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What do Islamic Fundamentalists Want?

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posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:26 PM
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I suppose the point is, Illi--- do you support the death????




posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by Tyriffic
Uhhh, these persons you name were not Christians.

Christians who follow Jesus follow Jesus.

think about it.....................

.........and did Mohamed kill many a man for his faith????
He murdered, raped and tortured many a man for his cause................of purity!!


And these people you name are not Muslims.

Muslims are people who believe in Allah and his Messenger Muhammad. They are good people, noble people who believe in God and his Day of Judgment.

And Muhammad didn't rape anyone, I don't know where you got that blatant remark from, probably from an anti Islamic website.

But yes he did kill and he killed to protect his life and many others.

I'm sure Jesus would do the same if someone came charging him armed to the T and ready to kill him.

It's common sense.



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:28 PM
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Originally posted by Agent47
Very true but I think at some juncture in the future we will have to abandon the cold war idea of "integrity" because...


I think War is Hell and that it should be executed as such when waged against those who commit multiple genocide.

DeltaChaos



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:28 PM
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Illmatic, you have taken my support of what you have mentioned above the wrong way.
If you had taken the time to not be on the offensive and had clicked those little links you would not have thought that I was attacking or questioning what you had said.
Thank you for at least commenting what you did on suicide bombings and what the Qur'an says, for it is indeed what the Qur'an says.




seekerof

[Edited on 21-3-2004 by Seekerof]



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:31 PM
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Originally posted by Illmatic67
And these people you name are not Muslims.


And this post isn't about Muslims. It's about murderous criminals who use Muslims as thier human shield to justify their heinous acts.

DC

[Edited on 21-3-2004 by DeltaChaos]



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:32 PM
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Sorry Seeker, I didn't click on those links. Thanks for your support and sorry but it's comments like these that just get me so mad.


Originally posted by Tyriffic
I suppose the point is, Illi--- do you support the death????


How do I go from pointing out an error in a thread to being asked if I support death?

Please explain that to me because I don't understand it.



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:35 PM
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Originally posted by DeltaChaos

Originally posted by Tyriffic

Originally posted by Illmatic67

Originally posted by Tyriffic

Originally posted by Slayer
That's the same way with fundamentalists of every religion.



This is not true. How many Christians do you actually know who want to kill everyone who does not believe the way they do???


The Crusades, Inquisition, Salem Witch trials, the whole conquest of the New World.

Where's your history book?


Uhhh, these persons you name were not Christians.

Christians who follow Jesus follow Jesus.

think about it...


But think about it...

They professed to believe in Christ. If you asked them if they were Christians, they would undoubtedly tell you they were.

Not only were they Christians, they were fundamentalist, Puritan Christians.

DC



I do not appreciate your silly manipulation of my statement.
Seems you are of the same ilk?!

Quote By T.........and did Mohamed kill many a man for his faith????
He murdered, raped and tortured many a man for his cause................of purity!! End freakin quote.




Those people were not true Christians. How could they be??? How could true believers in Christ drown women for bad dreams???

Tell me how these people were really the Christians of today???

[Edited on 21-3-2004 by Tyriffic]



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:45 PM
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Originally posted by Tyriffic
I do not appreciate your silly manipulation of my statement.
Seems you are of the same ilk?!

Those people were not true Christians. How could they be??? How could true believers in Christ drown women for bad dreams???

Tell me how these people were really the Christians of today???

[Edited on 21-3-2004 by Tyriffic]


The Inquisitors, while wrong, were considered at one time to be among the most pious of Christians.

Those who participated in the Crusades were considered the most holy knights of the Vatican.

Those who carried out the Salem Witch trials were the very founders of this great country.

Whether you consider them to be Christians or not is your opinion. Nothing else. These are the bad Christians that the good Christians have to live with as a part of thier legacy. Maybe it isn't fair, but it is.

Islamic fundamentalists, once eradicated, will be the bad Muslims that the good Muslims will have to accept as a part of their history.

Don't obscure the facts just because you don't like them. Instead, Deny Ignorance!

DeltaChaos


[Edited on 21-3-2004 by DeltaChaos]



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 07:56 PM
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Originally posted by Illmatic67

Originally posted by DeltaChaos

Originally posted by tututkamen
According to the Koran. Jihad is a war and the aim is nothing short of an Islamic World, your choice is either to convert or die, not a lot of options.

Tututkamen



Ummm, that is not correct and you are a fool for believing such ignorance.

It's obvious the both of you have never read the Holy Qur'an. You just believe what the media says. Your just them other people, like them sheep.

According to the Qur'an, there are TWO Jihad's. One is the bigger Jihad and the other is the lesser Jihad.

The bigger and the most important Jihad is the Jihad one has with himself. The battle within, the struggle and perseverance.

The lesser and non important Jihad does require military action but the Qur'an has limits with this Jihad. Only when a Muslim is attacked or is being attacked is when a Muslim can fight. The Qur'an punishes any man who kills any innocent blood.

As a matter of fact, it says in the Qur'an that if you kill an innocent man its as if you killed the whole world and if you save an innocent man its as if you saved the entire world.

And the whole convert or die theory is old too. The Qur'an says Christians, Jews, and Muslims ALL have their reward with God as long as they have faith, good works, believe in the law, and believe in the Last Day.

Only speak what you know.


Well let's see,

Your a fool for calling me one, not to mention rude. But since you broke the ice, your a fool for living in southern Fl.,
and also for believing that your interpretation of the Koran is the only valid one and the only one that all Muslims use.
I am sure enough people have been murdered in the name of Allah, to highlight my point in innocent blood

So blow it out your ear


Tututkamen

Many modern Arab acts of terrorism have been considered an expression of jihad. Two Islamist groups call themselves "Islamic Jihad": Egyptian Islamic Jihad and Palestinian Islamic Jihad. These groups are considered mainstream by millions of supporters within the Islamic world, who see a strong religious justification for a military understanding of the term jihad.

For militant groups within the Islamic cultural sphere, a person who commits suicide as a part of struggle against oppression is considered a shahid - holy martyr - and is held to have earned a place in heaven. Many Muslims disagree with this view, however, saying that even in such circumstances, suicide remains a sin.

Many Muslim Arab clerics encourage suicide bombing and Jihad against the West, mainly against the USA and Israel.[1] Most of these clerics are either sponsored by the Arab governments, or head extremist groups (such as Sheikh Ahmed Yassin of Hamas).

Many Islamic legal rulings view any killings of a civilian nature (whether through combat or any other such militant activity) as unjust, immoral and against the ethics of Islam. However this opinion suggests certain occasions when strategic "suicide bombings" may be permissible on the basis of whether they have been sanctioned as permissible by the local field commander, but this is only during a time of military action and only with regards to military targets.

There is no single position on this issue that all Muslims accept.

Jihad and Combat against non-Muslims

"Jihad has been decreed to repel aggression and to remove obstructions impeding the propagation of Islam in non-Islamic countries." As Lt. Col. M. M. Qureshi points out in his Landmarks of Jihad, "only a war which has an ultimate religious purpose can be termed as jihad." (Shayk Muhammad Abu Zahra, Egyptian member of the Academy of Islamic Research).

There is nothing historically unique about this position, although such clear (and popular) advocacy of forced conversion and proselytization is not permissible according to the laws of Islam. See also the "Reputation and evaluation" section of Crusade for a discussion of how the terms "Crusade" and "Jihad" are perceived differently in the West and the Islamic world.

Many analysts hold that the severe economic and governmental differences between the Islamic world and the rest of the world contribute to fueling this notion of jihad.

en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 08:08 PM
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Originally posted by Illmatic67



And Muhammad didn't rape anyone, I don't know where you got that blatant remark from, probably from an anti Islamic website.

But yes he did kill and he killed to protect his life and many others.

I'm sure Jesus would do the same if someone came charging him armed to the T and ready to kill him.

It's common sense



Yeah, that is why they had such a hard time nailing him to the cross. You have got to be joking me:@@

Tut Tut



posted on Mar, 21 2004 @ 08:16 PM
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Originally posted by Illmatic67
I'm sure Jesus would do the same if someone came charging him armed to the T and ready to kill him.

It's common sense.


Just like he did the Romans that crucified him, I guess. Would that be your example?

Again, your common sense is hindering your ability to recognize historic fact.

DC



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 05:31 AM
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Originally posted by Ocelot

Originally posted by Slayer
That's the same way with fundamentalists of every religion.


Exactly! People seem to forget that just because islamic fundamentalists are the new "evil" in religion.... that all religion are guilty of attrocity and mass murder.


Well, let's see, IAW Islamic teaching, we accept their faith or die. That's according to their book.

Even with the most extreme of Christian teaching, you either accept Christ or you do not. You don't get killed. Sure, the peaceful little Buddhists have a propensity for killing Christians in a certain part of China, but that is isolated. Taoists, Hindus...no, doesn't seem to be another bunch like the Muslims.
The "Every religion has their psychos!" excuse is merely a denial of the truth and danger.



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 05:41 AM
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Originally posted by Illmatic67

Originally posted by Tyriffic
Uhhh, these persons you name were not Christians.

Christians who follow Jesus follow Jesus.

think about it.....................

.........and did Mohamed kill many a man for his faith????
He murdered, raped and tortured many a man for his cause................of purity!!


And these people you name are not Muslims.

Muslims are people who believe in Allah and his Messenger Muhammad. They are good people, noble people who believe in God and his Day of Judgment.

And Muhammad didn't rape anyone, I don't know where you got that blatant remark from, probably from an anti Islamic website.

But yes he did kill and he killed to protect his life and many others.

I'm sure Jesus would do the same if someone came charging him armed to the T and ready to kill him.

It's common sense.



Common sense to you, but you are not God, and neither was Mohammad, Christ was. They DID try and move against Him, on more than one occasion, and He moved through their midst and out of their reach without them even seeing Him. When it was time for Him to die for you, He even repaired the ear chopped off a Roman guard.



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 05:48 AM
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Even with the most extreme of Christian teaching, you either accept Christ or you do not. You don't get killed. Sure, the peaceful little Buddhists have a propensity for killing Christians in a certain part of China, but that is isolated. Taoists, Hindus...no, doesn't seem to be another bunch like the Muslims.


Check the post above concerning Christians who have killed in the name of Christ. Christianity has had its fill of people who want to kill because someone won't believe what they do. These people may not have been Christian to you, but they sure as hell preached that they were.



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 05:49 AM
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As far as the crusadors being Christian, that is not necessarily true. Seeing how the Church had the book and taught the masses what they wanted the masses to know, it is difficult to throw blame on those who weren't allowed to read for themselves. As well, many soldiers were mercenaries, not Christian at all, but those who wwere willing to go for the promised benefit of rape, murder, pillage and burn.

Regardless, there is no threat from what happened a thousand years ago. There is, however, a threat from a belief that has proven itself to be very dangerous for those neighjboring its clutches, or worse yet, to be of a different faith within its borders.



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 05:51 AM
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Are you claiming that Islam is a bad thing then because of the type of people it produces? or are you just saying that one type of Islamic belief is bad?



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 06:16 AM
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Islam, as it stands now, is the Christian faith as it was 500 years ago.
Islamic fundamentalism is the Jewish faith as it was 2000BCE.

Islam is, quite simply, stuck in the past.

What do the fundamentalists want? Quite simple really. They want everyone to worship their god and if you don't worship him then you die.
The fact, that by using fear, they are forcing everyone to worship Satan, seems to fly right over their stupid heads.



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 08:25 AM
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Originally posted by Leveller
Islam is, quite simply, stuck in the past.

What do the fundamentalists want? Quite simple really. They want everyone to worship their god and if you don't worship him then you die.
The fact, that by using fear, they are forcing everyone to worship Satan, seems to fly right over their stupid heads.


That's what I was thinking. Give Islam another 1500 years and they'll be capitulating to the capitalist regime just like the Christians... another 2500 and they'll be running it - like the Jews.

Do I remember a passage in the bible that stated that if you were coerced by fear or force to deny the one true God, you are required to fight against that force? Let me know. I'm looking...

DeltaChaos



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 01:25 PM
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Jesus being cruficied was part of his plan.

So, if someone came charging him to kill him Jesus would have to react in a defensive way because Jesus needs to die on the cross, not by some insane man with a sword.

People have killed in the name of Yahweh and Jesus, so what is your point?

Don't just point out that people have killed in the name of Allah and not mention the other people.


Thomas, Jesus is not God.

"Only in his hometown a prophet without honor" -Jesus.



posted on Mar, 22 2004 @ 01:34 PM
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Originally posted by Illmatic67
Don't just point out that people have killed in the name of Allah and not mention the other people.


What I am pointing out is not that people have killed in the name of Allah, but that they are doing so right now! And I am one of their intended targets. It seems you are seeing this from a historical perspective, while I refer to current events.

To my knowledge, no one else wants to kill me other than these people.

DC




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