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I am proud of my Christian faith. And it informs what I do. And I don’t think that people of any faith background should be prohibited from debating in the public square.
But I am a strong believer in the separation of church and state...
By the way, I support it not just for the state but also for the church, because that maintains our religious independence and that’s why we have such a thriving religious life.
But what I also think is that we are under obligation in public life to translate our religious values into moral terms that all people can share, including those who are not believers. And that is how our democracy’s functioning, will continue to function. That’s what the founding fathers intended.
In 2005, Biden told The News Journal (Wilmington, Del.): "This is a nation founded on the idea of the separation of church and state. After 200 years, why the hell would you want to start messing with that?" Biden also stated that his religion is "part of my spirituality, part of my identity." However, Biden supports abortion rights and federal financing for embryonic stem-cell research, stances that run in opposition to those of his church.
In an interview with Beliefnet in September 2007, McCain said that "the Constitution established the United States of America as a Christian nation," and added that "the lady that holds her lamp beside the golden door doesn't say, 'I only welcome Christians.' We welcome the poor, the tired, the huddled masses. But when they come here, they know that they are in a nation founded on Christian principles." During his 2000 presidential campaign, McCain said the nation was founded on "Judeo-Christian values" but added that "political intolerance by any political party is neither a Judeo-Christian nor an American value."
Shortly after taking office as governor in 2006, Sarah Palin sent an e-mail message to Paul E. Riley, her former pastor in the Assembly of God Church, which her family began attending when she was a youth. She needed spiritual advice in how to do her new job, said Mr. Riley, who is 78 and retired from the church.
“She asked for a biblical example of people who were great leaders and what was the secret of their leadership,” Mr. Riley said.
He wrote back that she should read again from the Old Testament the story of Esther, a beauty queen who became a real one, gaining the king’s ear to avert the slaughter of the Jews and vanquish their enemies. When Esther is called to serve, God grants her a strength she never knew she had.
Mr. Riley said he thought Ms. Palin had lived out the advice as governor, and would now do so again as the Republican Party’s vice-presidential nominee.
Gov. Sarah Palin used state funds in June when she traveled from Juneau to Wasilla to speak to graduating evangelical students and urge them to fan out through Alaska "to make sure God's will be done here."
State records show that Palin submitted a travel authorization for a quick round-trip visit to attend the June 8 graduation of the Master's Commission program (see below) at the Wasilla Assembly of God, the church where she was baptized at age 12. The only other item on the agenda for that trip was a "One Lord Sunday" service involving a network of Mat-Su Christian churches earlier that morning at the Wasilla sports complex.
"What I need to do is strike a deal with you guys as you go out throughout Alaska -- I can do my part in doing things like working really, really hard to get a natural gas pipeline." Palin said. "Pray about that also. I think God's will has to be done, in unifying people and companies to get that gas line built, so pray for that.” …. "As I'm doing my job, let's strike this deal. Your job is going to be: to be out there, reaching the people, (the) hurting people throughout Alaska, and we can work together to make sure God's will be done here."
Palin considers herself a born-again conservative Christian. She supports teaching creationism in the public schools, outlawing nearly all abortions (even in cases of rape or incest) and prohibiting same-sex marriage.
"I'm not going to tell you who to vote for," he said. "But if you vote for this particular person (Kerry), I question your salvation -- I'm sorry."
"This nation is a Christian nation!" Pepper said last fall in a recorded sermon. "God will not be mocked! I don't care what atheists say! God will not be mocked! ... Judgment Day is coming. Where do you stand?"
One year discipleship … Training today’s young people to be tomorrow’s leaders. … There’s a substantial amount of pressure on them, so that they are pressed into the Lord… I foresee having Master’s Commission graduates running companies, being involved in government, being councilmen or congressmen, Senators, leading churches
“You know this is good for you, even though it doesn’t feel good.”
“We’re spreading all around”
“I want to bring a keener perspective to public schools”
“The Master’s Commission, A General Call to Character” is not just another church program. It’s a one-year, put your life on hold, give everything you have adventure that will radically change the way you look at the purpose of your life. It’s not a reform school or a ministry training school. It’s a year to focus entirely upon God and your relationship with Him and allow Him to access every area of your life. It is not for those who want to become better Christians, but for those who want to become effective tools in the hand of their God, no matter where He calls them. It is for those man and women between the ages of 18 and 25 who earnestly desire to be vessels of honor, sanctified useful to the Master and prepared to do any good work.
But a sense of proportion should also guide those who police the boundaries between church and state. Not every mention of God in public is a breach to the wall of separation - context matters.
Originally posted by jamie83
First, the title of the thread is misleading.
The 1st Amendment does not describe a separation of church and state. It says that Congress can't pass a law establishing a religion.
The Establishment Clause of the First Amendment prohibits the establishment of a national religion by the Congress or the preference of one religion over another, or religion over non-religion.
Originally posted by LLoyd45
I fail to see why a persons religious beliefs or convictions would be of any real consequence..
Originally posted by jamie83
The 1st Amendment does not describe a separation of church and state.
So it is erroneous to expect elected government officials be required to leave their religious beliefs at the door when performing their duties.
1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Originally posted by Open_Minded Skeptic
[So an elected legislator, or president or whatever can be opposed to gay marriage to the core of their being and belief, but they cannot use those beliefs to deny equal protection under law to gay couples.
On Dec. 20, Palin signed a bill that calls for an advisory vote on whether there should be a constitutional amendment denying benefits to same-sex couples. The vote, set for a special election on April 3, will be nonbinding but is intended to help guide legislators, Palin has said.
Obama Breaks 'God Talk' Tradition
The junior Illinois senator stood in the pulpit of a Pentecostal church Sunday to challenge the partisan religious perception by telling some 4,000 worshippers that faith “plays every role” in his life.
“It’s what keeps me grounded. It’s what keeps my eyes set on the greatest of heights,” Obama told members of the Redemption World Outreach Center in Greenville, S.C., according to The Associated Press.
Faith, he said, is “what propels me to do what I do and when I am down it’s what lifts me up.”
...God “is with us and He wants us to do the right thing,”...
...When people work together, there is “nothing that can stop us because that’s God’s intention.”...
...Obama concluded Sunday’s address from the pulpit by asking the members of Redemption church to pray for him and his family to remain on the right path....
“Sometimes you can become fearful, you can become vain, sometimes you can seek power for power’s sake,” Obama confessed, according to NBC. “Pray that I can be an instrument of God,” he pleaded.
Obama Reaches Out To Religious Voters: Senator Has Made Religion A Signature Part Of His Campaign
Obama, the junior senator from Illinois, has made religion a signature part of his campaign through his own public appearances in places where Democrats rarely venture, and a faith-based voter mobilization, topped by forums in Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina that could prove key to organizing.
"I don't think a Democratic presidential candidate has come close to doing anything like this before," said Mark Silk, director of the Leonard E. Greenberg Center for the Study of Religion in Public Life at Trinity College in Hartford, Conn. "If you are going to parse the different dimensions of how a presidential candidate does religion, he's doing them all."
First of all, faith would play a major and not a minor role. Building on the Bush Administration's faith-based initiatives, Obama plans to establish a new and improved and more powerful Council that will be "a critical part" of his administration, either at cabinet-level or directly under his own supervision.
Huffington Post: Obama, God And Governance
CLAIM VS FACT
•social conservative: mixed. Opposes gay marriage, BUT vetoed a bill
that would have denied benefits to employees in same-sex relationships
(said she did this because it was unconstitutional).
•pro-creationism: mixed. Supports it, BUT did nothing as Governor to
•“Pro-life”: mixed. Knowingly gave birth to a Down’s syndrome baby
BUT declined to call a special legislative session on some pro-life
When asked what the American public really needs to know about Palin, one asserted, "She's honest as the day is long, and that is a unique personality trait for a politician these days."
Originally posted by The Cyfre
I don't believe that Obama or McCain are very religious to be honest.
A spokesman said that McCain “has a 17-year voting record of supporting efforts to overturn Roe vs. Wade. He does that currently, and will continue to do that as president.”
Sarah Palin, on the other hand, seems to be pretty much "in the tank" for God
I'll do all I can to see every baby is created with a future and potential. The legislature should do all it can to protect human life.
Originally posted by LLoyd45
If this is indeed the case, I fail to see why a persons religious beliefs or convictions would be of any real consequence..
In fact, requiring elected officials to NOT consider their religious beliefs would be preventing the free exercise of their religion
"I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, 'George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan.' And I did, and then God would tell me, 'George go and end the tyranny in Iraq,' and I did."
Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
What is concerning about him praying that he be an instrument of God? That has nothing to do with LAW, right?
Well, I still believe it’s a good idea to have a partnership between the White House and grassroots groups, both faith-based and secular. But it has to be a real partnership – not a photo-op. That’s what it will be when I’m President. I’ll establish a new Council for Faith-Based and Neighborhood Partnerships. The new name will reflect a new commitment. This Council will not just be another name on the White House organization chart – it will be a critical part of my administration.
Originally posted by Dronetek
Once again, one wonders where the media is. Their too busy sniffing out all the information on every church Palin has gone to.