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Originally posted by AlexG141989
You are thinking of God in human terms, which he isn't. God knows you better than you know yourself, so if by chance one time you did choose the health food, God would not have been wrong, because he knew you were about to do that before you knew yourself, but that still doesn't mean you didn't choose. You also have to remember that God is beyond time and space (he created it), he isn't waiting for you to make your decision, he already knows your choice, but through your free will, you still made the decision.
I don't feel like explaining it again, so heres a quote from somebody at another site, who explained it better than I did.
If there is DESTINY..then no matter what choice you would have made...you were still going to wind up in the same exact end position to wherever it was long decided you were going to end up. So you merely had the illusion of choice which affected nothing of the outcome...so in essence you never really had one..because to have true choice...the outcome must be unknown and have causation. If there is destiny...there is no causation...hence GOD is then omniscient.
CaptainG0705 you are obviously captain of a sinking ship. The ship is called "the Atheist." Fellow crew include AlexG and Dave420. Your staunch, stagnant, stubborn atheism will get you nowhere. All that awaits you is the stone cold grave. You have rejected heaven that Jesus offered you and replaced it with your cerebral wanderings. You feel that science has all the answers and foolishly forget that humanity has limitations. Death is one of them. Life energy is another. Humanity cannot create life from inanimate objects. For you CaptainG to suggest that some day science may discover a way shows that you are clueless as to what life is. Life comprises of the supernatural married to the natural. The body without the supernatural spirit is dead. This is not disputable. It is fact! You obviously had a crippled education if you feel that all revolves around the laws of matter!!
As for free will; of course we have it! The choice is yours to study hard or loaf around; to do good deeds or bad ones. It is irrelevant whether or not God knows what the outcome will be. He did not influence your decision. The OP must be envious of God's astounding supernatural ability. He obviously did not understand the Adam and Eve story. Humanity should explore their surroundings, develop their understanding but should not try and be God. Humanity has limitations. If a cheetah and a human had a 200 metre race, who do you think would win? A human's speed has its limit. Furthermore a human's cerebrum has its limit. A foolish atheist may ask: well who made God? God is supernatural. You cannot know what God knows. He is mysterious and beyond our understanding; but He loves us. If that is not good enough for the atheist and they persist in knowing intimate details about Him then the atheist can go to hell. While roasting, they can discuss with all the horrible murdering godless people of time past such as Adolph Hitler and his cohorts. There will be no God in hell to ridicule. There will be no Christ to laugh at and to question whether He ever existed. Since you rejected God; He will reject you, and you will go to the place where God is not: hot and hopeless hell.
Right on, I understand your opinion. I am fully aware of what men have done to the word, how else do you think the world be deceived. To say they were primitive men, because they supposedly attributed "Omni+" to the name I don't quite understand. Should we apply these same titles to George Lucas because he spoke of "the force".
That is not true, that is purely human thinking within the realm of space/time. Say you made a decision, and then you came back from the future to see yourself make that decision, the future you would know the outcome of your decision, that doesn't mean that you didn't make that decision.
Originally posted by logician magician
I'm pretty much an agnostic scientific determinist, replying how I am exactly because of what I just read, and my prior experience manifesting into what I'm about to type...
Still, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to imagine that God is omnipotent and can therefore give us free will while at the same time knowing exactly what we will do with that free will. Just because the universe is determined/known from Gods view (He created the damn thing supposedly), doesn't mean it's determined from our view (as much as some (I) tend to believe [i.e. have faith in that what is happening is determined by causality] because it's the best we can understand from our insignificant perspective in this obscure corner of the universe).
"God" has no limits. He is omnipotent. He can do anything. It's impossible to disprove or prove. It's beyond the scope of science, logic, or reasoning. It's based purely on faith and belief - two things that don't have to be backed by much evidence, if any.
Originally posted by AlexG141989
Yes it does mean I didn't make the decision, because I was going to make that decision anyway...
Originally posted by letthereaderunderstand
reply to post by AlexG141989
Anyway, I'm waiting for the "I am Omni" quote, that you are basing this assumption off of.
If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
Am I a God at hand, saith the Lord, and not a God afar off? Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the Lord. Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the Lord.
Originally posted by Torsten
Congratulations, you have just stumbled upon the end all be all argument that a theist can never answer. I have asked preachers, pastors, reverends, priests, nuns, etc. that very question and never gotten a straight answer other than "God is mysterious and you should just...blah". The largest hole in the Bible is the simplest application of logic there is on that subject.
Originally posted by fmcanarney
I went through alcoholism treatment thirty three years ago.
They had bibles in our rooms, as it was a Catholic Hospital.
I got angry and was throwing my things in my suitcase to leave.
Their bible fell upon the bed and was open at this passage:
"Who has woe? Who has Sorrow?, Who has Contentions? Who has babbling? Who has wounds without cause? Who has redness of eyes?
They that tarry long at the wine; they that seek mixed drinks and strong wine.
Look not upon the wine when it is red, when it gives its colour in the cup, when it moves aright.
In the end it bites like a serpent and stings like a viper.
Thine eyes shall behold strange things, and thy heart shall utter perverse things.
Yes you will be like one who lies down in the midst of the sea, or as he that lieth on the top of a mast.
They have beaten me, thou shall say, and i felt it not, they have stricken me and i was not sick.When shall I awake? I will seek yet another drink."
God has spoken to me.
Needless to say I stayed and completed treatment and have not touched a drink since then.