It's official, Obama to make AWB permanent

reply to post by TheHunted


It is treason because you are suggesting that we change the Bill of Rights to fit your views. If I tore up the Bill of Rights what would that be? There is no difference between destroying the Bill of Rights and editing it. In fact I would say editing the Bill of Rights is a serious act of disloyalty.

Here's a question... that oath that you took to defend the constitution, What would you be charged with if you broke that oath while serving?

And yes, the Assault Weapons Ban a strictly banning cosmetic features of the weapons. If anything, banning these features makes the weapons less accurate and more dangerous.

The 1994 law also prohibits manufacturers from producing firearms with more than one of the following assault weapon features:

Rifles

Folding/telescoping stock
Protruding pistol grip
Bayonet mount
Threaded muzzle or flash suppressor
Grenade launcher

Pistols

Magazine outside grip
Threaded muzzle
Barrel shroud
Unloaded weight of 50 ounces or more
Semi-automatic version of a fully automatic weapon

Shotguns

Folding/telescoping stock
Protruding pistol grip
Detachable magazine capacity
Fixed magazine capacity greater than 5 rounds

Source

With the exception of the grenade launcher, they are cosmetic and in many cases such as folding stocks and pistol grips, these make the weapons more comfortable to use.

Oh, and picture this: The year is 2008 and the founding fathers start a revolution that leads to independence. They would write the 2nd amendment the same way, granting the right to bear arms, without infringment, to the citizens.

As you keep saying, its MODERN times, so why should we not have MODERN arms?

[edit on 29-9-2008 by XTexan]

sorry double post, but i would like to ask this:

How is this:



more dangerous than this:




[edit on 29-9-2008 by XTexan]

[edit on 29-9-2008 by XTexan]

reply to post by XTexan


Editing the bill of rights is treason??? You cant be serious..... Amending the constitution is the same thing as editing the bill of rights. The founding fathers left it within our rights to amend and change. Not to stay the same and stagnant when the world passes us by.

reply to post by bknapple32


I kinda thought charging me with treason was a bit extreme. We just want what's best for the public. So you up for that car pool?

Originally posted by boaby_phet
reply to post by thisguyrighthere

 

Your going to run to somwhere else because you cant own a gun? that seems a bit silly, and i never really understood why americans make such a big deal about gun ownership..

noone needs guns!, guns are nasty little machines, simply developed to kill and hurt people or animals ( no, im not a veggie or against hunting!)

really, what do YOU need a gun for? and why does it upset you that you cant own a gun.. something that can only be used to harm someone.

on guns, america needs to stop living in the old times, this is 2008 ! not 1908.

Hmmm You sertinly dont live in America do you?
You sertinly have never been robbed have you?
You sertinly dont live in a "bad" part of town do you?

Humans are nasty little machines, that run around and hurt other people, and hurt animals!
There are plenty of reasons why I OWN and protect my home and my guns!!

I have always protected my own. And TRUST me.. There are many folks out here who want what you have.
Drugs, crime, you name it. Sure lots of negtive undertones to guns.
Its mostlyl negtive. Sure I give it that.

I will reframe from using my normal terms with this post. I am a redneck.
And try to take my guns from me, I dare you

Ive lived in areas where I NEED a gun to protect my home, and well earned property. Theres many people out here who want what is mine.

They cant have it.. And you enter my home without my permission, you will die.. You will be carried out in a body bag.. I promise you that.

I dont leave my home with my gun. I leave it where it lays.. In my home.
For my own protection!

I have never pulled a gun on someone, I am not a thug.

You seem to think Americas are wild cowboys who all toke their weaponry with them. Every person I know owns a gun, and we all leave them at home and go out about in the world.

To carry a gun on you, would bring you more trouble. But to keep a gun at home to protect you is a totally different story that we as AMERICAN's cherish with the upmost respect. Others not so much.

Well... maybe treason was a bit harsh.

Sorry for that, I tend to get rather passionate on this topic.

From my point of view, this is my right... and you saying that you want to edit a right that I frequently exercise (as I do most of my rights) it blows my mind...

I wish there was a right that you held dear, that I cared nothing for and wanted to take from you...

That wouldn't happen though, I'll fight for all my rights, and everyone else's to, using the 2nd amendment if I have to.

In the right hands, a walmart .30-06 is just as, if not more dangerous than an assault rifle. I would venture to guess that my older brother(Special forces sniper) could cause more damage with a MUSKET than the average gang banger with an uzi. That being said I always hear from people "Why would anyone own guns/ own more than one or two guns"

My reasoning? I like hunting. Within any hunting season, depending on where you live, they have Bow season blackpowder season pistol rifle and so on. If you want to get the best out of your hunting liscence you hit up every part of hunting season. Why? cause for one, they don't sell non farm raised venison in the store. 2, i like wild turkey for thanksgiving(both the bird and the one sold in the bottle) and 3. I find it more respectable to the animal to kill it myself as opposed to someone in a factory hitting a hormoned up cow with a hammer.

I gotta love it when foreigners whine about how we U.S. citizens don't stand up to our government, but then they criticize us for feeling like we need to own guns.

So what, when Big Brother gets tired of watching and decides to finally take over, we're supposed to stand up to them with sticks or something?

Protecting our right to bear arms is NOT about:

- Hunting
- Defense from criminals
- Collecting

Sure, guns can be used for those purposes, but that is not why we demand the right to own them.

The right to bare arms is about maintaining a barrier that is designed to prevent an oppressive government from rearing its ugly head in our nation. Who, besides evil itself, would actively work to destroy a barrier against evil?

The powers that be in our country have been eroding away at our rights for some time now. They have chiseled our "rights" down to "privileges," and the last basic right that prevents them from removing those rights altogether is the Second Amendment. Take a look at what has happened to our rights:

- We went from having "Freedom of Speech" to having "Free Speech Zones." Once upon a time, we had the right to make our voices heard. Now, if we wish to speak, we must do so where we cannot be heard.

- We went from having "Freedom of Religion" to having "Separation of Church and State." The role of the government in religion was intended to be nonexistent. Instead, it has taken up the mantle of silencing religious beliefs altogether.

- We went from having "The Right to Vote" to having "Choose the Republican or the Democrat." Third parties are barred from the debates (not to mention ignored by the media,) thus turning our voting rights into a mere pacifier for the masses.

- Once upon a time, we declared that there would be "No Taxation Without Representation." Today, we have income tax, property tax, inheritance tax, tariffs, sales tax, toll roads, gas tax, gas guzzler tax, state tax, local tax, per capita tax, and on, and on, and on. Did you tell your representative to give us these taxes? I know I didn't. Here in Pennsylvania, once a year we must pay a "Privilege to Work Tax" or some such horse pucky.


Those in the government who gave us "Free Speech Zones" would be more than happy to give us "Be Quiet, or Else." Those who gave us "Separation of Church and State" would be content to leave us with "Keep Your Religious Views Behind Closed Doors." They would surely love to create a policy of "This is the Leader We've Chosen for You" instead of "Choose the Republican or the Democrat." And deducting half a person's income in the form of "taxes" before they even see their check is, essentially, half way down the path of making them work for free.

Now ask yourself, what is the one thing stopping those factions within our government from finally stripping our freedoms away in exactly that manner? The answer is simple: They know we're still dangerous to them.

And their solution to that "problem?"

Our "Right to Bare Arms" was reduced to "The Privilege to Bare Technologically Inferior Arms" when it became nearly impossible to own automatic weapons. Soon, it will become the "Privilege to Own Hunting Weapons," if Obama gets his way.

By continuing the propaganda war against the Second Amendment, their ultimate goal - and any freedom loving American's worst nightmare - is to convince the public at large to give up the right to bare arms entirely. Fortunately, we're slightly smarter than that. I hope.

So now, those of you outside the U.S. hopefully have some insight as to why we Americans love our guns so much. If it still isn't clear for you, ask yourself this:

Most of you have harsh criticisms about the U.S.'s warmongering foreign policy. Most of us are opposed to this behavior as well. If the current behavior of the government is how they conduct their business when our voices still carry some small amount of influence...

...What will be their legacy once We, the People are silenced forever?

reply to post by mattifikation


I agree with everything you said excpt the religion issue. The whole point of seperation of church and state is to keep freedom of religion. If the state gets to decide that one faith is more correct than another, then no one is free to choose the religion that works best for them.

reply to post by mattifikation


Excellent post. Facts are hard to refute when they stare you right in the face. Its too bad that those of other countries as well as many here in the US that are already kowtowing to the loss of their rights and protections can't see the threat they face. When their governments start taking the basics from them for the so called betterment of others, they just might wake up and realise that they have NO recourse because they have no control of their governments or any way to change it! With no threat from their populace, theres no threat to they're power!

Zindo

reply to post by mattifikation

- Defense from criminals

But are not those in government not criminals?
The reason we are given the right to bare arms is very much about protecting ourselfs from Criminals!
Those bad guys that want to take what is ours?

And sometimes these bad guys are not those thugs walking the streets looking for some drug money for their next fix.

Its to protect VS the criminals who want to take away our freedoms.
The Crime Lords who seem to be above the law.

These types of Crime lords dont need guns or a typical gang to come into your home and rob you.
They pass laws, and wear suits..
By far more dangerous than any low life street thug/criminal.

That was a great post.. However you seem to exclude those suits who are the true criminals that we must protect ourselfs from.

And how do you protect yourself with mere guns from a group who owns the military? And private mercs?
We would have to form an army of People to combat that..
And it would go back to Rome.. The slaves VS their Slaver owners.
Out gunned. Out numbered.. And out equiped in all measures.

reply to post by zysin5


Well, if you're judging their characters then they are criminals. But I meant "criminals" in more of a "protection from intruders/rapists/general street thug" sort of definition. Although gun ownership is great to take part in when that sort of person comes around, this is only a secondary reason to have the amendment.

reply to post by ZindoDoone


You hit the nail on the head. The only reason we have the rights we do today is because the government knows it cannot forcibly take them away. Once we no longer have the ability to fight back, we lose our voice in government. When we lose our voice in government, we are no longer citizens.

Originally posted by boaby_phet

Retseh - what you have replied with comes accross as very single minded - that guns can solve any problem ? how can something that kills things be a viable problem solver, thats more sweeping them under the rug , or putting your fingers in your ears and going "la la l al al a" to the problems of modern society.. this aint the 1600's, this aint the 1800's, this aint even the 1900's any more, we are in the 21st century now, and people shoudl have teh sence to solve problems without guns ... if their were no guns their woudl not be as much crime or gun related murders, and thats not speculation, thats fact.

To read my post as single minded, you would have to be single minded.

I simply listed the historical uses of firearms that have saved both my own nation from oppression, and yours too (using our firearms I might add).

Your own country is now largely firearms free, and what has happened, you now have a stabbing epidemic and a general breakdown in law and order. I have visited the UK, and if that's the kind of social behavior that a gun free society gets you then I want no part of it. Your city centers are positively dangerous at night. It's not about the weapons, it's about the quality of the people.

Ultimately, I don't really care about the UK, you are on a path of your own choosing, and good luck with it. Americans rarely stray into discussions where the British are proclaiming the wonders of their gun free utopia, and yet the British strangely seem to feel that they are somehow welcome to chime in with their weak pacifist views in any thread addressing the ownership of firearms in the US.

We are a nation whose leaders trust us to own firearms, they accept that some people will do bad things with them, but they trust us anyway. Your country does not trust you with guns, and that's probably a good call in the case of the UK.

Who has it right? I think our British immigration statistics answer that one.

reply to post by Spoodily


My Winchester 30-06 is a bit more powerful than the military's M-16, and it will shoot through a deer or a door. So what? Most deer rifles are capable of the same thing. Ever been deer hunting?

And I'm very interested about you carrying a firearm without a permit because I live in the Birmingham area, too. The last thing we need is for more people to break the law. Go get a permit, please.

You know what gets me on the whole deal is he wants Guns out of Your hands,

But Hussein Is FINE WITH MURDERING BABIES ~!!!!!!!!!!!!

What's Wrong with that Picture.............................

He is such an Idiot when it comes to anything.

Originally posted by boaby_phet



one final though, in america, most (well all) of the people will have lived under teh constitution, born and raised on it for many a year, it was good and relevent when it was written, bear arms incase of invasion..

And having a illegal immigrant or three on about every block in every town,city,state,Is not that a invasion.

Now is the time to stand and bear arms!!!

Why is every American scared to give up their gun?

Guns are a tool for killing people.

If you have a gripe against somebody, tell them. Don't shoot them. Shooting people is what cowards would do.

I often wondered about that,as they are kicking down your door they have a list with your name on it,then they say,no problems all this guy has is a 22?,I say make em guess