Fix the Economy! FIRE THE FED!

As many of us are aware the Federal Reserve is the central government bank of the United States and issues currency for the United States. However that currency is not based on anything except speculation. Thats right the currency of the United States is based on a guess! It is called a Fiat Currency! That is wrong, just wrong. This is why our economy is such crap today. It's because the currency of the relm is based on nothing. No trade able commodity nothing of actual worth.

Why is that? I say we need to go back on at least the Wheat Standard, if not the Gold Standard. Or even an Oil Standard. Why? Because our money is worthless! And it's getting more worthless by the day!

The only real way to fix this economic crisis at the moment is if the US government eliminates the Fed and starts issuing it's own currency, a currency based on an actual commodity. Something that has value, substance, and actual worth.

I have an idea, a multi tier commodity currency standard. Small denominations can equal a less worth currency, Say wheat for example up to a certain amount would garner a set amount of money, beyond that Copper can be used as the next standard for denominations after a certain level, then Silver, then Gold.

Yes a multi tier commodity standard needs to be set for the failing US Economy, it's obvious now that the Fiat Standard is useless and is failing. It is time now for the government to fire the fed, issue it's own currency based on a commodity and issue notes that are guarantees for a set amount of that commodity. In this way the value of the currency has something other than nothing to back itself on! Meaning that the value of that currency will not fail!

Let us look at this quote from former chairman Allen Greenspan

Wiki"under the gold standard, a free banking system stands as the protector of an economy's stability and balanced growth... The abandonment of the gold standard made it possible for the welfare statists to use the banking system as a means to an unlimited expansion of credit... In the absence of the gold standard, there is no way to protect savings from confiscation through inflation."

Was he not right? Look where we are today?

[edit on 9/19/2008 by whatukno]

reply to post by whatukno


Would never happen.. the federal reserve is a consortium of a few large banks.. they are gobbling up everything right now for a fraction of the costs.. I believe this was all planned.. the last depression somthing very similar happened instead of the housing market being over inflated and crashing..it was the stock market(banks were giving stock loans) after this the fed gobbled up all the competition...

Are you are you you mind, congress is going to give full power now to the fed to be in charge of all liquidity !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They are not going to be disbanded They are the government now and they are getting bigger and better.

Thanks to a good for nothing congress controlled by those behind the power of the Fed and the tax payer dollars.

reply to post by whatukno


The dollar is a de-facto oil standard currency.

It's only unstable because :

1. Uncurtailable demand

2. Standardised against a consumable (as opposed to the static gold)

3. Oil is controlled by nations unfriendly to the USA

With more power the fed has more controll and the dollar has less value.

without a set standard to base the currency off of the dollar is based solely on speculation, and is completely worthless. The FED has failed us completely, and should be disolved.

The US government needs to revoke it's charter, issue it's own currency and make the economy worth something again. Can you imagine how well our economy would be doing right now if we were still on the gold standard?

I agree, but it has to be a non-consumable asset based currency (precious metals).

It cant be pegged to wheat or oil... what happens if the oil dries up or there is a famine?

If at all, it has to be a return to the gold standard. Of course this will never happen, because it would stop the ultimate stealth tax: inflation.

Well gold would have been better than oil but guess what we have oil men running the nation and they seat all over congress.

So I don't think they want to lose all their influence in Washington yet.

As I stated in another thread, I am all for starting our own currency, telling the Fed that they have had their way with us and that we default on all outstanding loans they have made, start over, and pass an amendment that says in no uncertain terms that private currency is NOT ever again to be issued in our collective name.

all the CEO's who get fat bonus checks for sending company's into the ground SHOULD BE JAILED!

forget the federal reserve official puppets


next hanky panky paulson should be JAILED, then the SEC Commisioner jailed, this will send the people F#%KING up the system for the middle class a message, this would make sense right?

that is untill you realize the system is a rigged fraud, it is a conspiracy of sorts, because the fed was not invented for the sound functioning of the economy, it was created as a way to backup the bankers when they mess up as well as to extend credit with a perception of being gov't operated. it was not created to maintain a high standard of living of citizens, it was to indebt the american public with the most amount of $ /credit possible and keep the fat cats getting richer as well as getting more and more power over washington politico's.............MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. This also benefited the gov't because it allowed them to inflate the money supply thru dependance on bankers, but no longer have to balance the budget or be fiscally responsible.

And now they will rush thru more regulation's and solutions that benefit themselves at the expense of taxpayers, and we taxpayers ALMOST deserve it for being so dumb gullible and lazy.

the top 5-10% of the economic pyramid thrive on indebting the bottom 90% of people as much as they can, as well as keeping the bottom % in the dark as to how S*&^ really works, marketing manipulating them on media to get everyone deep into debt (as a "smart move") they lobbied to get favorable taxation from the gov't and now the gov't politicos kiss there asses in return for under the table $ayback

Wall street has hijacked american a long time ago and NOW there recklessness will begin to effect ordinary american's more and more, and the dumb sheeple were too lazy to do some critical thinking and instead craved the return to there comfort zone anytime anyone brought up this and to label them a conspiracy theorist, or some other term that wisks them back to stupid ignorant bliss ville. In fairness the sheeple (were lied to) and manipulated by the media as well as spoon fed banking establlishment propoganda passed off as EConomic degree's or books.

also wall street $ and owners goes back to European OLD MONEY and a whole host of characters , and i have not even mentioned what i think is some of the sickest S*^% i.e big pharma committed to treating disease instead of curing it, (the top of that pyramid would rather have people dead and pay 1,000's $ of dollars to treat there "diseases" than healed) with the special intrest lobbying to brainwash the public to boot and pay shady characters within the judicial system to have leverage over most whistle blowers, while the cake goes to a cabal of child abductors and molesters as well as some nation's intelligence agency's who have "eyes" that oversee this *&())




[edit on 19-9-2008 by cpdaman]

[edit on 19-9-2008 by cpdaman]

ok lets see, we have a semi private institution regulating and issuing currency for a sovereign nation. That institution itself as a private entity is in the business of making money for itself.

Now that institution is gobbling up other companies in an effort to bail out a financial giant. This is good news for them. They now have a controlling share of AIG.

But instead, lets propose this. let AIG fail, yes let it fail. Abolish the FED, issue united states currency based on precious metals like copper, silver and gold and watch as the economy rebounds in short order.

Buy current federal reserve notes for a fraction of face value and have the government gobble up the shares of the federal reserve. In essence that is what currency is, a share, a stock of the federal reserve. The government should buy these shares at a fraction of the cost, issuing United States Notes in its place. A copper certificate, a silver certificate or a gold certificate, equal to the value of a troy ounce of each of these precious metals.

This would solidify this economy and ensure financial success for investors.

That's why I say FIRE THE FED!

Reality Time.

First of all, the last 2 Presidents to try and do something with the Federal Reserve were shot. One killed, one wounded.

If Presidents of the United States cannot affect change with the Federal Reserve, what chance do the American people have in removing the Fed.

The Federal Reserve would pull out all stops and do everything in its power to decimate our lives, economically, politically and in ways we are not even aware of, to maintain control over the economic assets United States. They could turn us into a 3rd world nation in a matter of weeks.

The Fed could instantaneously create a depression, crash the markets, close all banks, removing all liquidity from the economy, raise interest rates and force the American citizens into the streets fighting over what goods might still available. When it's all over, the Fed banks will own everything, not that they don't already, and a new business cycle will begin.

The Federal Reserve "owns" all Federal Reserve Notes in circulation, including interest on these notes, the entire nation debt and the interest on this debt. The collateral for these notes are the physical and economic assets of the United States. They will not relinquish their control without a "mother of all battles" against America and its citizens. The Fed will win and anything remaining of any value will belong to the Fed banks.

So folks can talk about abolishing the Federal Reserve Corporation all you want, but IMHO it's all over but the shootin' and the shoutin'.

Jail is too good for the Bankers & the fed for all the pain and anguish they've caused in the world.

They are the enemies of the free peoples of the earth and they have no value to mankind.





[edit on 19-9-2008 by verylowfrequency]

reply to post by whatukno


Ah, Christ, another gold bug.

Let me explain something to you, my friend. Back in the days when we were on a gold standard, the money was still based on the value of a guess. Know why? Because there was more money written on promissory notes than there was in actual bullion. it was always a guess - "if I take my note to the bank to receive the gold it promises, will it be honored?"

In fact, every last one of the economic crises of the 19th century is traceable to this sort of standard. The slightest shakeup in gold prices or politics would trigger people cashing all those promissory notes - and it was on a first come, first serve basis. This left a lot of people with paper and no gold, because the gold ran out. So of course the situation was made worse because even the faint whiff of a scare would drive throngs of people to the bank to cash these notes, resulting in an economic crash.

A gold standard works fine if your population amounts to a village with limited trade. In every other instance it lends itself either to a total plutocracy, or repetitive economic crashes. Take your pick.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


Like I said before you can't put it all in gold, put it also in wheat, oil copper, silver and gold. Commodities that can back all paper assets.

& don't issue more currency than can be backed by the commodity it represents. That's just foolish.

Why should our entire monetary system be based on PURE GUESSWORK?!? Really answer me that? Instead of being based on at least some actual source why do we back the whole system on GUESSES?!?

Now look at the mess we are in because of that system! Yes there were rushes on the banks in the times when gold prices fluctuated, but now people have no choice when the value of the market falls. They don't even have the option of cashing in worthless paper for a tangible good. No they get bubkis nada ziltch, zip. Sorry charlie, you get nothing. Good system!

I have to absolutely love the sheer apathy and lack of motivation that people have about affecting real change in how our country works. This can do nothing attitude is exactly what got us into this mess to begin with. It's also makes me glad our founding fathers didn't share this attitude or we would all still be living in the colonies, and all be subjects of England.

[edit on 9/19/2008 by whatukno]

Originally posted by marg6043
Are you are you you mind, congress is going to give full power now to the fed to be in charge of all liquidity !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They are not going to be disbanded They are the government now and they are getting bigger and better.

Thanks to a good for nothing congress controlled by those behind the power of the Fed and the tax payer dollars.

No They are not the Government, he Zionist are the ones telling them and punking congress into doing this damage too the country...

Originally posted by 44soulslayer
reply to post by whatukno

 

The dollar is a de-facto oil standard currency.

It's only unstable because :

1. Uncurtailable demand

2. Standardised against a consumable (as opposed to the static gold)

3. Oil is controlled by nations unfriendly to the USA

Well the Arabs are Still Friendly with the US...

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by TheWalkingFox

 

Like I said before you can't put it all in gold, put it also in wheat, oil copper, silver and gold. Commodities that can back all paper assets.

So basically a straight barter system with promissory notes? "I'll give you this piece of paper worth X amount of gold if you give me THAT piece of paper worth X amount of wheat"?

& don't issue more currency than can be backed by the commodity it represents. That's just foolish.

Then only a very few people will be able to buy or sell. populationis a huge reason why we use a fiat economy.

Why should our entire monetary system be based on PURE GUESSWORK?!? Really answer me that? Instead of being based on at least some actual source why do we back the whole system on GUESSES?!?

WHY SHOULD ALL CAPS AND EXTRA PUNCTUATION MAKE UP FOR LACK OF A COGENT ARGUMENT?????

You're not listening. The economy was pure guesswork when there was a fixed standard. Not just pure guesswork, but pure guesswork that kept crashing and failing, leaving many, many people penniless, and which prevented America, for all its resources, from actually being much beyond what, today, we would call a third-world nation.

Now look at the mess we are in because of that system! Yes there were rushes on the banks in the times when gold prices fluctuated, but now people have no choice when the value of the market falls. They don't even have the option of cashing in worthless paper for a tangible good. No they get bubkis nada ziltch, zip. Sorry charlie, you get nothing. Good system!

...But that's exactly how it was when the system was on a fixed standard. There were more bank notes than there was gold to back them up. So when people panicked, only the first people to show up got their money. The problem is no different today, except for one thing - the value of our money is actually far more stable, and people have to actually work at screwing up the economy.

Don't blame the fiat economy for this trouble, buddy. Blame bad practices by investment bankers and the steady stream of deregulation handouts from Republican Washington. Just as in 1929, it's a lack of watchdogging and a splurge of absolutely stupid business practices leading to our crash, not the system that the money is based on.

I have to absolutely love the sheer apathy and lack of motivation that people have about affecting real change in how our country works. This can do nothing attitude is exactly what got us into this mess to begin with. It's also makes me glad our founding fathers didn't share this attitude or we would all still be living in the colonies, and all be subjects of England.

[edit on 9/19/2008 by whatukno]

it was motivation that got us off the gold standard, which is the direct cause of American prosperity (well, that and the devastation of potential competitors in WW2). You wish to go back to what amounts to the Neolithic age of our nation's history, to a system that provably did not work then and just as certainly will not work now, for no reason other than you refuse to place blame where blame is due - the fat cats and investors who's shady business deals have landed us here and the republicans who have encouraged, funded, and continue to fund them to do so.

And no, I imagine that we would have successfully been independent of England by 1835, saving us numerous lives, the embarassment of 1812, likely would have nullified the root causes of the Civil War, probably wouldn't have comitted wholesale genocide against the native americans... I mean hey, Canada and Australia turned out alright. Not perfect, but alright.

you know since all this mess has been going on with the fed, and wall street/stockmarket. it has really been nice not to see some many credit card ads, and comercials during my shows. now its all antidepressent med. ads for the drug companies. i say stop the bail out and let the chipps fall where they may. screw going to work i'd much rather be fishing, and camping anyway.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox

 

So basically a straight barter system with promissory notes? "I'll give you this piece of paper worth X amount of gold if you give me THAT piece of paper worth X amount of wheat"?

Well I was more referring to a US government backed supply of promissory notes. Do we not do this in the commodities market anyway? Isn't the entire idea of notes exactly barter anyway? Instead of the FED, a private institution issuing reserve notes based on a speculative guess of the worth of the GDP, we could use the more stable standard of commodities that have an actual value. Issued by our own government and not a private institution.

Then only a very few people will be able to buy or sell. populationis a huge reason why we use a fiat economy.

I don't believe that is true, I believe that everyone would be able to buy or sell using a fixed system, it's just that the denominations would be smaller. Inflation would be slashed. The fact of the matter is that a fiat system that allows for an unlimited line of credit is an illogical system that is doomed to complete failure. A failure we are just starting to see now. You think it's bad now? Just wait till all the lenders start wanting repayment for debts owed. Remember China has been buying up US debt for a while now. Thanks to the glorious fiat system that you endorse so wholeheartedly, there is no way for us to repay those debts. A fixed system would have kept everyone much more honest.

WHY SHOULD ALL CAPS AND EXTRA PUNCTUATION MAKE UP FOR LACK OF A COGENT ARGUMENT?????

When the opposition resorts to petty insults in the first line of their first reply, perhaps it takes a bit more emphasis in order to try and have the opponent listen to reason.

You're not listening. The economy was pure guesswork when there was a fixed standard. Not just pure guesswork, but pure guesswork that kept crashing and failing, leaving many, many people penniless, and which prevented America, for all its resources, from actually being much beyond what, today, we would call a third-world nation.

I am listening and you do have a point, however I did solve that point which you blew off without thinking about it...

...But that's exactly how it was when the system was on a fixed standard. There were more bank notes than there was gold to back them up. So when people panicked, only the first people to show up got their money. The problem is no different today, except for one thing - the value of our money is actually far more stable, and people have to actually work at screwing up the economy.

...and there's where you weren't listening and blew off the solution out of hand without thinking about the reality of the situation. First and foremost you do not issue notes that you cannot back up with a set amount of the commodity they are based on. If per say, you use precious metals, you can issue notes up to the point of your supply, no line of credit can be issued on a system this way. People only have notes that equal the supply available.

Don't blame the fiat economy for this trouble, buddy. Blame bad practices by investment bankers and the steady stream of deregulation handouts from Republican Washington. Just as in 1929, it's a lack of watchdogging and a splurge of absolutely stupid business practices leading to our crash, not the system that the money is based on.

I was blaming them. In fact I blamed them and also offered a solution to the problem. It is the FED and investment bankers along with a steady stream of deregulation. Plus a monetary system of the relm that is based on that speculation and set up, and issued, by a private institution instead of the Government itself. (by the way, I ain't your buddy)

it was motivation that got us off the gold standard, which is the direct cause of American prosperity (well, that and the devastation of potential competitors in WW2).

Exactly, WWII got us off of the gold standard, why? Because Europe was in ruins and could not pay to fix itself after the war. America being relatively unscathed saw a boom of financial success in the short term after WWII because of competition. however at that time because Europe could not possibly rebuild using a gold standard system of economy had to go to the fiat system, a system based on speculation of a product in order to rebuild, America was forced into that system by Europe because otherwise our currency would be worth so much more than the individual currencies of the European nations they would never be able to compete on a global scale with America.

You wish to go back to what amounts to the Neolithic age of our nation's history, to a system that provably did not work then and just as certainly will not work now, for no reason other than you refuse to place blame where blame is due - the fat cats and investors who's shady business deals have landed us here and the republicans who have encouraged, funded, and continue to fund them to do so.

As I said before, in fact it's in the title of this thread where the blame is due. It is due squarely on the fat cats that run the FED. No I am not suggesting we go back to the neolithic age, which is kind of funny as America was never a part of the neolithic period of history (were just not that old of a nation) I am suggesting a possible solution to an ongoing problem that this is just the tip of the iceberg. The Fiat system of trade creates a endless supply of credit for the government to use. They have run this credit past the point of responsibility to the point of absurdity.

Pushing our nation into the brink of complete and total economic collapse, this recent market disaster is just the start of a chain reaction in my opinion that will ripple through causing other market sectors to also collapse. Eventually even with bailouts and buyouts by the FED the system will implode. And America will be that third world country that you feared we would be if we had a monetary system based on a tangible asset that had a set limit on the line of credit offered against that asset.

Also, it's not just republicans that got us into this mess, democrats also hold a good equal share of the blame as well.