Stock Markets On Monday

reply to post by MatrixBaller04

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Oh, thanks for clearing that up for me Matrix. Its almost surreal that we have to look at these measures as a realistic means of survival in the event of a global meltdown. But, I think we (at least some of us) have learned from the past and are taking precautionary measures.. I just wish that we would have been more cautious from the door so maybe we wouldn't be in this situation at all..

History repeats itself.

All the rich will be selling tommorow. The poor who can't afford stocks will buy using a line of credit since the prices will be so cheap since the rich have sold. The fact that people who can't fully afford buying stocks with there own money will cause even more problems for the economy.

A few days or a couple of weeks of this will no doubt cause a full fall of all stocks and the economy.

The rich are selling everything and investing in Gold. Watch out for gold to hit record numbers this week.

Well, lets have a look at the dow jones futures:

www.bloomberg.com...

DOWN 147 right now already ...

So I would say the index will follow the futures...

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Terrapop]

reply to post by Terrapop

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Your link didn't work for me but it might just be my browser. Thats nuts though if its already down 147.. I guess my morning coffee will be more interesting then usual thanks to cnbc. I hate watching them, but I like to watch the markets and such..

Its Monday in Asia and they are getting some Bernanke money too
In about 7 hours London will be open and they've got some Paulson money.
Its all a big party on the Benanke/Paulson money.

this thread made me think of another that a friend of mine made, and i am very concerned to be completely honest. What stocks should i begin to buy every week? I believe that america is heading towards something to rival the depression, i believe this partly because i just wrote the above sentence. does anyone else remember a few years ago when a stock market scare was reported on every channel and the stocks basicly acted exactly like the predictions because everyone was scared NOT to SELL SELL SELL? i don't follow the numbers specificly but i remember this being a major event and good object lesson? anyone know the specifics of that event? anyway, should i buy up livestock and crop related stocks? what other investments will prosper the most in a failing economy? i really would like guidance on this.

Oopps!

DJ futures down -198.00 now... tanking further.

reply to post by Terrapop

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You all are focused on the wrong market. It is not accurate to judge the state of the US economy on the Dow. The depression of 1929 was caused by the crash of the stock market because everyone owned stock. When everyone had finished buying, the market was only left with selling pressure. Brokers then began to call in margin loans causing individuals to liquidate creating more selling pressure which very quickly led to an outright panic.

Today the majority of middle class do not own stock. Therefore a stock market crash will only be an effect and not the cause as it was in 1929. I am not an economist but would imagine that the factor that would lead to a financial crisis this time around is going to hyperinflation.

BTW I'll make an amateur prediction on the Dow. The Dow will close tomorrow around the close of Friday. The Dow will spend the next few weeks trading in the range of 11,600 and 10,400. Once it breaks the 10400 range you can expect it to decline to around 9600 before any significant rebound.

reply to post by harvib

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Sorry, you are very wrong concerning the middle class. Most do in the form of 401k, insurance, RRSP, RESP, Education savings plans, stock plans at work..ie if you work at Best Buy as a manager you are given stock as part of your perks....so most middle class Americans and Canadians do own stock.

You may have meant that most are not active in the market as traders. This is true.

Anyhow, the Dow, Nasdaq, S and P, and TSE futures are all down. This is a good bearing to take on the weekend.

Asia is betting against US dollars now as US debt will rise.

Credit default swaps (a derivative) are, for the first time that I have ever seen, are going against the US betting that they may default on US Treasurey Debt.

Commodities are ..brent at 99 ho down, gold up, silver up, copper up, wheat up,corn up, soybeans up, sweet crude up, etc

Constuction starts are all down in US and Eastern Canada

Big movers Walmart futures down, chevron down, citigroup down, metlife down, JP morgan up, GE up, yahoo down, costco down....

SO it will be a mixed week is my guess tending toward a BEAR....

reply to post by whiteraven

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You miss the point. The crash of 1929 was so devastating because a large portion of the population including the middle class had their savings in the stock market. This is not true of today’s middle class. A stock market crash will not be this century’s financial crisis even though admittedly it may be its effect.

reply to post by MatrixBaller04

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I think they will soar because of this crazy rushed bailout that congress is trying to put together. The soar in the stock market will make everyone feel better and they'll forget about the problem for a few more days. Seriously, this is like putting bandaids on an amputated leg.

Here is my uneducated .02. I imagine that confidence overseas (outside America, that is) will be emboldened somewhat. Why not? Paulson and Bernanke are on the record saying the US will absorb THEIR debt also! (Which is insane, imo!)

If I were a Japanese Gov. official I would be urging the investment industries to pump as much debt as they could and then ask for the bailout option. Why? Because this gives me a firm voice in the economic well-being of another nation.

So, in the morning we will see a quick drop in prices (rats abandoning ship) but by the end of the day they will level out somewhat.

But as another poster mentioned above (,actually several) this is just a bandaid. A short term fix put in place to allow the rest of the cronies to sell out before the bottom falls out in the next couple of weeks. It is my opinion that something bad is going to come of this. Something worse than market manipulation.

What I can't get over is the OBVIOUS *bs* in the draft bill due to be put before the legislature. $700 billion at any given time while at the same time raising the debt ceiling by $2 trillion. Since the legislation was written with the statute that it cannot be ruled on by any court of law, they will raise this $700 billion figure once they cannot resale the debt. NOBODY is going to buy it. This is why we see the futures and world markets betting against the dollar.

Eh, at some point, the dollar will completely fail in the worlds' eyes and that is going to come sooner rather than later unless there is some MAJOR strong-arming going on. Probably in the form of bombs.

False flag op to occur very soon.

Edit to add: The US gov called the dealer a long time ago when they decided to strong arm developing nations into holding on to their securities. This is a deadly gambit. The only end of which is all out warfare against anyone who opposes your economic imperialism. We are about to see the dealer's hand.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Jay-in-AR]

It'll be up 200 points on the dow and by 3/4 through the day it will freefall 350.

150 down tomorrow.

Money market accounts will be overdrawn placing numerous new banks in the hot seat by the end of the week.

By Friday, we will hear of at least 2 more majors out of luck, Toyota & GM merger talks, Microsoft buying a virtual bank and a major network changing hands. These are just silly predictions of course. Or are they. LOL.

1 Trillion dollars? That's a BAND AID! This economy needs serious stitches and a nice IV bag of antibiotics for its post surgery MRSA infection. The MRSA being our good old pseudo elected officials. Let's also keep in mind that the 1T is real time money. Not debt transfers / bonds or futures or any kind of extended use instrument. It's a water soluble cork in the leaking hoover dam. I wish I had a nice incorporated ponzi scheme like these bastards... The fraud would be covered up so long as there's at least one politician or friend of one on the board/ladder.


[edit on 21-9-2008 by Atlantican]

Agreed, however you will find another false front at the stockexchange this week a roller coaster to be certain, however it will look as if this staged rise is benifiting you, that is until you go to shop for food and fill up the tank.

Per the text of the draft:


That's $700 BILLION at ANY ONE TIME.
That means they can spend $700B on junk mortgage securities, sell off $300B, and buy another $300B worth - just as long as their total purchases at any one time does not exceed $700B. Over and over and over if they so please.

The language of the drafted legislation has this agency in existence for at least two years.
It also increases the national debt limit by nearly TWO TRILLION DOLLARS, enough to run though that $700B limit two times plus a wee bit. Of course, Congress can increase this debt limit at a later date as needed.

So, yes, it is unlimited funding.
No, I don't know where the money is going to come from.

As to what the markets will do tomorrow - I think it's going to depend on how well other countries understand this draft. If they realize they can sell off their bad mortgage securities debt to us, I expect foreign markets will do okay.
The American markets will depend on what WaMu does, IMO. If they find a buyer, the markets will do well.

Dow futures are at -105.00 at the time of this post.

This thing could very easily end up costing 6 trillion dollars. Fannie and Freddie hold 5.3 trillion in mortgages. Opening bell monday morning is going to be interesting to say the least. i wouldn't be surprised if Paulson and Bernake close the market within the first hour of trading because it takes a huge dump

Yeah....the wife and I went to Costco and stocked up on the non-perishables today. It was sort of sureal actually. People were buying big screen tv's and a miriad of other non-essential "pleasure" items. Sheeple indeed! Meanwhile, we had flats and flats of canned goods, water, batteries, etc. We got a few wrinkled brows, but hey, I'd rather have than have not. When people are lining up for food and water, well, we're one of the few that actually paid attention and made contingency plans. We've taken cash out here and there and stocked up on some ammo, no armory mind you, but enough to protect the family for a while should the bottom really drop out.

What does the market have in store tomorrow? Who really know? My guess is it'll be mostly down while people wait to see what happens - and then - look for more bombs to start dropping.

Good luck out there folks and get your house in order! You just might actually need it.

I think the answer depends on what "they" decide it will do. Our market has been mortally compromised. The fact that it now goes against what logic & sound financial models predict it should do is proof of this. Oil prices skyrocket based on proof there's no supply & demand issue, gold drops precipitously alongside the US dollar, incolvent debt is merely shifted from a self contained single conglomerate entity on the market to an overall, across the board government/tax payer at-risk holding and the market climbs historically fast. None of it is making any sense.

Either our entire financial market has become so intertwined that one failing conglomerate acts like pulling a loose string on a sweater and unravels the entire market, or there's a major behind the scenes force working here to ensure the market does exactly what "they" want it to do for their own personal gain. Either way, it's been tragically compromised and very well may never be trustworthy again.

If I was a betting man, I'd say that the market will spend the first half of the week in a roller coaster with extreme gains and extreme losses over the course of the day, but return to basically the same spot it opened the day at by the end of trading. Then, after Congress has nationalized all of that bad debt and signed away our nation's future wealth, who knows? Will it be a quick, bloody death as "they" now have what they want and decide to implode the markets... or will they allow us to twist on the line for a few weeks? a few months? years? Who's to say?

the stock market- which is really the realm of monied market makers, the large fund managers, and day traders...& not the public at large
will take advantage of the financials that have mortgage-based-assets as a large portion of their business.
and even those will be exploited quickly---as the unacceptable risk level of that sector of stocks is very near the present price of those stocks.

IOW-- there isn't very much of a profit in buying the mortgage originators
as the gov't bailout is not in place yet (the bailout package is not expected to be finalized until this Friday, 26 Sept '08, at the earliest)
And it is too speculative to think that the gov't agency will buy the troubled mortgage-related-assets at 100% face value...many suggest the value of this garbage paper will be selling for anywhere from 22cents to 80cents on the dollar,


as far as other sectors of the wider market... the momentum players will be in the drivers seat, & who knows what they see for the future and back up their bets with money into the stock market...

the market may well move in a 10,900-11,800 trading range all week, or at least till the bailout package becomes law... there surely will be rumors and 'leaks' about the bailout that will make market swings,
it is surely not a time for me to be involved in either buying or selling in the stock market

The Dow shouldn't move downward, because the Securities and Exchange Commission put short sellers temporarily out of action. They got banned until October 2.

The Asian market is a good indicator how other traders feel about the situation that extends beyond Wall Street.
www.cnbc.com... a+stock+market&__source=SI_28965595_999687646_1
No one seems to be freaking out in Asia, so why would Wall St?