A place for actual Proof of 9/11 events

reply to post by Zepherian


I am sorry, did I say thermal expansion is proof? In fact, i called it a "new phenomena." Yes, I meant that just as sincerely as I am sure those at NIST did when they finished making it up. Thanks for offering me this one little nugget.

So called, "truthers" cannot wait to jump on someone and attack them with little or nothnig to go with. I never said that I believed the 'official' story. I never even hinted as much. In fact, most people with a fundamental understanding of english would have gathered by now that I am full of questions and suspicions.

Unfortunately, since I did not wear my "truther" badge on the way in, I got attacked by truthers, attemtping to derail this thread instead of offer any substance. Way to go guys. Tear each other down and let the real criminals keep on doing what they do. Isn that how they get away with this crap in the first place? Pitting us against each other to distract?

Way to fall for it. Almost everyone that posted so far has attacked me as someone supporting the government story when I never said either way what I believed but reading the context or checking any other post I have made would have offered that up real quick. No wonder this goes nowhere. You are all too busy worrying about making a post that your buddies will star than actually saying anything real.

Neither side has offered up proof but I am amazed at how 'truthers' have fallen all over themselves to attack another one of their own kind simply because he has not made that clear yet and the thread title almost purports to support the governmenet.

So much for common sense huh.

reply to post by MorningStar8741


This is such a waste of time Morningstar.

There is a Buffalo Wild Wings opening up in about a month where I live now. I loved BWW3 when I lived in Las Vegas. Don't know why this very small franchise decided to open one of their restaurants here in this desert, but it gave me a bit of comfort knowing that it will be here. As a person that "doesn't matter", I look forward to the simple things that I enjoy and can have a sense of control over. Managing my happiness if you will.

I, most of the time, fear absolutely nothing. But sometimes I fear tremendously because I have to deal with the fear that others experiences.

You are not going to convince the mainstream that 9/11 was in FACT an inside job. Never in a million years. Even if the mainstream suspects inside job, they are too cowardly to act. I seriously have no faith in humanity or their search for truth. Truth only exists inside the self and only one individual, at this point, could have the moral and physical strength to sacrafice themselves for the benefit for said humanity.

Who will step up to the plate??? No one in America, the major superpower, and that includes myself. And the reason is that the powers that be have us by the balls. They understand that relationships are key and as long as they can keep us lonely and desperate for love, they are winning.

Any free person understands 9/11 is an inside job. It's just common sense. It's just harder to get laid knowing the truth, now that's the real conspiracy!!!

reply to post by pccat

I'm sorry that I don't have definitive proof of either "inside job" or "official story", no one does except those who were there.. or those who may have done the planning..

Then why bother posting anything at all.

Is there suddenly a shortage of places to speak your mind about 9/11?

If you have no proof either way, you have no reason to post.

This is pretty simple kids.

reply to post by JimBeam


PROOF

PROOF

PROOF

This is not a vague 9/11 so everyone express their opinion here thread. It has a title. Read it before posting.

I don't understand why you are being so rude to everyone that has taken the time to read your thread and respond to it. I think that everyone has been pretty much on topic because if they were not they would have had their comments removed by the mods.

Anyway, I will attempt to answer your question. As far as proof goes, the only peice of evidence that I have been taken by was the fact that the towers fell in about 9 seconds. If you were to drop a vacuum from the top of one of the towers it would take about 10 seconds to fall at free fall speed with no resistance. How would the towers fall in under 10 seconds with each floor providing at least one second of resistance?? I would have to conclude that there was something planted, weather it was bombs or chemicals to help melt the steel. How else would they fall at free fall speed?

Originally posted by imd12c4funn
Common Sense is no joke.

Your kind of common sense IS a joke, because it's the same kind of "common sense" that used to hold that the Earth was flat and the center of the universe.

QED.

Originally posted by MorningStar8741
reply to post by pccat

 

I'm sorry that I don't have definitive proof of either "inside job" or "official story", no one does except those who were there.. or those who may have done the planning..

Then why bother posting anything at all.

Is there suddenly a shortage of places to speak your mind about 9/11?

If you have no proof either way, you have no reason to post.

This is pretty simple kids.

yes very simple.. you asked for proof.. I gave the proof that I had.. not that the official story was correct.. but that the claims of impossibility were false.. so at least I tried to respect your thread and answer appropriately..

by the way, this thread it turns out, was started just to bait ThroatYogurt into another discussion..

and you fully well know what I was saying too.. there is no definitive proof either way.. not 100% at least, so what exactly are you trying to do here.. play king and throw everyone else down the hill because they cannot provide the ultimate truth for you? so you get to hang around acting authoratative and simply dismiss everyone's thoughts on the subject?

Originally posted by KaginD
I don't understand why you are being so rude to everyone that has taken the time to read your thread and respond to it.

I think that everyone has been pretty much on topic because if they were not they would have had their comments removed by the mods.

Anyway, I will attempt to answer your question. As far as proof goes, the only peice of evidence that I have been taken by was the fact that the towers fell in about 9 seconds. If you were to drop a vacuum from the top of one of the towers it would take about 10 seconds to fall at free fall speed with no resistance. How would the towers fall in under 10 seconds with each floor providing at least one second of resistance?? I would have to conclude that there was something planted, weather it was bombs or chemicals to help melt the steel. How else would they fall at free fall speed?

I am being rude for two main reasons.

One, anything other than proof is off topic and there are plenty of other places to just get your points up.

Two, because I have been accused at least 3 times of supporting the government story in this thread when -

a-there is no such thing anywhere to be found
b-if you were to read any other post I made anywhere, you would know that nothing could be farther from the truth

So to sum up. I am rude because when opening a place for the people who claim to have proven things to offer that proof, what I got instead was a bunch of 'truthers' tripping over themselves to be the first one to land a sucker punch on the G Man and his supporting thread.

I made it clear. If you have nothing to offer, do not even ring the bell.

And as for being rude to people that have taken the time to read my thread, if they actually read it, they would not have claimed I support the 'official' story since it never hints at that, never claims it, never leans that way, never mentions it at all. The title is all they read and they came running in here to insult me.

Well done. Now what part of do not post if you have nothing to post is so hard to understand.

IF YOU ARE NOT ONE OF THE BLOWHARDS RUNNING FROM THREAD TO THREAD CLAIMING THAT CASES ARE CLOSED AND IT HAS BEEN PROVEN, THEN YOU HAVE NOTHING TO SAY HERE.

It is that simple. Let the people who claim they know of all this proof and have even proven things themselves come here and spill it or let it die.

The other thing that makes me rude is that it bothers me to see two pages of 'truthers' trying to attack each other in a place for the opposition to spew it's 'proof.'

How many times does this need to be said?

What is it about your opinion that you think is so special that it deserves to be heard ANYWHERE ANYTIME? I respect what everyone thinks and feels. Unfortunately, there are places for the expression of that. You cannot go into a thread about WTC7 and talk about what happend in PA. That must be frustrating to be so limited so why not come here where it seems wide open to say whatever you like on the subject.

NO.

It just does not work that way. I refuse to have another thread of bickering and attacks and this one team against the other mentality that makes everyone feel that they need to add something, no matter how pointless.

Stop it!

If you have an opinion to express, find the appropriate thread or make one yourself.

If you have any actualy proof. We all know what proof is. Proof is the kind of thing that everyone sees and goes, oh well that's proof.

If you want to debate what qualifies as proof, go start that thread.

If you want to debate anything at all about the OP, go start that thread.

If you have proof of anything.

Post it here.

Originally posted by MorningStar8741
reply to post by JimBeam

 

PROOF

PROOF

PROOF

This is not a vague 9/11 so everyone express their opinion here thread. It has a title. Read it before posting.

The government is not going to give you the PROOF, which is needed to investigate them. So YOU as a responsible citizen HAVE to hold them accountable. The government is not ONE citizen, they are not innocent until proven guilty. It is up to them to prove that all the goings on that day actually HAPPENED the way they said it did. And so far, the OS has too many HOLES in it. THERE'S YOUR EVIDENCE.

They don't want to answer questions so you have to, at the VERY LEAST, assume that they are complicit in the attacks because they are WITHHOLDING evidence and avoiding serious questions.

Originally posted by pccat

Originally posted by MorningStar8741
reply to post by pccat

 

I'm sorry that I don't have definitive proof of either "inside job" or "official story", no one does except those who were there.. or those who may have done the planning..

Then why bother posting anything at all.

Is there suddenly a shortage of places to speak your mind about 9/11?

If you have no proof either way, you have no reason to post.

This is pretty simple kids.

yes very simple.. you asked for proof.. I gave the proof that I had.. not that the official story was correct.. but that the claims of impossibility were false.. so at least I tried to respect your thread and answer appropriately..

by the way, this thread it turns out, was started just to bait ThroatYogurt into another discussion..

and you fully well know what I was saying too.. there is no definitive proof either way.. not 100% at least, so what exactly are you trying to do here.. play king and throw everyone else down the hill because they cannot provide the ultimate truth for you? so you get to hang around acting authoratative and simply dismiss everyone's thoughts on the subject?

I did not completely disparage your post because it was an actual attempt. This entire thread is to bait everyone who claims to have proven something. Yes yogurt gave me the idea. He claims stuff was proven and cannot show where and when pressed, ignores it.

He is not the only one though. There are quite a few around here and this is for all of them. It is not bait. If they offer real proof, what will I have to say? I will be put in my place along with alot of other people. I will still be happy though for finally having at least something here put to rest for a change. Wouldn't you like that?

This thread is for noone in particular and you can give yogurt all the credit you like simply because we both know he is the loudest voice on EVERY single thread claiming that things have been proven. Perhaps that is his and your problem. I could care less who presents the proof or what side it supports. I will just be happy to see it.

If there isn't any, well then I guess the next time ANYONE claims that it has already been proven, I can correctly point out that it has not.

Okay, I gave my opinion because thats about all you are going to get out of this thread. Opinions. Unfortunately, there has not been any official proof of what happened that day. Its just a bunch of hear say being thrown around loosely. In a situation like this, you have to gather as many thoughts as you can and come up with what you think to be true. I stated what I thought to be "true". Thats not to say that it is a fact, just my version of what happened. You have to understand that I kinda see this as a trick question in a way. But, I respect all member on ATS and try to give each member the respect that I would want in return. You should try to do the same. It just makes ATS a more pleasant place.

I never insulted you and I never said that you made any claims about weather 9-11 was an inside job. Just wanted to clear up.

reply to post by JimBeam and KaginD



I did not ask the government to give me proof. I do not want anything from the government.

I did not ask for opinions.

I did not ask for a post about how all you posted was opinions.

I simply asked you to go somewhere else if you had nothing truly on topic to add.

Thank you for showing how well truthers can read the most basic instruction repeated a dozen times.

[edit on 9/20/08 by MorningStar8741]

I guess most if not all of us need to be able to agree on what "proof" actually is..

in court, its proof beyond a reasonable doubt.. which in and of itself is subjective.. either to a jury or a judge..

in science its definitive proof.. beyond all shadow of doubt..

we all, have collectively looked at aspects of this subject.. and found very little if any, scientific, definitive, proof.. (either side of the argument)

most of the subject matter is going to wind up in the "beyond reasonable doubt" category..

not much further to go with that..

I'm frustrated too.. but will still try to look..

I did hear a lot about Thermite being found in the basement levels of the WTC site. Here is one of the articles on it.

www.americanfreepress.net...

What logical explanation would there be for a chemical like this being found at the site? I'm up for any ideas on how it would have ended up there. Maybe from the plane?? I doubt it, but I'm no scientist lol. If there is no scientific way for the planes to have caused this chemical to somehow end up there, then I would think that would be proof.

FYI,
Since no one has submitted any evidence other than my exibit #1, and there was no objection when submitted, then as prima facia evidence, which is the only evidence submitted, and has not been rebutted according to procedure,
You are obligated by law and have no other option than to concede that my exibit #1 is in fact evidential proof and award a decision in my favor, hence the judgement must be that I and I alone have proven my case.

So you just got the proof you required.

I just waited until now to see if you would rebutt the evidence, not just toss loosely your opinion about it and call it a joke.

Now, I have one request.

Prove that I didn't beat your thread.

reply to post by imd12c4funn


I'm with you on that one. Common sense is something I can't argue against or debate. Thats about all you can depend on when it comes to cover ups and things to that effect..

[edit on 20-9-2008 by KaginD]

Excuse me,

Originally posted by imd12c4funn
Since no one has submitted any evidence other than my exibit #1, and there was no objection when submitted

I "objected":

Your kind of common sense IS a joke, because it's the same kind of "common sense" that used to hold that the Earth was flat and the center of the universe.

QED.

"Common sense" is two words.

That's all it is.

I'm still trying to decide if you are serious or if this is just some oddball sense of humor. "Common sense" is a layman's cop-out; it has no scientific or empirical merit whatsoever.

Originally posted by imd12c4funn
FYI,
Since no one has submitted any evidence other than my exibit #1, and there was no objection when submitted, then as prima facia evidence, which is the only evidence submitted, and has not been rebutted according to procedure,
You are obligated by law and have no other option than to concede that my exibit #1 is in fact evidential proof and award a decision in my favor, hence the judgement must be that I and I alone have proven my case.

So you just got the proof you required.

I just waited until now to see if you would rebutt the evidence, not just toss loosely your opinion about it and call it a joke.

Now, I have one request.

Prove that I didn't beat your thread.

You offerend nothnig more than the same off topic ramblings that everyone else has.

None of that matters. It was not rejected.

Waiting for proof that I did not beat this thread.

P.S. see my signature.

I'll add one thing, and this is a personal pov:

Anyone that needs an official authoritive sanction to consider something true is severly lacking in the thought processes. The reality the 911 is so obvious in the light of all the available information that asking for "proof proof proof" at the individual is moronic and pointless.

Who will prove it to you? The authorities that were compromised by being part of the plan? Or the professionals you will descredit for being truthers?

Normal, intelligent human beings don't need proof, they extrapolate from available information. Proof is necessary for group processes. And this thread is not a trial. If it were thousands of people would be putting in more effort at supplying the proof that is out there and glad to be doing so.

As it is this seems to be little more than a troll thread, and the unintelligible and rather rude U2U's I got from the thread author only served to reinforce me this notion.

911 has been documented to death already, and the debunk attempts have been beyond weak. It was an inside job.