those products then conventional or FHA.. so if you are a mb and you want to put food on the table what are you gonnna say no? everyone from the borrowers to the banks to the investors to the regulators are complicit in this.. everyone looked the other way as they made a killing.. the consumer would walk out paying 1000 dollars a month on a 450,000 mortgage(greed) the mb making 4-5 points (greed) and the Bank had a product that would have made a killing had the markets not turned(greed) ...

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 04:07 PM
reply to post by llpoolej

but fannie and freddie were way more conservative in underwriting it was only towards the end they bowed to pressure with stated\stated... they got burned because of the subprime crisis and the fall of the market... I wouldnt blame it solely on freddie\fannie .. du approvals were getting more lax because they needed to compete with the subprime wallstreet type lenders like new century etc.. also most products were fixed and they never paid more yield on arms(as much) as the wallstreet lenders... in the end they cooked some books to make there numbers look good for wallstreet.. and that was the beginng of the end..

posted on Sep, 27 2008 @ 04:10 PM
reply to post by BlackOps719
Excellet post.

and there's still folks out there that say GWB was a good president.

Many American's are in the fix they are in now because they simply watched Fox/CNN News for 1-2 hours, read a newspaper and believed they were "educated" on what is going on.

So many people are still not aware that almost all of our news media is owned by the likes of Arnell Roland and "he who controls the news controls the minds of the sheeple".

This latest financial "crisis" is just the beginning and the NWO is taking shape.

I don't believe enough of us have waken up fast enough to put the fire out.

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