Can anyone define what God is?

Originally posted by Wertdagf
So if reality was a 3d fractal wouldnt that mean that it all comes from something intellignet? I belive that this is what all of this was ment to explain. It just makes to much sense that causality IS the fundamental structure of the universe, whos 3d geometrical pattern defines all of reality at every resolution into infinty.

Excellent Post and I love the words in your Signature...

Muad'Dib learned rapidly because his first training was in how to learn. And the first lesson of all was the basic trust that he could learn. It's shocking to find how many people do not believe they can learn, and how many more believe learning to be difficult. Muad'Dib knew that every experience carries its lesson.

This should be The First Lesson in all schools....

I have a Pantheist-type view of God.

I believe God is everything. From the tiniest subatomic particles to the multiverse(if it exists). We are all parts of it having an experience. It does not intervene and is neutral. Good and evil are just human concepts, but at their core they are just experiences.

It requires no buildings of worship and no reliance of being our saviors. It gives us the ability to save ourselves and grow as a people.

reply to post by The Matrix Traveller


... well intelligence is a word i dont like to use....

is stuff forming in a sustainable orbit intelligent.... no.... its more causal.

Intelligence is all based around understanding casuality...

so casuality cannot be called intelligent.... it simply is the rythm and system of creation....

It doesnt anwser your prayers..... your not going to meditate and move a mountain. No one is going to fly without technology.... no one is going to ressurect people without tehcnology.... no one is going to move somthing with their mind without tehcnology.

GOD is not a person.... its causality.

Disclaimer: I'm a theist but not of the Abrahamic faiths. I have minor biblical scholar and scriptural skills. Also I am not a scientific/legal or medical expert in any field. Beware of my Contagious Memes! & watch out that you don't get cut on my Occams razor.All of this is my personal conjecture and should not be considered the absolute or most definitive state of things as they really are. Use this information at your own risk! I accept no liability if your ideology comes crashing down around you with accompanying consequences!

Explanation: Awesome Thread The Matrix Traveller. Starred and Flagged.
I also love your definition of GOD. Here is mine....

1stly I have 36yrs of cultural and existential baggage from through which I view the environment(something larger and beyond my consciousness) in which I perceive I(my consciousness based on perceived/sensed input) reside in. Therefor any definition I decide to couch GOD in will be tainted due to the baggage. So to combat this and gain a more accurate definition of GOD not pre-couched in that kind of baggage I have been as careful as I can to avoid those baggage traps. So I start with Kant i.e. (A PRIORI PURE GIVEN...I think therefore I am!) and bootstrap my way up from there. Somewhere along this very tenuous bootstrap I define what GOD is TO ME! Here are the basic A PRIORI's I use for that.

1) My GOD must be perfect! (this is my yardstick when measuring GODS definitions)
2) Perfect is here defined as totality not purity! (The yardstick now has scale and a level/mark/target that can be measured against!)
3) All conditions inclusive of this one, are to be considered PURE GIVENS and their validity cannot be argued unless the individual who holds these mental states wants a total psychological rewrite.

So then I take my yardstick and start measuring and defining the various states of GOD....

Lets start with presence 1st because logical I should know where GOD really is 1st before I go defining any other of his abilities etc.

A)Presence: GOD must be omnipresent. To be anything less would not meet the mark of the yardstick.

Therefore being Omnipresent we can now use this to help us define other states in relation to not only the yardstick but also to this particular state of GOD and if there is any discrepancy then this would obviously have to be resolved(i.e tying up loose ends!) to create a more water tight argument.

Ok now lets look at what GOD might know. Because if I don't know what GOD knows then how will I ever determine what GOD's powers are?

B)Sentience/gnosis: Being Omnipresent(i.e ALL existence!), GOD must be Omniscient (All knowing). This B state grows out of the A state and matches the yardstick mark for validity.

This B state now joins the A state in procreating the C state and as always the yardstick will be used to validate the C state.

Ok now lets look at what GOD's powers are couched in both states A and B and using the yardstick....

C) Potential/power: Being Omnipresent(All existence) and Omniscient(All Knowing), GOD must be Omnipotent (All powerful).

Now there are more states that can be bootstrapped out of these 3 base states and using the yardstick. But I believe that I have enough states and a reliable enough yardstick to use these tools to try and IDENTIFY GOD in my perceived environment.

OK my environment is an A PRIORI PURE GIVEN in that I believe I perceive it and yes that it exists beyond my own sentient ability to receive input from it.

Where is the completely subjectively bootstrapped up "OBJECT" of GOD couched in this A PRIORI PURE GIVEN environment (hereafter called the UNIVERSE!)?

Well the commonly observed abilities of my universe (because I believe in more A PRIOR PURE GIVENS about it such as experts who do these actual observations are ACTUALLY reliable experts and their observations have actual factual basis in MY reality) are as follows.....

X)Presence: its all existing and therefor matches perfect with state A
Y)Sentience/gnosis: being state X its therefor must be completely aware of itself at all 3 scales of existence i.e. Globally, Locally and Internally. Therefor it meets state B perfectly.
and finally ...
Z)Potential/power: being both state X and Y it therefor must be completely powerful at all 3 scales of existence i.e. Globally, Locally and Internally. Therefor it meets state C perfectly.

So for me my perceived input in regard to this and the A PRIORI PURE GIVEN positions I take have led me to BELIEVE that the UNIVERSE I reside in is MY GOD. The Global level of this I call Achlys and s/he is my ALL CREATING AND DESTROYING SPIRITUAL AND PHYSICAL ALLMOTHER! I on the other hand am just a LOCAL and INTERNAL part of this GLOBAL STATE and my presence,sentience and powers are limited by this perceived current state of affairs.

Personal Disclosure: It all starts with belief and we all bootstrap Objectiveness concerning anything out of large Subjective structures who if you go for those ultra tenuous A PRIORI PURE GIVENS (THE ROOTS) and show them to be logically,rationally and reasonably uncredible from a well defined commonly accepted POV is where you can start to UPROOT "false" ideologies. But as I stated above in condition 3 that this relies on the person who may be holding fast to what you may perceive to be largely false subjective structures wanting to change!

Edited to turn Kant into a link.

[edit on 15-1-2009 by OmegaLogos]

reply to post by The Matrix Traveller


I have a funny feeling you have had a near death experience at some point in your life?

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
reply to post by The Matrix Traveller

 

I have a funny feeling you have had a near death experience at some point in your life?

Yes you are indeed correct... in 1973 August 27th to be correct.

But rather than being a near death experience I was pronounced brain dead for a period longer than 30 minutes.

But during this time (more than 30 minutes) on Earth, I was more alive out of this program, you call Earth, than what I am in it...

But now I see Death as only a Human Myth...

It is written in "The Gospel of Thomas" (Not in the bible)

56.
Jesus said,
"Whoever has come to understand the world
has found only a Corpse,

and whoever has found a Corpse
is Superior to the world."

To OP.

God is something that can make everything out of nothing. That's have it all began. God started with nothing and made everything that is in this dimension we all exist in.

Who else can make anything out of nothing.

This will likely be the last post I make on religion, because many of the posters here treat my religious take on things as a joke, I respect all religious beliefs even non-religious beliefs,

if you really want to know what and who God is, I'll tell you my take...

God the Father, is humanoid, physical and immortal, all knowing, all powerful, he is God because he is perfect in love and justice, he obeys all laws of the universe therefore all laws of the universe obey him.

God the Son, was non-physical but since the resurrection has become like the father, physical and immortal, his spirit being united with his body perfectly forever. There is a 2nd being that is his Son, sepreate and different, yet One in purpose, everything he does is for the Father, so he will interchange himself with the Father for the reason that both the Father & The Son have the title God

God the Spirit, this seperate non-physical being has the title of God because he knows all, he is the messanger and the bringer of truth, without the Spirit, God could not be everywhere at all times or see everything at all times, spirits because they are non-physical are outside of time, they can literally be everywhere at once because time does not apply to them, but time does apply to physical beings, even ascended ones. The Spirit is One in purpose like the Son.

That's God, 3 seperate beings, all One in purpose, it goes back further than you know, who came before God? for example... if I choose to ever post again I may reveal this question, but for the time being, on these forums in general, serious religious belief and truths of the universe are treated no different than "pearls before swine", and I would choose to lay off of the religious posts for a while if not forever due to this sad state of ridicule, not pointing fingers at anyone in specific, it's just the 'masses' of these forums do not seem to be 'evolved' enough spiritually to not instantly reject truth when it is right before them.

[edit on 17-1-2009 by Razimus]

reply to post by The Matrix Traveller
[more

I think you have hit your head at that time?

God. Wow. That's a big question. Best I can say is to give you my personal experience with Him.

One evening, March 23, 1993, I was reading the Psalms, Psalm 22 to be exact. It is about the crucifixion that comes many hundreds of years later. As you read, you see how it becomes Jesus speaking about his condition. Later, He describes how they pierce his hands and feet, etc. However, one line stood out to me. It's the verse where Jesus is saying "I am a worm."

Well, for some reason that really floored me. God Himself saying He was a worm. I then thought, what does that make me?

My next conclusion was that, in my prayers to God, I had obviously not sufficiently humbled myself. I then fell on my face, and prayed for about 30 minutes, humbling myself more and more, in tears.

Then, He came.

Or, I went.

Anyway, I found myself, while lying on the floor, visibly located at the foot of the cross during the crucifixion of Jesus.

His head was drooped down, hair matted. His body was covered with marks from being beaten. His skin was bloody in many places. He appeared to be dead and still. I gazed upon Him in the weakened, yellow/orange light and felt uncomfortable being in His presence. I was not worthy, and had been humbling myself as it were. I felt as if I were made of tar and blackness, of sin.

Then, as I was looking at Him, He slowly raised His head and stared at me. He stared at me with eyes of love. I was beginning to feel the love from Him as if it were a powerful force. It increased more and more. As it did, the blackness of my state of being began to be pushed out. The love grew more and more, and the blackness was cleared away. I was, if you will, transparent, in that the love could pass through me like light.

This powerful love continued to penetrate through me. I looked more at Him, and it was as if He were saying "I am on this cross only for you. I do this for each person." He did it for love.

In a moment, I was "back on the floor" and I felt differently. I felt as if the permanent visible things were the transparent and temporary, and as if the invisible things were the solid and everlasting. And He erased my fear of death.

So, I would have to agree with the Bible, when it says God is love. At least, that has been my experience with Him.

And my bad habits were completely erased for at least up until now, 16 years later.

[edit on 18-1-2009 by Jim Scott]

God is all life and life is pure love.

Dont try to over complicate things.

[edit on 18-1-2009 by Wisen Heimer]

God simply means an "object of worship"

Anything, or anyone we worship is God. The word remains the same regardless of what or who we worship. The essence of the object also remains the same. Something that is, or that we percieve as being bigger than we are.

reply to post by Razimus


I am Listening and Don't ridicule you...

You are a part of the All.....

reply to post by Jim Scott


In the OT in many Cases the Words used are "The Lord God" The Christ is Lord of Lords and King of Kings So the Lord God Refers to "The Christ", that is the One that spoke through the Carpenter....

The One that spoke to the World through the Carpenter was Two entities in One through the Third that was the Flesh as in the Carpenter...

The Son of God Which is The Light of Man or The Life of God...
The Son of Man is The Soul of The Christ....
The Word that was Made Flesh is The Carpenter...

There is Not One that is Lost out of the Hand of The Christ....

It is only the Hatred of Human Primates that talk of Failure...

God is Not deficient.....

God is just Not understood by Flesh...

A good writing to read is "The Gospel of Thomas"

The Workings of God are Automatic, But the Life of God or Light of Man is the Consciousness of God. The Life of God is The Light or The Christ.

The Flesh was the Carpenter...
The Son of Man is The Soul...
The Son of God is The Christ.

As for Human kind....
The Flesh is A'Dam and Eve...
The Soul is Man Not Flesh...
The Life of Man Not A'Dam is Light or The Life of God.

God is Love. But do people understand Love ????

People can Love Good and some Love Evil....

So what is this Love ????

You and I may know but does the World understand ????


If The Christ Lost even One Soul out of His Hand He has Failed but as this is impossible for Christ to Fail All are Saved by the Christ.....

In other words All Souls Remain (Saved) and are Not I repeat Not Lost....

The Fear of being Lost is only Lack of Trust in The Life of God or Light of Man.....

Jesus said, "I command you to Watch!"

[edit on 18-1-2009 by The Matrix Traveller]

Originally posted by Wisen Heimer
God is all life and life is pure love.

Dont try to over complicate things.

[edit on 18-1-2009 by Wisen Heimer]

This is Not complicated to me.....

In "The Gospel According to St. John", it tells you that God is of two Parts...

1/. The "Word" God.... G O D






2/. The Life of God is The Light of Man....

In the Original text in Greek the Word "Phos" was used translated in English through the Latin or Direct into English is Sun Light or any other Light emitting from a star or meteor etc it does Not mean understanding.

The Sun of Righteousness is mentioned in...

"The Book of Malachi" Chapter 4 Verse 2. and 3.

2.
But unto you that fear my Name
shall the Sun of righteousness
arise with healing in His Wings;
and ye shall go forth,
and grow up as the calves
of the stall.

3.
And ye shall tread down the wicked;
for they shall be ashes
under the soles of your feet
in the day that I shall do this,
saith the Lord of hosts.

[edit on 18-1-2009 by The Matrix Traveller]

Originally posted by Obliterated
God simply means an "object of worship"

Thus let us define what worship is, for it is in worship that man seems to stray in many directions.

If God is the Universe, and creator of all that is seen and unseen, that how might we worship? How does one define the creation of the Universe with the creator being part of the very fabric of the Universe itself? What man reading this cannot say, he is a child of the Universe?

Yet we are given clues of direction. The Bible defines natural design, and the will of God. The will of what is right and was is best. Yet how does man define what is best?

Jesus said it best, that we must Love the Lord our God with all our heart and all our soul and that the next command is like it...

"That we love one another, as we love ones self".

Love, in its most ultimate expresion.True, unselfish, egoless, kindness. To be trustworthy and true of your words. To do for one what one what do to ones own self without hesitation, and to view every man or woman their equal. To have an eye for justice, and a strength for what is right.

It was in the definition of Worship, that the Vatican and the leaders of Islam met to define just what worshiping God entailed.

www.nytimes.com...

Can you define the Universe? Can you define beyond ALL?

Did not Jesus say:

Revelation:
I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end.

For in the Beginning there was the Word,
and the Word in the beginning was time,
Time began, and the Word was begun.

Peace


[edit on 18-1-2009 by HIFIGUY]

I have my thoughts here that may add a little to the discussion.

Perhaps he is greatly misunderstood?

Originally posted by MatrixProphet
Perhaps he is greatly misunderstood?

Not perhaps, but assured.

But the path of understanding has been spoken, yet to many not heard.
The Path shown yet not seen, yet not seen because the heart did not look.

Misunderstood?

How does one misunderstand Love one another as you would love ones own self? Do to yourself first, that which you would do to another person when it comes violence.Perhaps then, the mayhem and hate would end.

To let ones cup run over to another in need. Is that not best?

The message is in simplicity, not complexity. Within your heart, and not in your institutions of philosophies. Not everyone wants to hear as it is not convenient for them to do so. Not everyone will hear, because it would result in a massive change of not only our present day society, but the entire planet.

Peace


[edit on 18-1-2009 by HIFIGUY]

reply to post by HIFIGUY

Not everyone wants to hear as it is not convenient for them to do so. Not everyone will hear, because it would result in a massive change of not only our present day society, but the entire planet.

Yes, I do agree, but I also feel that the change is here and the choice is ours!

reply to post by HIFIGUY


Hi HIFIGUY,

Thank you first for your Interest and remarks...

You wrote...

"That we love one another, as we love ones self".

The Original words were....

"Love Thy Neighbour as thy Self...."

This means we are each other as One.

We must Love Each other As ourself

There is Only One.... I Know No Other....

One God, One Spirit, One Son...

When I talk to you, I talk to my Self that is a Part of Myself as there is Only The One... I am the Outer of You and You are The Outer of Me... LOL..

I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end.

But is The Revelation of Jesus Christ Understood ????

Facts....

There are More than 110 Different Original Greek Versions of the Revelation of Jesus Christ.....

The Book is Not forecasting as if a Prediction...

The Book is as it is Called The Revelation.... To Reveal Jesus Christ...

This is a Record of The History of The Metamorphosis of The Soul...

And is in Parable form for those it was Intended for to understand...



A Quote from "The Gospel of Thomas"....

51.
His disciple said to Him,

"When will the repose of the dead come about,
and when will the new world come?"

He said to them,

"What you look forward to has already come,
but you do Not recognise it."

52.
His disciples said to Him,

"Twenty-four prophets spoke in Israel,
and all of them spoke in you."

He said to them,

"You have omitted The Living One in your presence
and have spoken only of the Dead."

And again....

56.
Jesus said,

"Whoever has come
to understand the world
has found only a corpse,

and whoever has found
a corpse is superior to the world."

For in the Beginning there was the Word,
and the Word in the beginning was time,
Time began, and the Word was begun.

The Original words were....

In The Beginning was The Word
And The Word was with God,
and the Word was G O D (The Word was Spelt in English G O D)

No mention of Time Here ????

What is Time ???

Definition in Human terms....

A measurement of The Rate of Change in anything...

Outside our experience, ie the Universe Time only exists as a concept to be used if desired in experiences of Universes and other worlds that don't represent your universe or any other Universes.....

Time as what humankind refer to it as, has been created... and is by no means absolute....

There are Hundreds of different versions and translations of what you call the bible and Not One...

The bible is only a Roman collection of some of the Hebrew and Greek Writings, influenced by Roman Doctrine....

And as you know we also have a Kings James Version
as well as many other Versions depending on what denomination you follow...

Get hold of 20 or 30 different bibles and compare them you will become horrified at what you find...

The Original Books of Moses were Not written in Hebrew...

They were written in ZIONic which is Nothing Like what you know today...

When the Temple was dismantled in about BC 800 to BC 700 and the Jews were taken into exile is when The Jewish Written Language was introduced even though the verbal Language is much much older...

The Bones of The Scribes and The Priests were Burnt on the Altars...
This is how they got rid of the ZIONic Language....

A Jewish Council was set up at the time to Rewrite the Books...

This can be found in History if you do a little research...

There is another quote from "The Gospel of Thomas"...

39.
Jesus said,

"The Pharisees and the Scribes
have taken The Keys of Knowledge
and Hidden Them,

They themselves have Not entered,
nor have they allowed to enter
those who wish to.

Peace....

[edit on 18-1-2009 by The Matrix Traveller]