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Incredible Documentary Footage of Mass Arrest in St. Paul

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posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 04:03 AM
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Originally posted by Mad Binxx
Anarchy means your wives, daughters, sisters and mothers are being raped. Your stuff is being stolen and if you don't start doing the same you'll probably be killed for it. Yea. I want that.


Actually that is called utter mayhem.

You know absolutely nothing about Anarchism.

I am not even sure why you even brought that crap up? Were these people rioting?




posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 04:28 AM
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reply to post by ninthaxis
 


Nether Ghandi nor Rosa have ANY relevance to our current situation. I would seriously question someones logic if they thought we're going through the same things, like you have. There is NOTHING people protest today that carries the same implications as what Rosa Parks and Ghandi fought for. Lets not belittle what they did so you can make your moot, irrelevant point.

Maybe if you had actually placed some correlation between now and then. But you didn't. You seem to think Parks' and Ghandi's protests are the same as the protests held today. They aren't, and it's unfortunate you belive so. If you plan on making such compairisons, please, don't leave out the huge amount of details that come with Rosa Parks, Mahatma Ghandi, and the pathetic attempt by todays Lefties to recreate the greatest protesters of another time. (The way they protest is also entirely different.)

Simply saying 'Rosa Parks and Ghandi protested, why can't I?' doesn't fly. The context is so utterly different that I can't even come up with the words to describe it, but it does show just how out of touch people are. We have it easy compaired to both of them, and your right to protest is being taken advantage of.

As for my 'contradictory' statements, once again, you leave out critical details. As I expect you would, because if you didn't you would have no arguement at all. Like Realshanti said, and I quote her/him loosely, 'You would jump off a cliff if a cop told you to.' And as I told her, I would quickly reply, 'You first.'

Now that I shot that down, I'll show people what you did there. Which is an all too common tactic. You took my words out of context. As the first quote you used was in responce to you saying the plight Rosa parks and Ghandi, and their resulting protests, are the same as modern protesters. When really, the Who, What, When, Where, Why and How are all different. The second was in a differnt post in responce to a different person.

Then you go on to quote what I had said about political prisoners/executions. Something that goes on NOW. To which you go on to say...


as if this has anything to do with the present situation at all.


I find this funny because what -you- said is actually what has nothing to do with the -present- situation, and in showing this, my compairison seems much more relevant then yours.

And in your closing, you reveal to me a typical form of thinking. A controversial one also, which I wont get into, but only point out. The malicous few that do cause violence. Every group has them. In my opinion the hottest topic along these lines are Muslims and the people that take their religion litterally to the point of murderous violence. I doubt protests would end in such. There are cases where protesters are killed by other protesters, most likely unintentionally.

In any case, when a mob does start a riot, they damage anything and everything in their path. This is a horrible blow to an otherwise...reasonable cause. You do have the right to protest. You dont have the right to roit. Its too bad people can't control themselves. Otherwise this whole protesting thing might work. But this is an issue you should take up with your fellow protesters. Not the police officers that are there for your protection. Or would you rather, when riots do break out, that they just go on and on until they burn out? Just because police use riot prevention tactics doesn't mean they're out to destroy your freedoms.



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 04:41 AM
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reply to post by Mad Binxx
 


You say you are an 'Independent with a slight Right lean'.

Yet you make a point in all of your posts, to say "leftist this" "leftist that" multiple times, and always in a very negative way.

So.... leaning quite a bit I'd say!


However, why are you equating all of those people as 'leftists'? Anyone who tries to exercise the right to assembly is some radical left nutjob??



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 04:44 AM
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Originally posted by Mad Binxx
Just because police use riot prevention tactics doesn't mean they're out to destroy your freedoms.


Sweet. I needed a new signature. Thank you



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 04:51 AM
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reply to post by realshanti
 




congress was warned about this current crisis eight years ago...the war in Iraq was funded without a wimper from congress...the patriot act was signed without even being read by most of congress...yes I have simply tons of confidence in our congress..


This is untrue. If you have any recolection at all you would remember that, not only did Congress go against the war, but NATO did also. Bush went along with it anyway. As for funding, well, if the President was hard set on sending our boys over there, would you rather sent them there with sticks and stones? I would hope not. Whether you are against the war or not, you should never turn your backs on the troops. And cutting funding to even a trickle would have been a noose around all their necks.

On a side note, 23,000 people were killed in ONE DAY in the battle of Antietam in the Civil war. Our current death toll is nearing, what, 5000 in seven years? Though we all can agree war is a terrible thing, we should also see that the funding we do put into the war machine has severely cut our losses in our current war, and any future wars we have. If you disagree with this, for what its worth, you lose my respect.

In saying your protests are 'petty', though that is the very word I wished to use, you misunderstand what I emant by the statement. Like I said earlier about the Iraq war. Congress DID listen to you. Its the President that didn't. Sure the social elites spread across all government agencies, but you surely don't believe that every single one of them is out to get you, do you?

As for waking up, I am. My eyes are open. Like you said, you've been doing things the same for...how long?...And how far have you gotten? I was a Democrat, moreover, I was liberal. I was liberal because I didn't know any better. But when it came down to it, Democrats don't know what they're doing. Do you forget that Democrats are the majority, and have been for some time now? and since then unemployment has gone up 2% and the price of gass has doubled? I thought Pilosi and her Dem. majority were going to fix things....I guess not, concidering our current situation.

As for you getting cranky, well, its tyical for the liberal left, after being presented with logical fact, to become introverted and angry. Insulting the person they're conversing with and outright ignoring them in some cases. But, you hung in there to which I respect, you wont be accused of such. Politic are an enraging subject for us all. I'll look forward to further discussion further down the line, if you're up for it.


Also: To bring us back to topic, I'll state quickly.

The Social Elite are out to get us. And this whole protesting issue is simply a way to divert our attention. Though there are many cases of peaceful protesting that has and still does work, I believe now that they're all playing into it. Because when you're protesting and being arested, then making a gas about it, the real issues go unchecked.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Mad Binxx]



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 05:03 AM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 


So should I take that as a compliment? >.>

Anarchy is a paradox. Say we live in such a place, and roving theives and bandits come in and ruin what -could- be a good thing?

Answer:We create an organization to combat them.

If not a paradox, Anarchy is something of a dream, a dream which, unfortunately, the many variations of human spirit and morals will not allow. There will always be someone out to control you.

As for everyone else? I don't like placing blame on vague entities like, 'the government' 'the administration' and 'the social elites'(wait, didnt I say that?) Lets find some names. Lets follow the money trail and root out our real problems. Instead of hating Republicans, or Democrats, lets root through the Republicrats and the Demicans, and see whos actually on our side. The information is out there. We need to find it.



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 05:07 AM
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reply to post by Mad Binxx
 


You can take it either way I suppose.

When I read that I thought about the precog justice from Minority Report. Your logic is saddening but your quote was hilarious to me at the same time.

Anarchism does not discourage organization, so your scenario, although interesting, does not reflect this philosophy.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 05:15 AM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 


Enlighten me. By what definition do you use the word 'anarchy'?

Also, of course I'm against totalitarian control. But wouldn't a massive group of people that don't agree with what you have to say scare you also? Especially when it is very well possible that violence errupts. Plus, thats not what were talking about. Also, let me throw this at you...

Police shouldn't engage in riot prevention? Really, if you disagree with the statement, I would take it, that you think rioting is a right?-Files that along with 'The Right to Party'- What if one started right outside of your house? The enraged masses often don't care about -who's- property they're destroying. Even though one could argue, the rioters are obviously not on the side of protesters, why can't 'you guys/they' keep their rank passive, as planned? Who would you call? (The Ghostbusters don't do this kind of thing.)

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Mad Binxx]



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 05:18 AM
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reply to post by Mad Binxx
 


Well first off, your definition includes raping children. So before I embark on that task I need to know a little bit more from where you are coming from. As it stands, I feel like you have never read anything on this political theory in your entire life.



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 05:24 AM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 


Well, lets look at the definition of anarchy, exactly as it come in the dictionary...This really should cover all points.

1 a : absence of government b : a state of lawlessness or political disorder due to the absence of governmental authority c : a utopian society of individuals who enjoy complete freedom without government
2 a : absence or denial of any authority or established order b : absence of order : DISORDER

So says the Merriam-Webster.

Key word, lawlessness. (The real keyword is lawl.)
Do you trust people, in the absence of authority, to -not- go about raping children and pillaging? Especially after what we saw in Katrina, though one would say it was mayhem. if we did live in anarchy, who would stop the mayhem? And in stopping mayhem, you no longer have anarchy. Hence: Paradox.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Mad Binxx]



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 05:35 AM
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A few lines from an online dictionaries keyword 'anarchy' does not a political philosophy make


I say again, Anarchism does not discourage organization. If we elaborate more on this I have a feeling a Mod will remind us to be on topic. If you are interested we can talk about this further.

To answer your question about the inherent goodness in people. Yes I do believe in that. I would not believe in Anarchy if I did not believe in that


So is that the reason you support this minority report style crime prevention. You assume all these people are probably bad?



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 06:38 AM
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reply to post by Lucid Lunacy
 

Though I only hint at it, all peaceful protesters aren't duel personalities waiting to explode, I would doubt they would be even close to being one into the majority. But you can't say that the Charlie Mansons, Adolf Hitlers, and Napoleon Bonapartes don't exist. Bloodthirsty and/or filled with a conquering spirit.All these people had a "Righteous" agenda. Yea, theres an inherant goodness in people...but, it is so easily corrupted. 'I'll kill you because its good for me.' is a mantra that does exists and it would be ignorant to say otherwise...The world is filled with people like that.

Fact is, mixed amung the people who really do excersize their right to disagree in the form of peaceful protest, there are those that would just love to let their fighting spirit free. It only takes one anonymous person to spark a riot.
As for Minority Report justice, well,I try not to take my political views from movies, it does seem theres a fad going on. Whether its a warning, or a way to desensitize us of the things that are going on/will happen, who knows. But thats sort of extreme.

Say, they could stop the person that murders your mother because they know he would do it. Hopefully this hasnt happened to you,



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 05:36 PM
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Originally posted by Mad Binxx
Police restraining and quelling the possibly rise of unrest and violence

we're talking about the shenanigans that went on outside.



Did you even watch the video in the OP?

What shenanigans were going on in the first video that was posted?

These people weren't arrested for unlawful assembly, they were arrested for FELONY RIOTING!

There wasn't even a hint of rioting going on in that video, they were watching a concert that was taking place across the river!

Oh, I get it now! They COULD have rioted so they were arrested!

[/sarcasm]



Lets not forget that charges are being dropped. Media had a reason for being there.



The charges were dropped. So WHAT!

LET'S forget the charges were dropped and try to figure out why they were arrested!

The problem is that they were arrested, not that if they were charged or not!

Why were they arrested to begin with? They showed they were with the media and they still were arrested!

How can you cover something newsworthy if the police arrest you, thereby preventing you from being able to report everything that was going on!



Yes, the bad apples make sour the whole basket. It's because the Left is becoming more and more outspoken.



And what's wrong with that? I guess they shouldn't be so outspoken?


[edit on 9/21/2008 by Keyhole]



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 06:10 PM
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Originally posted by xyankee
I would like to know how each officer doing this, is able to sleep at night. Does anyone know what they feel about doing this? Does anyone know what they think of the way there govt. is treating everyone rights?


they are taking the pills



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 06:52 PM
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I dont have the answer other than to say " doing nothing but moaning and groaning here on ATS wont stop what is happening in your once great country"

Dont negate those that cant see their loss of power and rights, they at least have a reason for not doing anything to stop the hell on earth that is surely coming your way.

As a worried outsider looking in I feel for you brothers and sisters, but cant see you doing anything to stop the boulder that is already hurtling down the hill towards you all.

As individuals you can do nothing. As a group you could arrange a strike, hit them hard by letting them know that you are willing to sacrifice that all important pay check before its your life you are sacrificing. Dont wait for the moment you think will be your call to action because you dont have a clue what it will be. Act now for your country, for your brothers, whether they are awake or not and for the future generations who will follow you. You will be greatly surprised at how much support you will have world wide. The biggest percentage of Americans may have been bullied into submission but believe me the people if not the governments of the world will unite to your cry.

We in the UK can only learn from your mistakes but in history we have already proven ourselves , as seen in the earlier video, in the streets of Belfast and Glasgow. I know we in the UK are next but its not in our nature to wait and tamely hand over our rights. We have no guns but that wont stop us. We will have people who dont see the obvious stripping of our rights, but that wont stop us. I am not a firebrand aggresive person but threaten my family or neighbours family and I know we will fight . Better to fight and lose than to live a life full of fear that is controlled by another.

Look after each other brothers and sisters and please, please find your bottle soon, if its not already too late.



[edit on 21-9-2008 by captiva]



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 10:13 PM
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I want to know where they find all the people to do these jobs. Is the economy that bad that people are resorting to brutality as a means of paying the bills? I would love to meet these people in their civilian clothing.



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 10:34 PM
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Makes me sick! I noticed that the video had a few different situations lumped together right? Wasn't that that lady who was the reporter for the Progressive Democrats being thrown to the hood of the police car in the Op video?

We have to keep it really straight here other wise like with UFOs we can loose credibility real fast on these types of videos. Man I wish I could just stick my head in the sand sometimes and make like an Ostrich.

I can tell you this started back in the 80's, and people have been getting desensitized slowly and methodically with programs like Judge Judy, COPS, and other malicious propaganda.

I used to like to demonstrate peacefully, it has become a war zone out there and I'm not so sure what the heck peaceful protest is going to change any more, I can understand how they start doing crazy stuff in other countries if this is the kind of brutality and demeaning crud they have to survive from their factions and oppressors.

Wow I could have gone all night without knowing this horrible tidbit.



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 10:50 PM
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reply to post by Seaman_Richie
 


I just hit the ignore button.
Who's with me?



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by Mad Binxx
 


You say you are an 'Independent with a slight Right lean'.

Yet you make a point in all of your posts, to say "leftist this" "leftist that" multiple times, and always in a very negative way.

So.... leaning quite a bit I'd say!


However, why are you equating all of those people as 'leftists'? Anyone who tries to exercise the right to assembly is some radical left nutjob??


He obviously is a biproduct of a late 60's set of parents that missed the free love era completly and scrimped and saved their lives away through the dancefever 70s with all the designer drugs and me me attitudes.

Raised by overbearing and oppinionated parents can do this to their children. Sad.



posted on Sep, 21 2008 @ 11:53 PM
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So, what you're all saying is that if you're asked to break up a crowd and disperse you can just say "No" and the police should shrug their shoulders and leave? Curious how things like that were left out of the footage. Also, how is it that although the cameraman interviewed claims nobody was carrying a sign or anything like that there are quite a few signs in evidence on the film? Just goes to prove how you can spin any situation with clever editing. When the Soviet Union did this we called it disinformation and propaganda. What should we call it when you do it yourself?




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