Artifact from Atlantis?

i think ive found something look half way down on the right hand side



Original source pages.pomona.edu...

it does seem to fit incans were famed bronze users
the location where the item turned up could be from the spanish conquest where at one point the spanish ruled the seas so it could of turned up anywhere

if any one knows more about the incans please lend a hand to shed some light on this. ancient civilizations arnt my strong point

does anyone else think that the top part of this kind of represents a...






flame?

reply to post by Harte


I agree that Mr. Cremo's background could be perceived as "hippie dropout" , but it offers some great insights on the real history of the human race, based on the Vedas and the ancient Hindu texts, which have been dated to some 3000 or 4500 years old.
Those texts speak of some civilization that thrived when other tribes where picking fruits on some deserted steppe.
I wouldn't dismiss it so easily as the ramblings of some un educated hippie!

BTW, great links you posted!

It is one of the oldest texts of any Indo-European language. Philological and linguistic evidence indicate that the Rigveda was composed in the Sapta Sindhu (a land of seven great rivers), corresponding to the North-Western region of the Indian subcontinent, roughly between 1500–1000 BCE (the early Vedic period). There are strong linguistic and cultural similarities with the early Iranian Avesta, deriving from the Proto-Indo-Iranian times, often associated with the early Andronovo culture of ca. 2000 BCE (Sintastha, Arkhaim, etc.).

source


here is some info on the ancient china - america connection:

In August Xinhua, the Chinese press agency, reported that similarities between almost 300 markings found on pottery, jade and stone at unspecified ancient native sites in central America closely resemble 3,000-year-old Shang dynasty characters for the sun, sky, rain water, crops, tress and stars. American and Chinese pictographs in 56 matching sets were shown to senior academics at a symposium in Anyang, former capital of the Shang dynasty. These impressive similarities add fuel to theories that Chinese arrived in the Americas before the end of the Shang dynasty in 221 BC. Shang legends state that a king led his people on a journey to the east, with some historians believing that he took them across the Bering Strait to North America. The Chinese classic, the Shan Hai King of about 2250 BC, contains what seems to be an accurate description of the Grand Canyon. Peanuts and maize have been found at ancient Chinese sites dating back to 3000BC. The orthodox view is that neither of these plants left their native America before their export by European colonists in 16th century AD. In AD 499, a Chinese monk, Hui Shen, returned to China claiming to have spent 40 years in the land of “Fu Sang”. He left a record of the country he visited, which has been recorded in official histories – a land thought by some modern scholars to be ancient Mexico.

source

Wei Chu-Hsien received pictures of findings with ancient Chinese characters from scholars from US, Peru, Mexico and Uruguay after getting in touch with Prof Lau Tun-li in 1970. Peru had been the place where most of the potteries, and jade / silver articles carrying Chinese characters had been located. Most notable would be a silver artifact of a nude goddess excavated by Corde de Gugui on Mt Truillo in northern Peru in 1865.

source

A MAP has come to light that may support the thesis that a Chinese eunuch admiral discovered America decades before Christopher Columbus. At the very least it will fuel debate. Bought by Liu Gang, a Chinese lawyer, in 2001 from a book dealer in Shanghai, the map is dated 1418 and shows with remarkable accuracy the whole world — each continent with its correct shape, latitude and longitude. Mr Liu has carried out extensive research to try to authenticate the map, which he plans to unveil to the public in Beijing on Monday. Gavin Menzies, the British author, contends that the discovery is further proof that Zheng He, a Chinese navigator, and not Columbus, discovered America. Mr Menzies, a former Royal Navy submarine commander, said: “It’s authentic. It supports my book to the hilt.” He published 1421: The Year China Discovered America in 2002 and the work soon became a bestseller, sparking furious discussion in academic circles in China and beyond. Mr Menzies uses numerous references to maps in his book that relates how the fleet of Admiral Zheng He sailed to Cuba and to Rhode Island in 1421, seven decades before Columbus made landfall in the New World in 1492.

source

Official sources have plenty to revise...
Maybe the artifact the OP posted could be some sort of key to unlocking this mystery!

reply to post by The_Modulus


img149.imageshack.us...

I dont see 2 people facing each other.
I see 2 people back to back, bowing.

I also think this is of asian origion - but im certainly no expert

(I am not done with the entire thread, so not sure if this has been said yet)


[edit on 9/24/2008 by greeneyedleo]

reply to post by stikkinikki


I have to disagree with you on the wear of this piece. I am an avid treasure diver and have found all sorts of artifacts including cannons, swords, pottery, gold coins, ect. If you flush these items with fresh water as soon as you gert them out of the sea, they do preserve very well.

It looks like 2 fish sorry i dont see the faces but i think the top symbol definetly represents a flame

heck, i'll add my 2cents. Without holding it, and seeing it other than in photos, it appears to be greek/minoan.

Being it was found off the coast of Florida, we have to ask how far from the area call the Bimini Road was it found....off the coast of Florida is a pretty good piece of real estate to cover.

We can also draw on what was written by, if memory serves correctly, Socrates...and his description/visit to Atlantis. (I may have the wrong guy, correct me if I'm wrong... )

all in all it appears to have been used as some kind of lighting device to me, or it could have had a glass insert and was used as a fancy vase....just a few guesses added to all of the others.

There are those swirly squares all over the urn thing which makes me think its aztec or mayan

reply to post by jpm1602


" That was my initial reaction. Particularly the lions head. It does appear to be of Mayan origin to me. IMHO "

Mayan's and Lions? Lions roam Africa my friend.

It appears to be a torch, to me. The prongs on the artifact look as if they are for threading rope. It's not a torch you would carry, it looks too heavy. But it might be one for walls or a column of some kind. I don't know anything about archaeology, but I think it looks Asian. The Chinese did have a huge fleet in the past that might have sailed into the New World.

Very interesting thread! I'm going to Star and Flag this one.

reply to post by Synyster

I agree with you Synyster it does look like the flame of a candle. I don't think it is upside down. The sides being open equally around it right where the flame would be to give it oxygen to continue to burn. There might have even been a bowl that sat on top for heating up water or keeping food warm. Perhaps it was just a decorative torch holder for ceremonies. I wonder if it has a reservoir below to hold oil like a lamp.

Originally posted by skeptic1
Looks similar to this (designs), Ming Dynasty Bronze Vase:




For a larger image: Larger photo:

VERY close. If is Ming it is still worth a bunch of money!!!

By no means am I an authority on artistic styles and their sources, but this thread has been extremely interesting. As much as I would love for it to be, I find it very unlikely that it is Atlantean. The issue there is age more than anything. I can't imagine sumething under water that long being that well preserved.

Lets take a look at where and why it was found where it was. Assuming the owner's information about the location of it's final resting place are accurate. I think off which coast of Florida is pertinent. If it's from any civilization not from central or south america makes it even more unlikely it is as old as the photos make it appear. Lets take in to consideration why it's in the ocean in the first place. Most artifacts found off the coast of Florida (and the surrounding areas) are one of two things, objects made from silver and gold, and the actual monetary coins made from silver and gold (some from the very objects taken from the region months or years before). That being said the fact that the artifact is still in it's original composition tells me that it was lost at sea leaving it's region of origin heading toward parts unknown to be melted down into whomever's currecy "obtained" the object. My best uneducated guess - made in the americas, lost at sea, in route to an european country to to be melted down into that countries currency.

Excellent OP. Thank you for showing these pics.

What I notice with them is the lack of 'writing', as what I see is decorations on a metal (possibly iron by the looks of it). And those decorations may well belong to a sea-faring culture, as witnessed by the Dolphin motives.

I also noted the typical and stylized square shapes that have been commented on by another poster. These shapes are relatively consistent with many ancient cultures who used circular versions of the same thing for decorations. The actual shapes refer to the process of entering the world for incarnation, which you can find info on in many works to do with Druidry, and the previous Wessex culture.

This object reminds me of something found here in Australia a long time ago, which I have seen with my own eyes thanks to the current carer's ability to share his research with us. They are of equal size, although the one found here in a silted up lake that used to have a seaward entrance is made of a different metal and has been dated to the Egypto-grecian period.

I look forward to seeing how the research into this object goes, if it does.

[edit on 24-9-2008 by Tayesin]

Thank you for the post Skyfloating, it is most intriguing.
Do you happen to know what it weighs? (Please forgive if this has already been asked.) I have no knowledge of metals but perhaps knowing the weight could help determine the type of material it is. Although it does have resemblance (IMO) to some Chinese artifacts, especially the objects that look like the letter E protruding from the sides, it doesn't seem to me to be as ornate as other Chinese artifacts. One would think there
would be many experts out there that would love the challenge of determining the origin (I certainly would!) of the object, the task now is finding one of them. Oh and a trustworthy one at that! Good luck and please, please keep us updated.

reply to post by curiositydidnotkillthecat


In addition to knowing its weight, which is an excellent question, it would be useful to also know its volume.

Just stick it in a sink/bathtub/etc and measure how much water id displaces. Knowing the weight and the volume should go a long way towards tleling what it is made from.

Originally posted by Skyfloating

the upper rim, specifically where the arrow pattern comes to the point, catches my eye. not sure why. maybe because it's brighter and more greyish. it reminds me of worn down metal from overuse. is this just a trick of the eye due to the photo angle, regular ocean wear-and-tear, or an indication of the object's original position/use?

excellent object. fascinating thread.

Possibility of existence!!!

Aztec .. that mas to be thinking about being??

2000 years? NOT...

Incredible!! Maximum has 500.

Not to believe the exage...

EXCELLENT!!

reply to post by asmall89


Anychance that it could have fallen (for lack of a better word) from a Spanish ship during their campaign against the Aztecs?

Anyone know if there were any major or minor battles involving Spanish losses off the Florida coast?