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Russia Test-Fires Ballistic Missile 6,700 Kilometers to Pacific

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posted on Sep, 19 2008 @ 01:14 PM
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What does it matter?



Once any mass launch from russian terrritory is detected, the world ends period.
What the F does it matter if the newest icbm can penetrate any defence, within 40 min of launch russia will be dead.

The next paragraphs are a little off topic but do relate to how the topic came to be.

When V. Putin was elected I put aside my reservations about his being former KGB, and had high hopes that he would be the man that would lead russia out their endless cycle of self oppresion.
But he has proved to nothing other than the next in a long line of leaders that put their own power and wealth of thier friends above the needs of their people.

Why does russia need SO MUCH TO be the big guy on the block?

They have everything they need to be a superpower within their own country.
They have ample supplies of all the major commodities any modern civilization needs to be powerful.
they could go on about their own business and not worry about what anyone else thinks or does, and grow fabulously wealthy and powerful without threatining their neighbors.

Sorry MODS but I have to make this statement.
one of the repliers is an IDIOT, and his previous posts will bear out my assumption. Y
ou are so over the top I cant help but feel that its all an act, just to stir up the pot.
By the way I lived through the Cold war and paid attention, the world doesnt need that again, because we wont survive this time, we almost didnt last time.




posted on Sep, 19 2008 @ 02:15 PM
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Originally posted by manson_322
seems to with arrogance of genocidal imperialist US empire, the russians are sending a message that their nuclear Missiles can obliterate any aggressor , including USA, if USA dares to do something stupid


It's kind of sad how some people have so much anger built inside of them. This guy's posts seem to stand out because thats all he says, anti-us stuff.

"The United States imperialistic blah blah blah." Something to that effect.

You need to chill man, there is rational ways to handle your hatred! The US isn't the only country who has crazies at the helm, ya know.



posted on Sep, 19 2008 @ 02:22 PM
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In regards to this topic, Russia having high range balistic missiles is nothing new. Like a post read previously, it is just an attempt for them to draw attention to themselves.

There are no indications that both the US and Russia don't have their trite and true ICBMs anymore.

Guaranteed, we could still activate mutually assured destruction... But it's a matter where someone stupid enough presses the button first.

[edit on 9/19/2008 by FadeToBlack]



posted on Sep, 19 2008 @ 02:32 PM
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Big Deal...

The U.S, I'm sure even though I am Canadian, can fire a missile east from NY and hit a target in California.

lol =)



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 01:06 AM
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reply to post by punkinworks
 


Maybe you're right about what you've said about Russia but very unfortunatelly you seem to focus in the wrong direction.Imo you should be focusing on your country's actions.
It's the only way to fix the errors of your country (if you see them and you want to change em that is).

Not only before but even now,that Russia indeed is "flexing its muscles",most countries in the world are intimated more by the US rather any other country.It's like,if you wont dance in America's rythm,you're gonna get screwed one way or another.

Imo,there's still a turning point for the US,to save "the game",allthough i admit that it's very hard and complicated.
It's up to the US citizens though.I know,i know,most of the people feel and think like they're powerless,that's how people feel and think in many countries i believe but they do have the power to change things,trust me on that.Disregard if you like anything i have said so far but take a minute to think about this.You don't even need "guns,supplies" and crap like that,hell,you could be butt-naked in the streets and still you'd have the power to change things if you'd really want it.

I don't know how you'll view the things i've just said but i can tell you that i said em with the best intentions,being as friendly as i can be.


Yes,yes...!I'll be on topic too...!Sheesh...! o_O;


I didn't have any doubts about Russia still being strong and having impressive and deadly missiles.
You see imo isn't so much about the military force etc,both countries have their share on it.What i am waiting to see is,if someone will finally back off,who will be.

To xbranscombex:

That was a good one!



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:39 AM
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reply to post by Oceanborn
 


The only problem is people in this country, (not unlike alot of countries around the world) are too distracted eeking out their personal lives, surrounded by unnecessary debt, corruption on all levels, so called terrorism, and whatever other boogey man corporate america can talk the country into believing just to make a buck.

This propoganda machine is so effective that, IMO, is why joe six pack is rather content watching american idol and not even bothering to vote because most common folk believe the game is already lost, or so stacked against them, that their opinions are an exercise infutility, and choose to not even bother. ( i/e sheepledom )

Later,...... Ausable_Bill



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:45 AM
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How 'bout some video?
www.youtube.com...



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:54 AM
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Originally posted by selfisolated
The most striking thing about this is the speed of the damn thing.

I'm sorry... 4,200 miles in 20 minutes?
Thats 12,600 miles AN HOUR.

Forgive me for being naive and relatively uninformed on missile speeds.. but doesn't this seem a bit over the top?

Rockets to the moon don't even go that fast, do they?



12,600 is chicken feed for a rocket.

To reach Earth orbit a vehicle (Space Shuttle for example) has to reach 17,500mph.

To escape Earth's gravity (to get to the moon for example) you've gotta get going about 25,000 mph.

[edit on 20-9-2008 by Phage]



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 03:14 AM
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So Russia has a new toy. Don't you think that we in the US don't already have a newer better ICBM than the one Russia just shot off?

Yeah Russia is flexing there muscles And Putin wants the old Soviet empire back. we all knew eventually he'd show his true colors. Since Russia has all this money now from their oil profits maybe they should repay some of the welfare we gave them after the fail of the old empire. And some of the money we taxpayers spent to disarm their older nukes.

Putin is using the excuse of a U.S. missle shield to flex his muscles when he knows that that shield will not affect Russian ICBMS! If the U.S. wanted to have an effect on Russian Missles we would put those missle shields in Canada, Greenland. and Alaska, Not Poland! Looks like Putin wants a cold war with the U.S. Again, and after living thru the end of the last one i'm not looking forward to another But Another cold war is what he's going to get. And Russia will Colapse yet again just like last time. Funny thing about history is it repeats itself, to bad Russia didn't learn from the first time.

reply to post by manson_322
 

Figures you'd chime in here just to bash the U.S. in your blind ignorance you bash the U.S. when its Russia thats being the aggressor and wanting to build a new empire in this situation.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 03:21 AM
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The Russians were tying to prove that have a sub launched icbm where they don't have to surface 1st to use has been a weakness of there subs, This is the 5th test firing 1st 3 failed miserably. This was sent to US navy since Russians can track our subs and can launch from anywhere it was a major threat makes it a little harder to know who just sent a missile at you. no real threat and the missile would not penetrate missile defense unless they were really close 5 min or less.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 03:23 AM
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It's just another missile test...big frakkin deal.

[edit on 20-9-2008 by 4N6310]



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 03:35 AM
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So the Russian Subs can finally launch a missle like a U.S. sub, it took them how long to be able to do that?


Do you honestly think if things got to the point of war between the U.S. and Russia that those Russian subs would have a chance to fire there ICBM's, Considering there is at least 1 U.S. hunter killer Sub shadowing it as soon as it leaves port? If the Russian sub even hiccuped in that situation the U.S. Sub would send the Russian sub to the bottom of the ocean.

There will never be a hot war between the U.S. and Russia in our lifetimes but another cold war is coming.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 08:24 AM
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reply to post by Mercenary2007
 





Figures you'd chime in here just to bash the U.S. in your blind ignorance you bash the U.S. when its Russia thats being the aggressor and wanting to build a new empire in this situation.


ah, as usual more BS from an ignorant american ,

YOU MURDERED A 2 MILLION PEOPLE IN IRAQ FOR OIL
CREATED ISLAMIC TERROR THAT HAS LED TO DEATHS OF MILLIONS

IMPOVERISHED MILLIONS THROUGH EXPOLITATION GENOCIDE AND STARVATION

[B]fact is that most americans are arrogant , and use propanganda to hide their war crimes against humanity[/B]

have you ever seen journalist John Pilger 's documentary "War on democracy , do see it and , you wil realise how USA has murdered millions in latin America and across the world
the entire documentary

www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...


by the way, it was georgia who started the genocide against south ossetians , and Russia defended them .., unlike genocidal USA which murdered millions of iraqis with sanctions and smart biombs in the name of 'democracy' ........ hypocrites



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:32 PM
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'You' murdered 2 million people? You mean, the United States Government...? Don't lump us in the leaders of this country. Obviously the average citizen has nothing at all to do with the wars and International affairs that our Government deals with.

And like I said before, while your hatred might be grounded, the United States isn't the only country who has killed people in the name for an idealogical cause. The war between Christians and Muslims have been going on for hundreds and hundreds of years. All of it is irrational in my books. If you can remember Sadaam Hussein tortured and starved his people, took all the revenues and profits, even going so far as to gas them. Just for his greed!

Being as though I'm an United States citizen, your comments slightly offend me. I love my country, but I don't like the way it is being run. You shouldn't group us all together as one because most of the citizens are nothing like the ones who rule it.

At least with the accidentals that our country has killed, we didn't mean to as far as I'm concerned. You should find another country to hate, there are soooooooo many out there worse than the United States.

[edit on 9/20/2008 by FadeToBlack]



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:39 PM
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Originally posted by selfisolated
The most striking thing about this is the speed of the damn thing.

I'm sorry... 4,200 miles in 20 minutes?
Thats 12,600 miles AN HOUR.


Nah, thats par for the cource:

The LGM-118A aka The peacekeeper and the LGM-30 Minuteman III had a terminal speed of 15000+ mph

The vaunted Topol M and the SS-18 were also at the that speed level



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 02:42 PM
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Im not sure who is the bigger moron here, Putin for spewing this kind of stuff or the people that beleive him.

Yawn, they have a new ICBM. Yehaw. The garbage that the Russians put out and many lap up like so many eager dogs about being able to penatrate the defences of any system :shk:

You people realize right that the Russians have 100 times more deliver vehicles than the US has interceptors. The US can at best intercept 10-20 max Russia can easily saturate the system Now.

Or is Russia telling us that thier missile systems are in such bad shape they could only lob 10 or so in our direction?



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 03:47 PM
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reply to post by manson_322
 

FACT Russia was amassing troops on the Border with Georgia before Georgia Entered the south to stop them from suceeding from Georgia.

Fact Russia was crossing in to the south and causing problems and making it look like south ossetians were doing it so Georgia would respond. why do you think Russia was so fast to respond with troops they knew something was going to happen because they had their hand in the cookie jar from the beginning!

FACT the missle defense Shield in poland will do nothing to stop Russia from launching its ICBM's. AS has been stated many times in numerous threads about the Georgia situation. is the missle defense shield to work Properly you have to launch the missles on a head to head intercept NOT FROM BEHIND the ICBM's

FACT Russia is the one that said they would use ICBM's against poland if they allowed the missle shield.

FACT Russia is currently in the process of empire building and threatening Nuclear war if anyone Interferes.

When was the last time the U.S. threatened to use nuKes? I'll give you a hint it was the cuban missle crisis when the Soviet Union Parked nuclear missles 90 miles from the coast of the U.S.

When was the last time the U.S. used Nukes? WWII to end the war.

Why don't you go back to what ever rock you crawled out from under and Spew your Anti american BS because no one here wants to hear it. we all can see who is doing what.

And you really have a lot to learn if you think that the average U.S. citizen can do anything about what the leaders of this country do.

And it just shows your ignorance when you lump the average Citizen with the decissions that are made by the government.



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 07:23 PM
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Originally posted by Mercenary2007
FACT Russia was amassing troops on the Border with Georgia


What troops are you talking about? Russian troops were stationed in the North Caucasus military district for a long time. Russia moved an extra contingent closer to South Ossetia back in June, in response to the build-up of Georgian forces in the area. Russia further had a reason for extra caution, when U.S. and Georgia held large training exercises in Georgia in July.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
before Georgia Entered the south to stop them from suceeding from Georgia.


Huh? S Ossetia didn't try to secede in August. The conflict was frozen for over a decade and nothing has changed. The region was overseen by peacekeepers to prevent violance from breaking out again.

Georgia went in to regain control of the region. And they didn't just go in - they launched a huge artillery barrage against a civilian city.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
Fact Russia was crossing in to the south and causing problems and making it look like south ossetians were doing it so Georgia would respond.


What are you talking about? Fact? Backed up by what evidence? Define "causing problems", and provide any proof of what you are saying before labeling it as "FACT". Why would Russia provoke Georgia into war? And why did Georgia chose to "respond" by bombing the crap out of a civilian city?

Sorry, but your "FACTs" are seriously lacking.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
why do you think Russia was so fast to respond with troops


It took Russia 16 hours to respond, after Georgians innitiated the shelling of Tskhinvalli on August 7th. The Russian North Caucasus Military District has been battle-ready ever since the Chechen wars in the 90's. The closest major Russia military bases at Mozdok and Vladikavkaz are close to South Ossetia - about 5-8 hours away for tanks and infantry vehicles.

So the timing of Russia's response is not suspect. 6-8 hours to prepare the first contingent, and 6-8 hours to reach the Roki tunnel on the border of South Ossetia.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
they knew something was going to happen because they had their hand in the cookie jar from the beginning!


They knew something was going to happen because they intercepted Georgian UAVs above South Ossetia and Abkhazia throughout July. Also the Georgian massed their troops near the breakaway republics since June. Russia has been warning Georgia against any action throughout 2008.




Originally posted by Mercenary2007
FACT the missle defense Shield in poland will do nothing to stop Russia from launching its ICBM's.


Sorry - "FACT" disproven by the following analysis by the MIT researchers:

russianforces.org...

The true specs of the interceptor system demonstrate that given the proper Radar guidance and warning, interception of Russian ICBM is very possible. Also consider that the ABM system will be perfected in the following years, and the number of interceptor batteries will no doubt increase with time.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
AS has been stated many times in numerous threads about the Georgia situation. is the missle defense shield to work Properly you have to launch the missles on a head to head intercept NOT FROM BEHIND the ICBM's.


Read the analysis link above. It proves given the technical specs of the interceptor missiles that they are superior in speed and will have the capability to intercept the ICBMs even if launched after the ballistic missile has passed the detection zone.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
FACT Russia is the one that said they would use ICBM's against poland if they allowed the missle shield.


False - sorry where do you dig these "facts" up? Russia said that they will "TARGET" Poland with ICBMs, should Poland host the ABM shield. In the case of the unlikely nuclear exchange with U.S., Poland could also be targeted to neutralize the system.

Russia had never said it would "USE" and weapons against Poland just for hosting the missile shield. Please provide factual proof if you wish to substantiate your "facts" in any way.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
FACT Russia is currently in the process of empire building and threatening Nuclear war if anyone Interferes.


Don't tag your opinion as "facts". Opinion is one thing, a fact is a wholly different matter. A critical-thought backed arguement must distinguish facts and opinion.

Please explain how Russia "building an empire"?

Please explain when Russian government has threatened to use nuclear weapons, and what you mean by "interferes"?

Nothing you said so far has any factual proof behind it. It's just opinion build upon opinions and backed by opinions.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
When was the last time the U.S. threatened to use nuKes?


When U.S. under Bush adopted a policy of "preemptive strikes", which do not exclude the use of any weapons in the U.S. arsenal.

But U.S. had never threated the actual "use of nukes" against anybody directly, and neither has Russia or any other government in the world.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
When was the last time the U.S. used Nukes? WWII to end the war.


When was the last time Russia used nukes? Or for that matter when was the last time (or the first time) anyone besides the U.S. used nukes against anyone else?



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
U.S. citizen can do anything about what the leaders of this country do.


The average citizen - no. But it would help if the people in the U.S. see what is going on for what it's worth. Fearmongering about Russia and the new Cold War is only making things worse, and it helping the U.S. government make an excuse for further military spending and NATO expansion.


[edit on 20-9-2008 by maloy]



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 07:57 PM
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I love it i figured you would jump in here. All the things i listed as fact were in articles from Russian media That were posted in threads here on ATS most of the threads you posted in so maybe you should go back and read them.

Rush is making a big fuss over 10 interceptors and russia has how many ICBM's?



What troops are you talking about? Russian troops were stationed in the North Caucasus military district for a long time. Russia moved an extra contingent closer to South Ossetia back in June, in response to the build-up of Georgian forces in the area. Russia further had a reason for extra caution, when U.S. and Georgia held large training exercises in Georgia in July.


You answered your own question there!


Georgia went in to regain control of the region. And they didn't just go in - they launched a huge artillery barrage against a civilian city.


they launched an artillary barrage against the Russian intel agencies that were in the south along with Russian troops that were already there.


They knew something was going to happen because they intercepted Georgian UAVs above South Ossetia and Abkhazia throughout July. Also the Georgian massed their troops near the breakaway republics since June. Russia has been warning Georgia against any action throughout 2008.


the Georgians massed there troops because as you just said Russia was doing the same thing.


False - sorry where do you dig these "facts" up? Russia said that they will "TARGET" Poland with ICBMs, should Poland host the ABM shield. In the case of the unlikely nuclear exchange with U.S., Poland could also be targeted to neutralize the system.


Not that i should do all your homework But if you fire an interceptor from behind the ICBM you run the risk of

1. destorying the interceptor in the heat plume of the ICBM.
2. pushing the ICBM to a higher tragectory not destorying it.

Its really common sense there. Look at the patriot missle system deployed durring the first gulf war. Every Patriot that was fired was fired for a head to head intercept. why is that? Because the chances of a successfull intercept is like 95% compare to a 5% chance from a chasing intercept.


Please explain how Russia "building an empire"?

they are doing it right now open your eyes. they invaded Georgia Which is not part of russia and neither is s. Ossetia. Russian Troops are still in georgia are they not?

Oh wait Russia just wants control of the oil piplines thru the Caucasus.

I may be an american But atleast i can look at the situation and leave my blind patriotism behind to make an informed decission based on the fact given to me By Russian Media.

And the Russian bash Bush for invading Iraq. What did Putin and his puppet in the presidents office do in Georgia? Can we say hipocrit?


[edit on 9/20/2008 by Mercenary2007]



posted on Sep, 20 2008 @ 09:26 PM
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Originally posted by Mercenary2007
I love it i figured you would jump in here.


I parttake in discussions on which I have some background knowledge, and refrain from posting on topics about which I know little.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
All the things i listed as fact were in articles from Russian media That were posted in threads here on ATS most of the threads you posted in so maybe you should go back and read them..


I have monitored this conflict and the S Ossetia war closely from start to finish. Most Russian articles were posted and translated by me, so I should know what they are saying. You may simply be misinterpreting what they said, and I am trying to clarify it.

For example you said that Russia threated to "USE" nuclear weapons against Poland. The Russian government never made such a statement. What they said is that they would consider "TARGETING" Poland should it host the ABM shield. "USE" and "TARGET" are two critically different words.

As for your other "facts", I understand they may be coming from various analysts who are presenting their opinions of what happened. These opinions are very different from facts, and should not be misinterpreted as such.

There are very few actual "facts" about this war as of yet. There is also what appears to be some fabricated "proof" from both sides. So at this point you most of what is known is speculation.




Originally posted by Mercenary2007
Rush is making a big fuss over 10 interceptors and russia has how many ICBM's?


The fuss is not about some 10 lousy missiles. It is about the bigger picture. In international relations you look at 3 steps ahead of what the other side is doing, and base your decisions on that.

Russia knows what U.S. has in store for its Eastern European allies. The 10 ABM batteries is a first step. A year later it could very well be 50. Five years ahead it could be 1,000. The first step is always the hardest, with many obstacles to overcome. Once U.S. has ABM assets operating on the ground in Polans and Czech Republic, it will be relatively simple to increase the number and perfect the interceptors.

It is hard to deny that NATO is attempting to create a buffer around West Russia. This is becoming very clear now. The ABM shield is part of that buffer, and much like previous actions by NATO it is very likely the first step.

The question is - if ABM shield is as worthless as U.S. says it is, why place it there in the first place and create all this tension?




Originally posted by Mercenary2007
You answered your own question there!


Yes - but the fact that Russia moved a contingent close to S Ossetia in no way proves that Russia organized this war. If one is ready for war doesn't mean one is to blame for starting the war. Russia had a good reason for its cautious actions. Lightly-armed Russian sanctioned peacekeepers were in S Ossetia, and faced dangered if Georgia attacked.

There isn't any factual proof that Russian troops crossed the border prior to August 8th. There is only speculation, but that cannot be reasonably treated as a fact, and should not be relied upon as a fact.




Originally posted by Mercenary2007
they launched an artillary barrage against the Russian intel agencies that were in the south along with Russian troops that were already there.


Again - where is the proof of what you are saying? I have not seen even remotely factual proof to back up anything you just said. What "Russian intel agencies" are your referring to, and where were they based? Where were the "Russian troops"?

You cannot expect people to believe or trsut what you are saying without any sort of factual evidence. If this is your opinion or an opinion of some analyst, then do not pass it off as fact. But if you have any sources with actual proof - then please post them.




Originally posted by Mercenary2007
the Georgians massed there troops because as you just said Russia was doing the same thing.


What came first the chicken or the egg?

It is known that both sides gradually started to pool their troops close to the region since abour February 2008. What is not known is which sides started this. At this point it is impossible to tell.

There are very few actual facts about this war, and too much speculations. There are even fabricated facts. However one pretty solid and documented fact is that on the evening of August 7th Georgia launched a powerful assault on Tskhinvalli, with many civilian casualties. What happened prior to this is at this point nothing more than rumors and speculation.

Saakashvili paved the way for this war, by his militaristic rhetoric since he came to power. He didn't hide his intention to retake the breakaway republics, even by force. This rhetoric is what eventually lead to the military escalation.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
Not that i should do all your homework But if you fire an interceptor from behind the ICBM you run the risk of

1. destorying the interceptor in the heat plume of the ICBM.
2. pushing the ICBM to a higher tragectory not destorying it.


Did you read the link I posted.

I am not any kind of expert on the ABM shield, nor do I pertain to be. I do however rely on knowledgeable analysts, and I trust that the folks at MIT have some credibility on the issue. What I post is based on their findings.

As for the two issues you present above - are you well knowledgeable on how the ABM inteception works? What are you basing these examples on?

I can make a guess that the interceptor is able to intercept the ICBM not from directly behind it, but from below. But I do not know, nor do I say that I know. If you have more information on how the process works please post it - I'll be glad to read it.




Originally posted by Mercenary2007
Its really common sense there. Look at the patriot missle system deployed durring the first gulf war. Every Patriot that was fired was fired for a head to head intercept. why is that? Because the chances of a successfull intercept is like 95% compare to a 5% chance from a chasing intercept.


Do you really think that the patriot system hasn't been improved since 1991? I seriously doubt it. Plus radars play a major factor in the effectiveness of the ABM. From what I understand the radars which will be placed in the Czech Republic are far more powerful than any radars U.S. operated in the Gulf. The new radars allow earlier detection and improved tracking of any ICBM - and it is likely they would greatly improve any interception capabilities.




Originally posted by Mercenary2007
they are doing it right now open your eyes. they invaded Georgia Which is not part of russia


They "intervened" in Georgia, and restored the status quo. If Russia had invaded Georgia, they would have occupied Tbilisi, toppled Saakashvili, and brough in tens of thosands of troops and not a few hundred like they did.

Look at how U.S. occupied Iraq - that is a true "invasion". Russia has already retreated from undisputed Georgian territory.

As for South Ossetia - Russia had sanctioned peacekeepers there for a decade. These peacekeepers were not enough to prevent an attack from Georgia. Not Russia has to increase the number of peacekeepers to prevent any further conflict.

U.S. did much the same thing in Kosovo. On top of that U.S. invaded Iraq and Afghanistan. So if U.S. acting imperialistically too in your opinion? Obviously U.S. has invaded a far greated territory than Russia has. Thus based on your reasoning U.S. has far greater imperial ambitions than does Russia. If that is the case - then the world should be far more worried about U.S. than Russia.

Are you denying this?



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
Russian Troops are still in georgia are they not?


No - they have retreated from undisputed Georgia last week, in full accordance with the signed ceasefire treaty.



Originally posted by Mercenary2007
Oh wait Russia just wants control of the oil piplines thru the Caucasus.


I assume you are talking about the Caspian pipeline that lies through Georgia. If this is the case, why didn't Russia occupy Georgia, when it had the capability to do so?




Originally posted by Mercenary2007
I may be an american But atleast i can look at the situation and leave my blind patriotism behind to make an informed decission based on the fact given to me By Russian Media.


I still do not know which "Russian Media" sources any of your earlier "facts" are derived from.

You may view what you say as your neutral opinion. Fair enough. But presenting issues as "factual" when they are in fact not such - does not amount to a credible arguement.

What you are saying is your opinion derived from opinions and rumors of others. I am not a judge on its neutrality, but I can say that it is not "factual".


Originally posted by Mercenary2007
And the Russian bash Bush for invading Iraq. What did Putin and his puppet in the presidents office do in Georgia? Can we say hipocrit?


U.S. invaded with a force of tens of thousands of soldiers, and completely occupied a sovereign country for over 4 years, toppling its regime. The war resulted in deaths of tens if not hundreds of thousands of civilians.

Russia moved a force of about 1,000 soldiers a maximum of 30 miles into undisputed Georgian territory for a period of 1 month (now withdrawn). It did not topple the Georgian regime. At a climax, it occupied about 5% of territorial Georgia. The conflict resulted in confirmed deaths of about 100-300 Georgian civilians.

You be the judge.

[edit on 20-9-2008 by maloy]




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