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School suspends boy for anti-Obama shirt

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posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 08:50 AM
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Originally posted by tezzajw

We don't have free speech on ATS. We sign in as members and agree to abide by terms and conditions - that's not freedom of speech. We have moderators who act appropriately to uphold the terms and conditions. True freedom of speech on ATS would not require moderators and the site would quickly degenerate into a cesspool.


Precisely. I think the schools would degenerate to nothing but hate speech, gangs and disrespect. The kid can wear his shirt off school grounds if he wants.




posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 08:52 AM
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Originally posted by SectionEight
If I were this kids parents, I'd be contacting a lawyer and a t-shirt company. This has the potential to be a million dollar overnight sensation.


so long as we can wear a "mccain is a nazis best freind" tee shirt. or how about "mccain gives good lynchings" tee shirt. or how about "mccain the Klu kluks klans best freind" tee shirt.

[edit on 23-9-2008 by jimmyx]



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 08:53 AM
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reply to post by walkinghomer
 


On a theoretical level. No.

On a practical level, I see it this way:

This is really pretty simple-- if you're concerned about political speech in school, then why the hell did they actually ask the children to "show their patriotism for the United States"????

Get it?



[edit on 23-9-2008 by loam]



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 08:59 AM
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reply to post by mopusvindictus
 

I like the story about your T shirt. you must have gone to a very liberal school to have had teachers that appreciated your sense of humor. I was in high school in Dallas in the mid 60s and was suspended for 3 days for wearing a maroon t shirt that had the nonsense message BULLSHIRT across the chest. Talk about a bunch of misguided, uptight, humorless fashion nazis. Politics are one of the things that need to be taught, in a truthful non opinionated manner without focus on irrational name calling. I would have had the child remove the shirt and not have made an issue of it. If it had been based on facts, I might not have.



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:00 AM
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reply to post by Solarskye
 



Originally posted by Solarskye
...a shirt accusing Obama of being a terrorists...


Read the shirt again. That is NOT what it says.



Originally posted by Solarskye
We as members have freedom of speech but we can't say anything we want here on ATS.


That is because this is a PRIVATE website. Not a public school.

I guess details don't concern you much.



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:01 AM
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Originally posted by jimmyx

Originally posted by SectionEight
If I were this kids parents, I'd be contacting a lawyer and a t-shirt company. This has the potential to be a million dollar overnight sensation.


so long as we can wear a "mccain is a nazis best freind" tee shirt. or how about "mccain gives good lynchings" tee shirt. or how about "mccain the Klu kluks klans best freind" tee shirt.

[edit on 23-9-2008 by jimmyx]


Free speech capitalism throw in some apple pie and you got the american dream. Go for it. I predict yours will be considered hate speech and you will spend all your money defending yourself in court while this kid retires to the Bahamas at age 12.

[edit on 23-9-2008 by SectionEight]



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:05 AM
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reply to post by SectionEight
 


I have no doubt the are signing a contract with Fox as we speak.

This is JUST the kind of thing the NWO needs to distract people from the real issues at hand - the candidates actual platforms and policies....



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:05 AM
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reply to post by loam
 


Oh I'm sorry, I guess accusing him of being a "terrorist's best friend" is what I should of political incorrectly said. Whatever!

Believe me when I say I hate " government schools ". They're not public. But you can't go around as an eleven year old boy with hate speech on your T-shirt whether it's true or not. And this is just my opinion.



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:07 AM
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Originally posted by jimmyx
so long as we can wear a "mccain is a nazis best freind" tee shirt.


Acceptable.


Originally posted by jimmyx
"mccain gives good lynchings"


Actionable in a court of law.


Originally posted by jimmyx
"mccain the Klu kluks klans best freind"


Acceptable.

----

Try and figure out why the difference...



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:09 AM
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reply to post by Solarskye
 



Originally posted by Solarskye
Oh I'm sorry, I guess accusing him of being a "terrorist's best friend" is what I should of political incorrectly said. Whatever!


Denying ignorance is stating the facts and then your opinion about them-- not changing the facts to suit your opinion.



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:09 AM
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reply to post by Solarskye
 


I do not see your logic here. How is something hate speech if it is true? And I do not see how this phrase is hate speech. Can you please explain yourself.



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:10 AM
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Originally posted by walkinghomer
So, If my child went to school with a shirt that says, "Republicans, Home of Child Molesters" would you approve that?


It's not about whether anyone approves. It's about asking for a political statement of patriotism and then getting something unexpected and censoring it.

If there is a school policy against talk of terrorism or homemade sayings on T-shirts or something like that, then I can understand the school's position. But that would mean anyone with a homemade t-shirt would have to be suspended AND if a t-shirt said, "Obama Will Wipe Out Terrorism", it would be against the rules, too.

We don't know enough about this situation to make a judgment because we don't know the school's policy and we don't know the reason the shirt was disallowed.



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:11 AM
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What a delima! Well, I don't think the writing on the shirt "shows patriotism." It is political in nature. I think the school was right. Children don't have enough maturity to comprehend the meaning of this shirt. I am sure the school was thinking of the problems wearing this could cause. Disruption in class. The parents should be ashamed. It dosen't matter who's name was on it. Just my opinion. Great post!



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:11 AM
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Originally posted by DJMessiah
Elementary schools are not grounds for free speech. School's rules trump Constitutional rights. You can't just wear anything you want and do anything you want in an Elementary school and claim it's ok to do so because the constitution protects you.

If this were the case, teachers would be teaching things to your children that geared towards their political views, from pre-k on.


OK, So if we can't start our children off by having freedom of speech or what have you in Elementary Schools ...
When do you turn that around ..??
When they are in Intermediate??

Maybe not ... Let's wait now untill they are in HIGH SCHOOL.

No wait ... I think it should only be when they are far gone out of high school ...

NO NO .. yet, again ... I think it should be when children are in College ..

Or wait ... maybe you shouldn't have any of your rights UNLESS you are a COLLEGE GRADUATE ... Yeah ... I have finally come to an end to the madness .. You can only have your rights .. if you have went through 4 years of college and have obtained your DEGREE ...

Shall I go on as to how royally F'ed this situation is >?



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:19 AM
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It's threads like this that make me realize why we are where we are in this country. :shk:

reply to post by PammyK
 



Originally posted by PammyK
Well, I don't think the writing on the shirt "shows patriotism." It is political in nature.


Showing patriotism is not political in nature?


Are you serious?



Originally posted by PammyK
Children don't have enough maturity to comprehend the meaning of this shirt.


At 11?
Again, are you serious?



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:23 AM
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Originally posted by DJMessiah
Elementary schools are not grounds for free speech. School's rules trump Constitutional rights. You can't just wear anything you want and do anything you want in an Elementary school and claim it's ok to do so because the constitution protects you.



The School is probably in trouble as their own paperwork is going to get them.


Paperwork submitted by the school district says Daxx Dalton was not suspended for wearing the shirt, but for willful disobedience and defiance.



You are correct about schools having clothing guidlines, however I bet this shirt fit within those guidelines as they said they didn't suspend him for the shirt.

He wouldn't have been disobedient or defiant if that hadn't made him try to change his shirt. He was in trouble for the shirt, which probably was within school guidelines as there was nothing obscene about it. If they don't allow political shirts they will have to prove that they have had everyone remove all other political shirts as well. Nice try with the "oh we didn't suspend him for his shirt".



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:24 AM
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Originally posted by SolarskyeBut you can't go around as an eleven year old boy with hate speech on your T-shirt whether it's true or not.


Errr, I'm not too sure why you think there was hate speech on that t-shirt.

Just because a statement does not align with your views doesn't make it "hate speech."

The school also acted too rashly. When I was in grade 9 or 10, this kid showed up to school dressed as a KKK member for Halloween. Complete with the KKK hat and ripped off sleeves displaying swastikas on both arms. He went through the whole day without a complaint from a teacher.

He got his ass kicked after school by some natives and east indians, but thats besides the point.

I understand the rules are different up here in Canada, but I would bet that if I walked into either Elementary or Secondary school wearing a similar political shirt about Stephen Harper or Stephane Dion, nothing would happen. When I was in school the only times I've seen a student forced to change is when their shirt displays vulgarity or too much skin.

I had an Arch Enemy shirt with "PURE F***ING METAL" emblazoned on the back in big bold letters. It was one of my favorite shirts and I wore it at least once a week. I got told to take it off very few times.

Ben realizes hes rambling again

What I'm trying to get at is the school made a big deal about nothing. Probably just some over zealous Obama fanatic teacher that got all bent out of shape for seeing their messiah get dissed.


[edit on 23-9-2008 by ben420]

[edit on 23-9-2008 by ben420]



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:24 AM
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I think after Columbine schools are on the look out for odd, anti social etc behaviour and may have felt the shirt threatened other students and staff in some way. After all what do we do with terrorists? We kill them. Are you with us or against us? If you are friends with terrorists we kill you.

Obama supporters = terrorist supporters?

Free speech is a cherished right of mine and I am for free speech. I think the school administrators may have felt that the shirt was incendiary free speech and not condusive to a supportive learning atmosphere. Besides I am sure many of you message boarders can appreciate what happens with political baiting (trolling). I can just imagine the reply t-shirts and escalation of t-shirt flaming like:
"McCain supports adultery" "GOP for annonymous gay bathroom sex"



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:25 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


I agree, we need more info on the school's policies. However the school itself said he wasn't suspended for the shirt. That implies the shirt was within guidelines.



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by ninthaxis
reply to post by Solarskye
 


I do not see your logic here. How is something hate speech if it is true? And I do not see how this phrase is hate speech. Can you please explain yourself.


OK you want the truth so here it goes. It's speech that I don't like and I call it hate speech. It's just my opinion of the T-shirt. Whether you call it something else doesn't matter to me.



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