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Police arrest UK woman for "offensive" child's toy in window

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posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 11:58 AM
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Originally posted by 44soulslayerThus if a gollywog is a doll based upon black racial features, why is it racist?


It it is not just the doll and its features.

It is the full history of the gollywog.

Go do some research please.

[edit on 22/9/2008 by skibtz]




posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 12:06 PM
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reply to post by skibtz
 


Its your interpretation that the doll is based on racist motifs such as the Jim Crow stereotype/ wandering minstrals.

I dont find it inherently racist, since it was based on a popular artform of its day.

Whether or not the doll has a place in modern society is up for debate, but it is certainly not appropriate to use litigation against someone who "displays" it.

Besides, what is the definition of a gollywog anyway? What if someone made a black doll with the same features, and it looked the same as a gollywog?

[edit on 22-9-2008 by 44soulslayer]



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 12:06 PM
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Originally posted by skibtz
reply to post by johnsky
 

You accept that racism exists in the world right?

Yes?

Good.

Well if we cant use the law to protect and prosecute because it would be racist in itself then what the eff do you do?

Quickly.

You have a chance to redeem yourself with your next intelligent, well-thought out post......................


Making a witch hunt out of it is unacceptable, counter-productive, and quite frankly, I don't have time for counter-productive people. I run my life like I run a business... and I don't do business with people who waste the businesses finances on petty personal issues.

and here's another point, you've got a logic flaw right there, I don't have to redeem myself to you nor anyone else.


So what's with the witch hunt against anything resembling racism?

People who engage in racial laws need to ask themselves,
are you promoting the freedoms of everyone as a whole?
or are you simply on a personal vendetta and wasting our farking time and money?


So what are you doing?

Are you actually promoting equal freedoms?

Or are you just wasting my time?



[edit on 22-9-2008 by johnsky]



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 12:12 PM
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Originally posted by 44soulslayerIts your interpretation that the doll is based on racist motifs such as the Jim Crow stereotype/ wandering minstrals.


Not just me mate.


I dont find it inherently racist, since it was based on a popular artform of its day.


Unless you yourself are personally involved, what you think is irrelevant.


Whether or not the doll has a place in modern society is up for debate, but it is certainly not appropriate to use litigation against someone who "displays" it.


The debate has been had and the consensus is that the doll is inherently racist and provisions in the law made shortly after.


Besides, what is the definition of a gollywog anyway? What if someone made a black doll with the same features, and it looked the same as a gollywog?


Its less to do with the features and more about the whole history.

You are clearly an intelligent person, can you not see how some people may find the doll offensive?

[edit on 22/9/2008 by skibtz]



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 12:21 PM
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Originally posted by johnskyMaking a witch hunt out of it is unacceptable, counter-productive, and quite frankly, I don't have time for counter-productive people. I run my life like I run a business... and I don't do business with people who waste the businesses finances on petty personal issues.


Racism is a serious social crime and is persued by the full force of the law, not a farking witch hunt.

Your trivialisation of racism is vulgar and offensive and if you did run a business I am sure the public would vote with their pockets leaving you living in the gutter where, it could be argued, you belong with such a bankrupt belief system.


People who engage in racial laws need to ask themselves,
are you promoting the freedoms of everyone as a whole?
or are you simply on a personal vendetta and wasting our farking time and money?


The law systems in the UK exist to protect ALL members of the public not the majority.


Or are you just wasting my time?


You do with your time what you will.

You do not have to read my posts and respond to them, however, I appreciate that you have and I thank you for your time.

Just a quick question, do you think society deserves a set of laws that protects members of the public from racial attacks?



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 12:26 PM
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reply to post by skibtz
 


Your comments seem to be getting awfully close to personal attacks. I realize in threads of this nature it is often overlooked when "one side" attacks the otherside by saying they are less intelligent, ignorant, or whatever, but I find it offensive.

Please discuss the issues and stop attacking other posters directly. I believe that violates the T&C's of this site.



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 12:38 PM
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Originally posted by 44soulslayer
blupblup is thoroughly deluded... brainwashed in fact.



No... you are twisting things.

I never said there were no differences between races and we all look the same.


Let me just make this clear now, because i am a little sick of the twisting and deflecting and general BS on this thread.

If you support this woman or think there is nothing wrong with a Golliwog doll, you ARE racist... maybe not directly, but you are aiding and abetting it.

If you don't know that a golliwog is perceived as and is recognized as racist...then EDUCATE yourselves.

We have moved on to now saying the differences between groups of whites and between groups of blacks.... this is not the issue.

The issue is that stereotyping and making/selling/displaying/supporting dolls/cartoons/key-rings and whatever else displaying negative stereotypes and/or racist propaganda, is WRONG.

It's not even a ta-ma-to/ to-ma-to thing, it is wrong.


www.ferris.edu...



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610Your comments seem to be getting awfully close to personal attacks.


But not quite. So your point is?

I made one remark concerning ignorance (which I have now removed) over several posts which address the issue and not the person. You seem to be rather selective my friend.


I realize in threads of this nature it is often overlooked when "one side" attacks the otherside by saying they are less intelligent, ignorant, or whatever, but I find it offensive.




Diddums.

You defend someones right to offend others racially yet you get offended when someone opposes your view?

Laughable.


Please discuss the issues and stop attacking other posters directly. I believe that violates the T&C's of this site.


Racism vioilates the T&Cs of this site and, as you are now requiring strict adhering to the T&Cs, your previous remarks, which I, and others, deem racist in nature, will now be reported to Mods.



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 12:49 PM
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reply to post by Sonya610
 


There is a difference between a doll that is clearly a representation of a person, than a doll that is a blatant racist figure.


Your chinese doll was done tastefully, respectfully and is not a racist stereotype.
The golly and all i list below are!!


www.ferris.edu...


www.capc.co.uk...

www.ferris.edu...

www.ferris.edu...


I really shouldn't have to be pointing this out....you should know it


And no i am not saying you are racist.....You are doing a fine job implying it yourself.





[edit on 9/22/2008 by blupblup]



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 03:23 PM
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Originally posted by skibtzRacism vioilates the T&Cs of this site and, as you are now requiring strict adhering to the T&Cs, your previous remarks, which I, and others, deem racist in nature, will now be reported to Mods.


So you just went back and edited EVERY ONE of your posts in response to my complaint and now you are launching a complaint (with the mods no less, which I did not do becasue I was trying to be nice) against me.

Amazing. And if I have made ONE COMMENT that violents the rules regarding racist material on this site I would love for you to quote it.

[edit on 22-9-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 05:41 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610So you just went back and edited EVERY ONE of your posts in response to my complaint


You are fooling no one Sonya610!

In response to your request for adhering to the T&C, I changed ONE post and not every one as you have misleadingly stated.

I removed 'Your ignorance is embarrassing' from a single post.

Any other edits were to to my poor typing and spelling et al and done before that point.

If you or anyone else needs to check this then ask a mod.


and now you are launching a complaint (with the mods no less, which I did not do becasue I was trying to be nice) against me.


Nice my arse.

Rather than answering any of my questions or responding to any of the points I had raised, you explained how, in your opinion, I had offended you and then threatened me with the T&Cs!

You set the standard when you introduced the T&Cs and how I may have veered from them.

I held my hands up and corrected my single potentially offensive post immediately.

I thought that the standards that you had set were decent and acceptable and so I upheld them with a complaint of my own.


Amazing. And if I have made ONE COMMENT that violents the rules regarding racist material on this site I would love for you to quote it.


You made THREE posts that I found worrying and here they are again with my responses as I do not feel it neccessary to repeat myself:

Example One

Example Two

Example Three

[edit on 22/9/2008 by skibtz]



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by skibtz
In response to your request for adhering to the T&C, I changed ONE post and not every one as you have misleadingly stated.
I removed 'Your ignorance is embarrassing' from a single post.


No, you also edited out a comment above, you original stated something along the lines of "if you have any intelligence you would immediately post...." which now reads “You are clearly an intelligent person, can you not see how some people may find the doll offensive?”

If you did not think you were violating any rules I don’t see why you would feel the need to edit ANY of your posts to fall inline with the t&c’s. I have not edited any of mine.

BTW..your links don't work.



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 06:01 PM
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reply to post by Sonya610
 


The links work absolutely perfectly?



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 06:15 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610No, you also edited out a comment above, you original stated something along the lines of "if you have any intelligence you would immediately post...."


You are referring to this post in reply to johnsky which remains totally unedited:


WTF?

You accept that racism exists in the world right?

Yes?

Good.

Well if we cant use the law to protect and prosecute because it would be racist in itself then what the eff do you do?

Quickly.

You have a chance to redeem yourself with your next intelligent, well-thought out post......................


Nowt wrong with that.


which now reads “You are clearly an intelligent person, can you not see how some people may find the doll offensive?”


That post was a reply to 44soulslayer and remained unedited except for typos:


You are clearly an intelligent person, can you not see how some people may find the doll offensive?


You have confused/fused two separate posts of mine.

It is a perfectly easy mistake to make and is indeed one that I have made myself on a couple of occasions.

No big deal



If you did not think you were violating any rules I don’t see why you would feel the need to edit ANY of your posts to fall inline with the t&c’s. I have not edited any of mine.


Are you ok?

Do you want to take a breather?

How about we look at your words (not mine!):


Please discuss the issues and stop attacking other posters directly. I believe that violates the T&C's of this site.


As I have stated previously, you pointed out that I had come close to breaking the T&Cs and I corrected my mistake based on your advice.


BTW..your links don't work.


Oh, but they do.

[edit on 22/9/2008 by skibtz]



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 06:32 PM
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Originally posted by skibtz
I was laughing at you and your comments Sonya610.
How sorry you are.


This is a good example of what I am talking about. You are NOT bringing up valid points you are simply making snide comments. Instead of stating facts you tell other people to "go look up facts" because you are incapable of finding facts to support your views.

Now I completely understand why you feel the need to resort to petty insults, because you can't come up with a rational argument to support your position. But I see it a LOT in these threads and I get very tired of it.

And yes I did confuse the two posts regarding "intelligence". My mistake.

However your links are NOT working on my side.



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 07:50 PM
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It's a doll a inanimate object it doesnt practice racism it doesnt have any racist labels on it...

please get over yourselves and stop making it something which it is not, its people like the likes on here screaming is racist that keeps racism alive.

If the woman was holding it above her head screaming racial slurs then its racist !
if its sat there in the window its just a doll that's black.

You know if one day all people woke up and decided to ignore all the racist idiots after a while the racist idiots would give up.. you see its people making an issue of it and responding to stupid ignorant words that keeps racism alive.

exactly the same thing happens in the school yard if you ignore idiots they get bored and give up.

by the way your talking skibzt because i wont agree with what you and blupblup are saying im a racist.... oh well that's me labeled then



posted on Sep, 22 2008 @ 08:34 PM
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Originally posted by skibtz
prove to me that... is not...


It is not possible to prove a negative.

Want me to prove it to you?



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 01:20 AM
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Originally posted by Sonya610This is a good example of what I am talking about.


You had accused me of laughing at people being beaten and murdered.

I explained that I was not laughing at that, I was laughing at a comment that you had made.

If that is a good example then you do not really have much do you.


You are NOT bringing up valid points you are simply making snide comments.


Unfortuantely, I have a bad habit of telling people exactly what I think of them. Hardly snidey.


Instead of stating facts you tell other people to "go look up facts" because you are incapable of finding facts to support your views.


I do not need facts to support my opinions. They are my opinions and they stand up on their own!

If I had quote statisitcs or other people's ideas etc. then a link should indeed be included if relevant.


Now I completely understand why you feel the need to resort to petty insults,


You start a thread decrying someone for being offended by a gollywog and then come out with the above.

Do you not see how irrational that is?


because you can't come up with a rational argument to support your position. But I see it a LOT in these threads and I get very tired of it.


I dont care what you see in other threads. I am here in this one. I have actually raised some points in my previous posts to you that you have ignored. That is your choice.


And yes I did confuse the two posts regarding "intelligence". My mistake.


You accuse me of making disparaging remarks to other posters by posting factual inaccuracies and you do not even have the balls to apologise to me or the other people!

You really are amazing.


However your links are NOT working on my side.


Then that is your problem because they are working for everyone else.

The links open in a new window, with a big advert at the top and a very light background with the single post.

I will not be continuing with this personal crusade with you, if you want to discuss this further then U2U me and we can sort it out.

Let's get back on topic as per the T&Cs.

[edit on 23/9/2008 by skibtz]



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 01:30 AM
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Originally posted by Symbiote

Originally posted by skibtz
prove to me that... is not...


It is not possible to prove a negative.

Want me to prove it to you?


Are you refering to this comment that I had made then you really should not be so selective and use the whole sentence:


If you can prove to me that the gollywog is not based upon racial stereotypes and is not racist then please enlighten me.


Is the question too difficult for you to answer or understand? It is just that you chose 5 words, from different sections, of a 23-word question.

My point is that the gollywog is a racist symbol due to its foundation and history.

If you agree with this point then feel free to ignore the question. If you think otherwise then tell me why you think that the gollywog does not have a foundation and history steeped in racism.

[edit on 23/9/2008 by skibtz]



posted on Sep, 23 2008 @ 01:36 AM
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reply to post by u4ria
 


A quick aside, do you think that it would be ok to put up swaztika curtains in the windows of your own home?



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